Lopi Endeavor getting up to temp

[GrumpyOldMan]

Greetings all,

First I must say this is a very infomative site, and much appreciated.
This is my first year wood burning so I am very much a newbie.
I live in North Eastern Indiana.
My stove model is a Lopi Endeavor. It was installed by the dealer, and I have no complaints about the installation.
The manual is a little lacking in operation tips.

I guess what I need is a "sanity check".

We have a lot of Dead Ash trees , that have fallen or have blown over due to a very wet summer.
I have been "Salvaging" these and using them for Firewood. I do try to avoid the stuff that has been down too long or is punky
or pulpy.

This stove runs great and I can control it well, once it gets to temp.
My biggest problem is getting that good hot fire established on the initial fire up.

I think my wood is borderline wet. It tests around 18% to 15% with 2 different meters.
No matter how I stack it, it just seems to take about an hour to 1.5 hours to get the stove top temp to 500 to 600 degrees.
After I get there, I can let it burn down to a nice bed of coals and maintain a stove top temp of 400 to 450 easily.
I am using the inferno magnetic stove top thermostat and an IR gun to check the stove top temp.
That temp seems to work quite well in keeping our 2000 sq ft home around 72 to 73 degrees.
I think I need drier wood for the initial start?

I usually judge how clean the fire is by looking at the top of the chimney, if I only see heat waves or heat waves and very light grey smoke,
I believe my fire to be burning clean. The only time it smokes a lot is during fire up.

My question is how do you guys get your stoves up to temp quickly?
And am I correct in my thinking that a nice orange/blue coal bed does produce better heat than when the flames are roaring?
If I run the stove top at 350 to 450 when the load is mostly cals and very little flame or smoke , I am surely not making creosote, correct?

Sorry for such a long first post , but I wanted to get as much information out there right up front.
Any tips will be appreciated.

 

[begreen]

If you are burning ash and testing the wood moisture on the fresh face of a resplit piece of wood, then it's unlikely the wood is at fault. 30-45min for the stovetop to get hot is not too unusual. You could add some smaller pieces of wood at start up to get it hotter faster.

Once the fire is at the coaling stage there is no smoke and no creosote worries with the 350-450º stove top.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Thank You begreen!
I thought I was correct in the coaling assumption... just needed some input from an experienced person.
I did not resplit the wood before checking, just the face of several splits.
I will resplit a few and then test again... Thanks

 

[begreen]

The most accurate reading will be at room temp of about 70º. Bring the wood in for a day, then split in half and test on the freshly exposed face of wood. Push in the pins hard to make good contact with the wood.

 

[Woody Stover]

I did not resplit the wood before checking, just the face of several splits.

Since the surface of the splits will be drier than the interior, you should test some large splits that have been brought to room temp for a couple days, then re-split. Test in the center of the fresh split face. Wood that is cold will test false low moisture.
That stove is a step-top model, correct? Is your stove top meter on the front lower step, directly on top of the firebox? It appears that the upper step has a convective gap between the firebox and convective top, and wouldn't give a true stove temp.
If you have single-wall connector pipe out of the flue exit, a magnetic surface flue meter, placed 18" or so above the flue exit, will give you more immediate feedback as to what the fire is doing; The stove top will lag behind to some degree. With experience, you'll also get good at assessing the burn by just looking at it. Observing the flue meter, you'll find that at a certain temp you will start to see the secondary begin to fire (flame is fueled by the oxygen coming out of the tubes.) Then you can cut the air gradually in increments, but not so much that it kills the secondary burn. With dry wood, you can cut the air more and sooner, yet the re-burn will be maintained. The goal is lazy flame coming off the wood, with a good secondary burn.
With dry wood in my SIL's secondary stove, we see stove top temps around 700.

 

[spudman99]

Your wood is probably too wet. Not indicated in your initial post is when you cut and secured your wood. Ash will dry pretty quick but needs at least a full summer and preferably 1 year after it is bucked into rounds, split into pieces, stacked off the ground and top covered. A dead ash tree will still retain ample moisture inside. I suspect you bucked up and split the wood within the last 90 days -- in which case you are burning wood that is too wet.

Like above, bring a split inside and put it near the stove. Take it outside tomorrow after work, split the piece and then test the middle of that split for your more accurate reading. Post back your results.

 

[bholler]

In addition to what everyone else said. Switch to measuring exhaust temps. It is a much better way to run the stove it responds much faster and tells you what you are putting into the chimney

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

I have had the wood inside for more than 24hrs... I took a few outside and resplit and used the meter... they were from 19 to 22 %
I found that interesting. The stove pipe going up to and through the wall is double walled pipe. Spudman is very close... as this batch was done in the last 6 months. I know it needs to season longer... but dead ash seems to dry fairly quickly.
Once I have a good coal bed... I can put a a quarter round of approximately a 5" log in there and it will catch nearly immediately.
I think begreen has me on the right path... The size of the initial kindling "starter load...
If I use real small stuff... not enough heat... if I use too big (say 1/8 round) it takes forever.
Tonight I started one with about 2" splits ... Log cabin style , stacked close together , and it was up to 450 degrees in about 30 min...
best I have ever done.
Again I thank everyone for their input... everyone was correct... it's the combination I needed to figure out.
This is the BEST site for good info.... Thanks!

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

I forgot to say Spudman... very good call...
And beholler... I agree... and much thanks for your insight , but at this time I do not have a method of measuring the exhaust temps... I believe with a double wall pipe I need to insert a probe or something? so for now I need to use stove top temps and work with that

 

[Woody Stover]

I have had the wood inside for more than 24hrs... I took a few outside and resplit and used the meter... they were from 19 to 22 %

Were those some of your biggest splits? 19% is good, 22% may require a little longer burn-in to get the secondary firing well.

 

[begreen]

I forgot to say Spudman... very good call...
And beholler... I agree... and much thanks for your insight , but at this time I do not have a method of measuring the exhaust temps... I believe with a double wall pipe I need to insert a probe or something? so for now I need to use stove top temps and work with that

If going by stove top temps, use your eyes too. Try to close down the air fairly quickly as soon as secondary combustion starts. The stove top could still be fairly cool at this point. It takes time for the mass of the stove to heat up. Encouraging secondary combustion will heat up the stove top quicker.

 

[spudman99]

Burning less than ideal wood is certainly possible, just leads to less than desirable results. You can use a few 2x4 lumber, cut or split down in size to use for kindling or for adding heat into the firebox so it is not totally reliant on damp splits. Adding 1 or so to each load will probably help you get better results. Next year you will have a much easier time in getting your stove to settle in. Stay online here to read, learn and post your thoughts and you will get there.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Many Thanks too all for suggestions... I am getting better at getting the stove up to temp quickly. Smaller stuff to get a decent bed of coals,
is a huge help.
I have found that once the stove top gets around 450 degrees... if I shut the primary down to 75% to 50% she will be at 600 in short order.
I was amazed that less primary made it burn hotter.
And I think next year will be netter as I will have some better seasoned wood by then.

 

[Woody Stover]

I was amazed that less primary made it burn hotter.

What happens is that instead of the smoke being burned instantly by the flames on the wood, and that heat going up the flue due to the air being open further, when you cut the air the smoke is burned by the secondary in the top of the box, and because there's less air going through the stove, more heat can be extracted before it goes up the flue.
When you get truly dry wood, this works even better.

 

[weatherguy]

Now you're getting it, keep the heat in the box and not up the flue.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Yes, Thanks to all of you guys... I think I am beginning to understand it.
I don't need a firebox full of flames to get good usable heat.
As Long as I can go outside and just see heat waves or just very light smoke, I think I am doing OK.
However I think I may invest in a flu thermometer as well. with double wall pipe on the inside of the house... I Think I need a probe type.

 

[Woody Stover]

I think I may invest in a flu thermometer as well. with double wall pipe on the inside of the house... I Think I need a probe type.

Right. A magnetic surface meter won't give you a useful reading on double-wall, you need a probe meter.

 

[spudman99]

Stick around and keep posting your results as you climb the learning ladder. We all benefit from your experiences and also love to hear success stories and pictures of course !

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

I am getting better at using less wood for my desired heat (thanks to this site) !
By raking the coals forward before putting more wood in, I can extend the need to reload quite a bit.
My sweet spot (with this wood) seems to be the air intake open about 1 and 1/8 inches from closed.

I measured the travel of the air control,and made a gauge out of an old broom handle... amrking 0, 25%,50%, 75% and full open.
I use it to make mental notes of what appears to be my best burns, It's a crutch for an old guy like me to learn with
including a pic , I think...

I have also found that when you get a High mound of large hot coals in the front of the stove, I can put one small split
on top of it (East /West) as close to the door as I can... those coals burn down to small coals and ashes quite nicely.
(I believe I found that trick here on this website as well.) Then I redistribute the hot coals and reload.
Picture of what I am doing included (I hope).

Just wanted to post an update and again express my gratitude for all of the information and help I have received here.

Thanks again

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Would you Guys Recommend The Condar Flue Guard Thermometer for the double wall Pipe inside the house? Or is there a better brand?

 

[jmb6420]

Would you Guys Recommend The Condar Flue Guard Thermometer for the double wall Pipe inside the house? Or is there a better brand?

The Condar is a good one, but like everything else in life, there are better. It all depends on how much you want to spend.

 

[Woody Stover]

Would you Guys Recommend The Condar Flue Guard Thermometer for the double wall Pipe inside the house? Or is there a better brand?

Yep, the Condars seem to be pretty accurate and hold up better than the larger Meeco/Rutland does. There are a lot of brands available, though..
I see a ChimGard, and the WoodSaver I've got on both my SILs' stoves. As you can see, that one has a silver zone, 230 at the bottom and 475 at the top, so the middle of the silver is about 350 I guess. https://www.condar.com/Stovepipe_Thermometers.html

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

Thanks for the info...
To me it looks like the chimgard is a magnetic for single wall and the Fluegard has the probe for double wall... am I correct?
I just checked my receipt from the installation ,and the black flue in my house is double wall,which transitions to 23 ft of Class A
Stainless outside. The nice thing is they are both lifetime warranty... . . I will ask my dealer if drilling holes in it voids the warranty or anything first I think.

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

My dealer says drilling holes will void the warranty , but only for that particular section of flue pipe.

 

[Woody Stover]

the Fluegard has the probe for double wall

Oops, I read your post to fast. I haven't used the Condar flue probes, just their surface meters and cat probes. I don't have a way to know if their cat probes are accurate, but I can say that whatever brightness the cats have been glowing on various stoves, seemed to be consistent with the probe readings I was seeing. Of course, different stoves have cat probes in different positions..

My dealer says drilling holes will void the warranty , but only for that particular section of flue pipe.

Huh, never heard of that. I'd go on the pipe maker's word before a dealer's...some of those guys spout a lot of stuff without actually knowing what they are talking about.
Anyway, there's nothing about drilling a hole that is going to cause the pipe to fail.