Need Advice on Faster Startup Time

[Handy Daddy]

I could use some advise on this topic. My objective is to learn how to go from a cold start to cruise mode in the least amount of time as possible. Right now this is taking me almost 1.5 hours to accomplish and I'm thinking there's got to be a better way. I remember reading somewhere on here that someone was accomplishing this in about a half an hour.

Here's my current technique:

I'm making a fire from a cold start using a nice amount of dry kindling and a Rutland fire starter. I leave the door cracked open for about 5 minutes and then I close it. My system has great draft, the wood is bone dry and I have no problems getting a beautiful fire started. Once I close the door this will burn strongly for at least 1/2 hour. At that point I usually throw in 1 or 2 small splits to keep building heat. With this method it is at least 1 to 1.5 hours (total elapsed time) before I am comfortable raking the coals forward and loading 3 medium splits. Then it takes 15-20 minutes to dial down the load of medium splits and achieve "cruise" mode.

Sometimes this 1.5 to 2 hours is too long given my schedule and the timing not allowing me to make a fire when I would like to.

I would love to learn how others are starting their stoves from a cold start. How much wood do you load? What size wood? What type of fire starters? What air settings?

If anyone has any pictures of their cold start loads that would be awesome! (I've attached a pic of my cold start load of kindling)

Thanks!

 

[EatenByLimestone]

You need more wood in there to burn and transfer heat to the stove. I like using softwoods for this since they light off so fast and burn quickly.

Pack the stove with more fuel and it'll heat up faster.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Load the bottom half to 2/3 of the stove with dry kindling and place small splits on top. Once the flames start licking the top and you get the 1st hint of secondary action start cutting the air down so the heat does not go up the flue. The heat then builds up in the firebox and eventually starts radiating out the sides of the stove. You'll burn through this load quickly, but will heat the stove fast.

 

[Smoked]

Lots of variables but I have a 2.3 ft firebox and here is how I get it going. 6-8 sheets of news paper. one medium size piece of kindling diag across the dog house front to back corner. other small kindling across the medium piece then about 3 small splits and 3 medium splits stacked very loosely. Firebox 75% full but again very loose. Light the paper and crack the door until I can see kindling is going then shut the door with primary wide open. Get coffee and when first cup is down, go back and check the stove. Normally after that 15 min first cup, I can shut my primary all the way down at it will burn nicely on that initial load for about an hour with stove temps climbing.

If it is a weekend and I am home, I just keep adding medium splits every several hours to maintain the temp I am after. On a weekday or at night at about 1:15 in, I put a very large split in the back and medium stuff on top and in front of that. Open primary for 5-15 min and then try to shut it down. If it looks like I am going to loose the secondaries, I open it up another few min.

In reality, I can normally get to an initial secondary burn in as little as 15 min but to get a large enough load going to burn 6 hours or so, you need the coal bed from the first set before you can load it up. My stove is 10 years old and I have not replace gaskets. I like the way it burns and like that I can close the primary down and have a nice secondary burn with no fuss and get reasonable stove top temps with no smoke from the chimney. I do have to be careful of not using too much of the hotter woods on the larger loads though. I had a few fires late this year that pushed 600 on the stove so will likely replace at least the front door gasket this summer. Let the learning curve start over again...

Sorry, I don't have a picture. I am not sure if you have primary air coming into the lower front but using a small split to elevate the initial startup load and include a couple of medium splits in the mix might get you going faster. I would never elevate the larger loads for sure.

Wood supply is normally medium to hot hardwoods dried at least 2 years.

Hope that helps

 

[Nick Mystic]

First off, Handy Daddy, it would be helpful if you added the make of your stove to your profile so members who are familiar with it can give you more specific advice. Another method you might want to try is building a top down fire. My Jotul F600 has the dog house where the primary air enters right up front, as most stoves do. I generally clear a path through my ashes from the dog house to the back of the stove. Then I lay a split up front so that it is resting on the dog house. This allows my primary air to flow under that log and into the center and back of the stove to feed air to the rest of the wood I put in the stove and this promotes a faster build up of flames and heat. I then put a log or split in the back of the stove and another one between those two. Depending on the size of the wood I'm loading I'll continue to add splits until I get the level of wood is about 2/3 of the way up to the top of the firebox. This allows enough room to add kindling of the size in your photo. Four to six pieces should be enough to get a quick fire going. I have a supply of cut up waxed cardboard strips I made from some scrap boxes I got from Lowe's that they receive their plants in out in their garden center. They throw these boxes away, so they will give them to you for free. I cut the strips about an inch wide and four inches long. I place two or three of these in among the kindling and light them. I keep my side door cracked about a quarter inch while those strips burn and ignite my kindling. Once the kindling is well involved in burning I can usually shut my door and the fire will continue to build. As the splits begin to burn I start reducing my primary air accordingly. The quality of your wood and its moisture level will determine how soon you can get your primary air set down to cruising level. Good luck.

 

[BrotherBart]

Please put your stove in your signature line so we know what we are talking about here. Different mass takes different time/things to get up to temp.

ETA: Nick and I were typing at the same time.

 

[Dix]

How old / seasoned is your firewood supply?

 

[DougA]

From a cold start (rare for me) I build a similar initial fire, and once this is burning actively (5 min or less with the door open a crack if needed), I add 3 or 4 small/med. softwood or soft hardwood splits and shut the door. This should be roaring in another 10 min. (15 total so far). Then I will put in 3 or 4 med sized hardwood splits and turn the air down to 1/2. On a steel or cast iron, the stove should now be at cruising temp or usually higher. Under these conditions, there 'should' be no reason for an overfire. When I check the temps and the fire at 30 min, I will usually add larger splits to fill the stove. This will cool the fire a bit for 5 min, then it should quickly return to higher temps and the air control should be fully closed by now or earlier, depending upon how active the fire is.

I have had 2 non-cat stoves, one med sized and one large and both operate very similarly. If you have a cat stove, it may be different.

I have advocated for everyone to buy a flue thermometer and it is a huge help in determining what is going on with your fire. A stove top thermometer tells you the status of your stove but not the fire, since the top is reading what was going on with the fire 5 min. (or more) earlier. With my soapstone stove, a flue thermometer is essential IMHO because the stove top is delayed 30 min or more.

This is what I practice but as posted by others, each stove is a bit different and I am impatient. If I had to babysit it for any longer, I'd sell my stove.

 

[Oldman47]

Maybe Poindexter will chime in. He started and refined his own starting process to beat the local ordinances about how long he could have visible smoke on a cold start. See this thread
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/regulated-burners-cold-start-tips.140279/#post-1886397

 

[Poindexter]

Thanks Oldman47, I was just about to have to go hunt up that old thread.

FWIW I agree with the above, what stove are we talking about? Cat or non cat, how big a firebox. How tall is your flue? Where do you live, roughly? How dry is "bone dry" in like numbers?

I stopped updating my cold start thread because no one was stirring the pot with me. I can experiment on my own without updating thread just as easily.

I have found 15+ ways to get my 450# Ashford 30 from cold start to clean plume with engaged cat in 23-25 minutes. My local ordinance is calling for 20 minutes - but it is (currently) a complaint driven ordinance, so if none of my neighbors complain I can do 90 minute cold starts.

A taller stack is better - within certain limits.

Dryer wood is better - down to +/- 11%MC wet basis (electronic gizmo) or so.

I have been playing lately with leaving the loading door open as long as possible rather than closing it as soon as possible. Doesn't make a great deal of difference for me so far. To get your stove hot you gotta burn fuel. To burn fuel you need oxygen.

Whether it is better to close the door after building a fire directly under the cat, or leave the door open and heat the whole shebang seems to be a toss-up, at least my stove - my install - my wood.

 

[blacktail]

11:13pm. A flat split. A home made fire starter. Then kindling and a few smallish splits on top. Door open for about 30 seconds after starting.


400° at 11:37 after the air has already been cut to 3/4 throttle. Time to turn it down to half throttle.



I added one split 90 minutes later to get me through until my last load of the night. 41° outside. Small insert with about 14' of uninsulated liner.

 

[Handy Daddy]

First off, Handy Daddy, it would be helpful if you added the make of your stove to your profile so members who are familiar with it can give you more specific advice. Another method you might want to try is building a top down fire. My Jotul F600 has the dog house where the primary air enters right up front, as most stoves do. I generally clear a path through my ashes from the dog house to the back of the stove. Then I lay a split up front so that it is resting on the dog house. This allows my primary air to flow under that log and into the center and back of the stove to feed air to the rest of the wood I put in the stove and this promotes a faster build up of flames and heat. I then put a log or split in the back of the stove and another one between those two. Depending on the size of the wood I'm loading I'll continue to add splits until I get the level of wood is about 2/3 of the way up to the top of the firebox. This allows enough room to add kindling of the size in your photo. Four to six pieces should be enough to get a quick fire going. I have a supply of cut up waxed cardboard strips I made from some scrap boxes I got from Lowe's that they receive their plants in out in their garden center. They throw these boxes away, so they will give them to you for free. I cut the strips about an inch wide and four inches long. I place two or three of these in among the kindling and light them. I keep my side door cracked about a quarter inch while those strips burn and ignite my kindling. Once the kindling is well involved in burning I can usually shut my door and the fire will continue to build. As the splits begin to burn I start reducing my primary air accordingly. The quality of your wood and its moisture level will determine how soon you can get your primary air set down to cruising level. Good luck.

Just created my signature with stove, chimney and wood details.

 

[Handy Daddy]

Thanks Oldman47, I was just about to have to go hunt up that old thread.

FWIW I agree with the above, what stove are we talking about? Cat or non cat, how big a firebox. How tall is your flue? Where do you live, roughly? How dry is "bone dry" in like numbers?

I stopped updating my cold start thread because no one was stirring the pot with me. I can experiment on my own without updating thread just as easily.

I have found 15+ ways to get my 450# Ashford 30 from cold start to clean plume with engaged cat in 23-25 minutes. My local ordinance is calling for 20 minutes - but it is (currently) a complaint driven ordinance, so if none of my neighbors complain I can do 90 minute cold starts.

A taller stack is better - within certain limits.

Dryer wood is better - down to +/- 11%MC wet basis (electronic gizmo) or so.

I have been playing lately with leaving the loading door open as long as possible rather than closing it as soon as possible. Doesn't make a great deal of difference for me so far. To get your stove hot you gotta burn fuel. To burn fuel you need oxygen.

Whether it is better to close the door after building a fire directly under the cat, or leave the door open and heat the whole shebang seems to be a toss-up, at least my stove - my install - my wood.

Just added some details to my signature. I think the firebox is 2.5 cubic feet but I'd have to look that up to be sure. I'm in NJ. Dry wood to me is seasoned over two years. Non- cat, three secondary combustion tubes.

 

[Dakotas Dad]

Hate to say it.. but I don't start my stove like that at all. I have good seasoned hardwoods.
I load the stove with full sized splits, slide a Super Cedar half or quarter, down in the bottom of the stack, light. In 30 minutes or so I have a +400F stove top that is ready to be aired down.. I have not built a fire from kindling in years. No need. In fact I said it years ago, I am not earning a merit badge, I am heating my home.

 

[northwinds]

Hate to say it.. but I don't start my stove like that at all. I have good seasoned hardwoods.
I load the stove with full sized splits, slide a Super Cedar half or quarter, down in the bottom of the stack, light. In 30 minutes or so I have a +400F stove top that is ready to be aired down.. I have not built a fire from kindling in years. No need. In fact I said it years ago, I am not earning a merit badge, I am heating my home.

Pretty much same here, but with home made fire starter. Big splits on the bottom, maybe 1-2 smaller splits just above the firestarter. My stove gets turned down at about 550 to 80% and then one more final adjustment ten or fifteen minutes later.

 

[begreen]

For a quick start I always load N/S. E/W blocks air flow unless the wood is elevated on a pair of N/S sleepers. I put one layer of 4-6" splits N/S on the bottom, 2 layers on the sides with a gap in the middle. In the gap I place a starter or balled-up newspaper and over that a few dry kindling pieces criss-crossed. Light it. 5 minutes later add 2-3" pieces on top of the kindling. Start turning down the air to abut 50% after about 5 more minutes. Then add a decent sized split to fill the gap in the middle. Let ignite and turn down the air again in 5-10 min..

 

[jkranes]

I have a super-small insert (Avalon Pendleton, 1.3 cf) and start from a cold stove every evening. Tiny stoves have their own unique problems here as there are only a limited number of ways of fitting the splits into the box. I have found the absolute fastest possible way to heat up the stove is with a full load of kindling or very small splits, provided you can get enough air gaps in (irregular shaped splits help so they don't fit together too tightly). But in reality you have to start a fire with the wood you have, and I don't have enough kindling to do this every day. So in general I try to construct two parallel stacks of splits, one in back and one in front (loaded EW, my only option), with a gap of maybe 1" between them. If I happen to have enough room, and the right size wood on hand, I'll try to lay one or two small kindling pieces across the gap. Drop a super cedar down the gap and that's it. The best results occur when the front stack has some small gaps between splits (from irregular shape), in which case in addition to the main flames that start up in the gap, I'll start to get flames coming between the splits and wrapping around the front. Note that this is the ideal and I don't always have the right size splits on hand to achieve it. So maybe I'll start with larger splits on the bottom that don't leave any gap, followed by smaller splits on top with a gap. Again, every fire is a bit different as every set of splits I have to work with is different. But the overall idea is: as much wood as possible, WITH some gaps for air and flames to get through. Start with air full open and gradually shut down once the fire gets going. And again, depending on how much space if any was left at the top, and what I have on hand, I may add another split on top as the fire starts to burn down and open a bit more space at the top.

 

[DougA]

FWIW, I find that stacking a full load does not work as well as adding larger splits every 5 to 10 min. I've tried it and too often, the larger pieces collapse onto the kindling and smother the fire. I'm sure it works well for some people, just not everyone. I have not tried a top down fire and will see if that might work better.

 

[Woody Stover]

Another method you might want to try is building a top down fire

I load the stove with full sized splits, slide a Super Cedar half or quarter,

I load it full and start it top-down, with kindling and a couple small SuperCedar chunks on the top/front of the load. This heats up the top of the stove quickly so you can get the re-burn working quickly. As far as the air, I want big flame with the least amount of air, to keep building heat in the box.

 

[English BoB]

11:13pm. A flat split. A home made fire starter. Then kindling and a few smallish splits on top. Door open for about 30 seconds after starting.
View attachment 155884

400° at 11:37 after the air has already been cut to 3/4 throttle. Time to turn it down to half throttle.

View attachment 155887

I added one split 90 minutes later to get me through until my last load of the night. 41° outside. Small insert with about 14' of uninsulated liner.

How many Henry Wienhards does it take to start a fire ?

or is that a fire extinguisher ( 12 oz version )

 

[rideau]

Whether for a top down or regular fire, like several others have posted, I load my stove once, light it, close the door, and simply adjust the flue damper and air supply as the fire engages, until I am at the state where I want the stove to cruise.

If I want a very quick start from a cold stove, with no coals present, I load the stove with the wood I want for the burn, then fill the top with a lot of twigs or splinters of wood and light the twigs/splinters at top (with a firestarter if necessary, but usually not necessary). The fire will be roaring in just a very few minutes. I then shut the damper (Very strong draft), and reduce the air to 1/2, then in a minute or two to 1/4, then to where I want it for the long burn. The primary wood, if properly dry, engages while the twigs are burning. Very easy way to get a fast, hot fire.

Alternatively, I put some twigs and/or wood splinters on the bottom, then a few small branches (1-2 inch diameter), then a large split in the back, then load the rest for a regular fire. If the wood is very dry, lighting the twigs/splinters gets the fire going. Otherwise, I may use a firestarter, which I usually place under a corner of a split near the door, and put some small splinters of dry maple on top of it.

I find with my stove that the fire definitely starts better with the door closed immediately after loading: keeps the box hotter, and the draft stronger.

I would never load kindling as you did. You don't need all that air space, as you do for an outdoor fire. Just lay the kindling on the bottom of the firebox (or top for top down fire), making sure you leave a path for the doghouse air to get into your wood. You'll get better burns if you pack your stove fairly tight, and with the wood on the firebox floor.

For shoulder season fires, I often burn 1 1/2 to 3 inch diameter branches, and just pile them on some splinters of wood or a firestarter. I usually just fill the front 1/2 to 2/3 of the firebox, and that with a relatively small load. Lots of small pieces of wood gets the fire hot fast, and gives a fairly quick, hot burn. If I want a longer burn, I'll put a decent size split on top of the branches.

 

[FPX Dude]

I like your Lincoln Log approach, but maybe take a 1/3 less rows from the top and use those as filler in between the lower rows below, so now maybe an 1" between them. Then, get some good mediums with the space now left over and you should have a blaze in no time. Wow, from all that kindling I use maybe 6 of those and have it cruising in ~45mins. from a cold start. Oh yah, I use a 1/4 of a firestarter too.

 

[Stretch]

Hi! I posted a link to this video before. I've bruned wood for about 15 years, but
recently moved to a differen house and had trouble getting the stove to temp
in less than an hour. This link opened my eyes, I'll tell ya! The guy in the video
is right - good, dry kindling makes a HUGE difference. I've found that the initial
east/west splits can't be too big or they take o long to ignite. It's also helpful if
all of the initial wood is bone dry. Use your questionable moisture content stuff
when the fire is well-established.

Lately I've also been using a couple of the small BioBricks n/s instead of short
splits, and tha works really well. I think my record to a 300 F stack and 400F stove
top is something like 8 minutes. More typical is 15 to 30 minutes, and I think my
wood is the greatest variable there - the dryness is not consistent. Still, it's
kept me warm all winter, and when I took the stovepipe apart about a month ago
it was clean! ;-)

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Good Luck!

-Stretch

 

[pault123]

Subscribing to thread, great advice!

 

[savageactor7]

Handy Daddy I'd take those sticks in the pic you posted and just simply drop them on a few pieces of crumpled paper...then top it off with smaller splits 2x4 sized and light 'er up.

Too much air space will in that kindling box structure will take a little longer if you desire a good cruising-range type fire in a short period of time.