Liner for fireplace ?

[Bobdude1]

1St time poster, although I've read a LOT of stuff on here, so decided to join up. Wow! this forum is filled with a lot of great info.
Back story...House built 1735. 4 unlined brick fireplaces, 25' center chimney divided into 4 separate flues. 1 flue unusable (as far as we know) and 1 unknown behind a wall. 1 I put in a Timberwolf Economizer 2100 and 6" liner-works great. The last is a giant 41hx55w cooking fireplace. We would like to keep it a working fireplace (The Wife definitely). I researched and for the size of the opening I need a 16" liner, however my flue on top is rectangular only 11"w x 16"long , so a conventional 16"liner wont fit. (I realize I'd have to cut out my damper and possibly some bricks to fit the 16" and I'm ok with that)I've been told a couple different things:
1) Get a 16" round and ovalize it to fit-Which I doubt would work as it would size it too long lengthwise??
2) Get a smaller sized (12 or 13") round liner and use a increaser/reducer to match a 16" ?
3) Get 2- 8" liners and terminate them at the damper
4) Have a concrete cast in place liner done-Very cost prohibitive
5) Get an insert-The wife REALLY doesn't want that because she wants the ambiance and likes seeing the old brickwork of the chimney
6) Don't use it-NOT an option unless we ABSOLUTELY can't use it
I'm thinking option #2 or #3??
Thanks for your patience and time and letting me join up.

 

[begreen]

For that age of a house investigate to see if there is any wood in contact with this chimney all the way up through the house. If so, the liners must be insulated. It would also be good to run a camera down each flue to see if there is any wood exposed in the flue. Yes, they did this sometime back then.

 

[Bobdude1]

Thanks. Verified this. That was my biggest worry when we moved in. We're good. It's just unlined and when I went to clean it this year a lot of mortar chips were loose, so I wanna line it and not take any chances. If I chip a couple bricks away at the smoke shelf, I might be able to actually climb up in there and take a gander. It's pretty obvious these flues have had work done before.

 

[bholler]

Thanks. Verified this. That was my biggest worry when we moved in. We're good. It's just unlined and when I went to clean it this year a lot of mortar chips were loose, so I wanna line it and not take any chances. If I chip a couple bricks away at the smoke shelf, I might be able to actually climb up in there and take a gander. It's pretty obvious these flues have had work done before.

2 won't work like a 16" liner. It will work like an 11 or 12" liner so nothing gained by doing it that way.

3. 2 8" liners don't equal a 16" liner at all so that won't work.

Is there a way to rework the top of the chimney to allow for a 16" liner? Could a rectangular liner fit?

Big liners like that are very expensive. And finishing them off at the bottom is difficult and time consuming. I would strongly consider setting a freestanding stove in the fireplace. That would allow you to still see the brick work but actually get some efficency

 

[Bobdude1]

Thanks. Yeah, the reducer thing seemed kinda weird to me. Wasn't too sure on the 2 8" liners acting as a 16. I can chop away brick on one side to make it work if I have to, but was trying to avoid that if I could. Fitting it at the bottom is still my biggest hurdle.
I'm trying to get the wife to consider the stove route. MUCH easier. 1 6 or 8" liner and it's done.

 

[begreen]

Rockford sells a 10" x 15" flex liner @ $66/ft.

 

[bholler]

Rockford sells a 10" x 15" flex liner @ $66/ft.

He needs about 225 square inches of flue volume though. That liner is only 150. If it is 25' you can reduce volume by about 10%. But I am sure that isn't smooth wall so you loose 3% for correlated liner. I doubt it will work

 

[Bobdude1]

It seems to be I guess I gotta shave some brick and make a 16" work. I kinda thought the other suggestions were off, but wanted to check in with people who seem to know. Again, thanks.
Bob

 

[begreen]

He needs about 225 square inches of flue volume though. That liner is only 150. If it is 25' you can reduce volume by about 10%. But I am sure that isn't smooth wall so you loose 3% for correlated liner. I doubt it will work

The current chimney is only 171 sq in. Not sure how well it works, but it sounds like it's been that way for more than a couple of centuries unless it has been reworked and now is restricted.

however my flue on top is rectangular only 11"w x 16"long

Have you ever had a fire in this large fireplace? If yes, did smoke spill out into the room?

 

[bholler]

The current chimney is only 171 sq in. Not sure how well it works, but it sounds like it's been that way for more than a couple of centuries.

It possibly was but it was more likely rebuilt from the roofline or attic floor up and downsized at that point. We see it all the time.

 

[Bobdude1]

The current chimney is only 171 sq in. Not sure how well it works, but it sounds like it's been that way for more than a couple of centuries unless it has been reworked and now is restricted.

Have you ever had a fire in this large fireplace? If yes, did smoke spill out into the room?

Yes, and occasionally we did get smoke, but not all the time.
It does appear that the top was reworked at some point, as there are a clay liners going from the crown down about 4 feet or so. Our inspector said it looked like someone did attempt to line it. Looking down past that with my camera (6' lead), I can see where the flue gets larger and it appears the brick was parged at one time, but I can see a lot of mortar and bare bricks.

 

[Bobdude1]

Well, took a break away from it due to work and today got back in there. I cut out part of the damper, now I can almost fit myself in there. Up on roof top, I can't cut any brick out as there's only 2 bricks between each flue opening, so that kinda scares me. Looking up from inside, without removing some brick from the back wall, I have no room for the 16" liner either. HVAC guy at work said they make special fans for smoky fireplaces and MAYBE I could use one with a smaller liner instead???
Fireplace opening is 52" wide and 41" high at the front.