My stove is moving!

[bfitz3]

New install this fall. Everything was nice and square when the stove was installed. After two months of increasingly frequent use, I noticed that it had moved. Looking down on the top of the stove, it has turned counterclockwise, resulting in one of the legs being about 3/4 of an inch closer to the front of the hearth than the other.

Why? How?

Seems like this has to be some sort of thermal expansion/contraction issue with each heating cycle of the stove. It also seems dangerous as clearance requirements may be violated and the stove pipe is undoubtedly twisting, creating stresses on the pipe.

Anyone ever hear of this and what can I do?

 

[claydogg84]

I don't want to call you a liar, but something is off here. Most stoves are in the 3 to 400 lb range, and the heating and cooling of the metal isn't going to cause it to move as you stated. My personal guess is that it hasn't moved at all and you're just noticing the slight problem now.

 

[BrotherBart]

Don't know what your hearth consists of but whatever it is it is settling under the weight.

 

[jeff_t]

There have been other threads on the subject.

 

[jatoxico]

Right hand door? Any wiggle or slight rocking if you grab the top? I could see if the feet or base is not contacting the hearth equally (like a table that's tippy when you go out eat) that every time you close the door it could move fraction of an inch.

 

[begreen]

Coriolis effect in the flue is rotating the stove.

 

[rsw49]

When we first started operating our Jotul last Oct I had to exert quite a bit of pressure on the door handle to get it to close. I had to push back and then down to secure it. New gaskets and all I guess. I was afraid I was moving the stove slightly doing so and started holding the leg as insurance against any movement. With pressure though on the left side I would think any movement would rotate it clockwise however. From your previous picture of your stove it looks like the handle is on the left side also. Operation of the door handle is probably the only force you are applying to the stove. Ash pan? I don't know if either would be enough to move the stove but the only thing I can think of.

 

[Smoked]

Stove creep? Put it back like it is supposed to be and chalk the legs and see how long it takes to start walking again. Once it does, maybe you can figure out a way to secure it. If it is wobbly at all, shim the high legs with washers.

 

[brenndatomu]

There have been other threads on the subject.

Yep, just what I thought, read about this before. IIRC it was due to thermal expansion/contraction.
Can the stove be lagged to the floor?

This stove isn't on the opposite side of an "active" bedroom wall is it?

 

[bfitz3]

The stove, at about 700 lbs was shimmed with a washer, and tolerances were measured from each leg. The movement is very real as evidenced by the present variation in measurements and the washer coming out from under the offending leg. The hearth is based on a 2x4 platform laid on the thin dimension, screwed to the floor, topped with 3/4" ply, also screwed in, micore followed by concrete board, mortared in place and 1/4 inch tile. The 2x4 we're set to lay directly under the legs. I can't imagine how opening the door would have enough force to move something so heavy... Thermal expansion on the other hand...

Bolting the stove to the floor would violate code, building a thermal bridge between the underside of the stove and combustibles within the hearth.

 

[BrotherBart]

And under all of this stove weight and hearth weight is what?

 

[bfitz3]

There have been other threads on the subject.

I did a quick search... Didn't find them. Links would be appreciated.

 

[Squisher]

Don't throw your splits in so hard.

 

[BrotherBart]

That can happen. It was what busted the weld in the back of my old stove.

But I still want to know what that approximately 1,000 pounds of weight is sitting on. That didn't have it sitting on it before. My wife's second floor sewing room shelves full of fabric almost took a wall out of this house.

 

[Highbeam]

The stove, at about 700 lbs was shimmed with a washer, and tolerances were measured from each leg. The movement is very real as evidenced by the present variation in measurements and the washer coming out from under the offending leg. The hearth is based on a 2x4 platform laid on the thin dimension, screwed to the floor, topped with 3/4" ply, also screwed in, micore followed by concrete board, mortared in place and 1/4 inch tile. The 2x4 we're set to lay directly under the legs. I can't imagine how opening the door would have enough force to move something so heavy... Thermal expansion on the other hand...

Bolting the stove to the floor would violate code, building a thermal bridge between the underside of the stove and combustibles within the hearth.

Ha! Yes, stoves walk and you need to slide it back every so often. No, it is not a code violation to bolt it down. I believe they must be bolted down for mobile home installs.

 

[jeff_t]

I did a quick search... Didn't find them. Links would be appreciated.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/stove-creeping.100441/#post-1285957

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I'm just going to throw it out that you might have ghosts.

 

[MaintenanceMan]

I actually created a similar situation myself with my 17. I would bump the handle tight with my fist, kind of like bumping it down. Not what I thought was too hard, but I was actually forcing the handle down and back. It was a small stove and apparently I was using just enough force to very slowly twist the stove a bit and make it croocked over time. Took me a while to notice what I was doing, but I could tell the stove was slowly twisting out of square now and then. Once I figured out it was actually operator error I adjusted my door closing technique.

 

[mwhitnee]

Sounds like it's not sitting evenly or the legs might need tightening. Or a ghost...

 

[Nick Mystic]

Is there any fracking going on in your part of the state? When the well drillers pump their toxic waste water back underground with high pressure injection wells it lubricates the cracks underground causing micro-earthquakes. Many of these small bursts are too small to notice, but over time they could be enough to cause an unbalanced stove like yours to start moving.

 

[jb6l6gc]

Is there any fracking going on in your part of the state? When the well drillers pump their toxic waste water back underground with high pressure injection wells it lubricates the cracks underground causing micro-earthquakes. Many of these small bursts are too small to notice, but over time they could be enough to cause an unbalanced stove like yours to start moving.

Toxic waste water...back underground... you've been reading too much propaganda sir. Read up on how the fracking process is actually done, 99% of it is water with a very small amount of inert chemicals such as friction reducers and sand.

 

[sportbikerider78]

Is there any fracking going on in your part of the state? When the well drillers pump their toxic waste water back underground with high pressure injection wells it lubricates the cracks underground causing micro-earthquakes. Many of these small bursts are too small to notice, but over time they could be enough to cause an unbalanced stove like yours to start moving.

Or his mother in law is 600lbs and the Twinkies are on the opposite side of the house from the TV.

Thermal expansion is usually only a big deal and would cause movement, if it was very unequal. Meaning, if you had one side of the stove that had way more mass and it heated up quickly causing it to push from the other side.
Your stove would likely have to go through 100's of heat cycles in order to move any measurable\ amount.

Check out this calculator if you want to get your nerd on.
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/linear-thermal-expansion-d_1379.html

 

[jb6l6gc]

Or his mother in law is 600lbs and the Twinkies are on the opposite side of the house from the TV.

This sounds more likely and logical LOL

 

[bholler]

We see it all the time every time you load the stove or close the door you are putting force on it and they can slide. It is usually very slow and you dont notice it untill you look one day and the stove is a little crooked. Just more it back no big deal

 

[bfitz3]

I moved the stove back. It took a good amount of force to move it, but considering the weight, it moved pretty easily.

In the link provided above, someone suggested putting some pieces of high temp silicone baking sheets under the legs. It feels like that would help, and I'm having a hard time thinking of a reason it would be bad. Thoughts?

Meanwhile, we've been sitting at 15-30 degrees the last few days. I'm stunned at how little wood it takes to keep the house reasonably comfortable. 12 hours after a fire with four 5-inch splits, the house was sitting at 65 and there was a nice bed of coals to get the fire going again. I'm tempted to send the propane company a break-up letter.