I recently had a Level 2 inspection performed, and saw missing mortar and gaps between many of the clay tiles in the chimney of my circa 1926 wood burning fireplace. In addition, the corbelled smoke chamber needs to be parged. Two companies are recommending a stainless steel liner, though one says they will remove all of the existing clay tile before installing a round liner while the other says they would leave the tile and install a rectangular liner. At this point, I'm pretty confused. I'm also wondering whether I should be considering an option like Heatshield instead. Thoughts?
Liner Quandary
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Well to know if the tiles need removed we would need to know the size of the fireplace opening and the inside measurements of the existing liner. The smoke chamber will need done regardless of which way you go for the liner both for performance and to tie the liner in to the smoke chamber. I personally am not impresses by heatsheild i have seen a fair number of those applications fail and delaminate. But if your liners are not cracked and you only need joints filled it may be a good option.
I would first want to know why they want to bust out the existing tiles. It seems to me if one company is ok putting a rigid rectangular liner down, the other should be able to fit a round one down without busting the tiles out. Personally if it were me I would go with a rigid rectangular liner. Others will chime in shortly I'm sure.
To get the required volume to make the fireplace work.
Round liners cost allot less and work allot better that is why i would go with round. Once you figure in the cost of break out the price would probably be fairly close. But to know what is needed we need to know the dimensions. Also if you break out the liner you will have room for insulation which in most cases is required by code.
I would say that before you commit to either option i would consider an insert and liner attached to it. Relining a fireplace for use as an open fireplace can get pretty expensive and you will still have a very inefficient heating appliance. If you are aware of this and still want your open fireplace go for it but i think you should consider all options first.
I don't believe either company took measurements before recommending their respective approaches. The place that wants to go with a rectangular liner say they use National and Homesaver. Assuming the correct dimensions for draw were used for both rectangular and round, is one preferred over the other?
The tech didn't spot any cracks in the tiles during the inspection.
Should I be considering a cast-in-place liner?
Well if they didn't take measurements to determine required size of the liner you should not use either company but i would bet they did. Round drafts much better is cheaper and easier to clean so that would be my choice.
You can consider them sure I don't like them personally but do the research and make your decision.
Thanks. And what do you recommend in terms of a liner brand (s), grade of steel, and and rigid or flexible?
We aren't looking at doing this for the heating as much as the enjoyment factor. In terms of cost, yes, it's pricey. I'm being quoted roughly $4000-$4500 for the liner and parging. (Sorry, if prices aren't supposed to be discussed here.) I just want to do what's needed to make the chimney safe to use now and long term for the least outlay of money.
Where/when did they state the "wasn't enough volume"??
Square vs round-
Who says cheaper is better?
If they're talking round flex, I'll go with ridged any day!
They didn't but the only reason to break out is to have room for a large enough liner to get the needed volume
Round is better plain and simple. Smoke moves through it much smoother and faster. Therefore better draft and less buildup. We are not talking rigid vs flex neither said they would use rigid. But honestly i use heavy wall flex and it is every bit as durable as rigid. and it is much easier to install and does not have the seams that are prone to failure. So yes for the same quality product the cheaper option is better
I have to ask: Is a new liner truly necessary when there are gaps between the clay tiles due to deteriorated mortar? The gaps are relatively small and there's brick behind there.
By code absolutely. You can risk it yes but there is one layer of protection between a chimney fire and your house that is compromised so that decision is up to you. Another thing to consider is whether or not you have the required clearance from the outside of that masonry structure to any combustible material. For an internal chimney it would need to be 2" for an exterior one you need 1". So if you don't have that clearance and have a compromised liner i would say yes it is absolutely necessary. But again it is your decision.
Smoked
Feeling the Heat
$4,000 to $5,000 you can have a nice insert and an insulated liner. With the large flame view windows in modern EPA stoves you can have your cake and eat it too. Very enjoyable, efficient and fairly environmentally friendly. Maybe find a local stove shop that does some demo burns and check it out. The sounds of the fire are muffled a bit but the radiant heat through the glass is wonderful!
I would also recommend going to a fireplace / stove shop. You might be surprised with the huge viewing area of some of the inserts. These would also have epa secondary burn technology which has its own unique display of upside down fire. If you have never seen it, it is mesmerizing. Inserts would just need an insulated liner dropped down and connected. It might even be cheaper than all the work required. You would then be able to heat as well as enjoy the fire show and would use less wood and be easier to control the fire.
Pour insulation around it. That is what we do almost all the time for fireplace installs anyway. And have you ever worked with heavy wall liner it is totally different. Not much movement even when it is wrapped. even with light wall when it is wrapped it reduces the movement allot. Regardless in a fireplace install how ever it is insulated there will not be to much room for movement so that is not an issue. But i do agree that when i clean an uninsulated light wall liner in an insert there is allot of movement and it can be disconcerting. But we don't do that type of install
Understood.
I was told the stainless steel liner comes with a lifetime warranty, and the installation is guaranteed for five years. Is that typical for the installation?
By installation guarantee what do they mean. We will fix any problem due to faulty installation for life. But other than that i dont know what type of warantee on the install they would be giving
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