Need advice on used wood stove

[skirby1212]

Hi everyone.
I am looking for advice on a used wood stove. Ive done a lot of research but am still having questions.
Heres where I started. I used to burn a Tempwood stove. Loved the amount of heat it produced and the topload design. The stove is in my livingroom so i wanted to change to one with glass doors so I purchased a Hearthstone Phoenix. Great looking stove but doesn't produce nearly as much heat so I'm selling that.

So I've been looking at the Vermont Castings defiant and encore but have seen many negative posts about them. I really like the look of them but I don't want to end up with a hard to maintain basket case so I'm looking for ideas and thoughts on what you would recommend. The stove would be used to heat a 1600sqft 2 story Cape style house. Hopefully someone can shed some light on this. I'm not against Vermont Castings if I can get some positive feeback on them.
Thanks Guys

 

[begreen]

They can be high maintenance and expensive stoves to run. The odds are with a used one that one could be in for expensive repairs from the get go. The cat models are better, but still hindered by a soft refractory assembly. I would look for a used Jotul F500 or F600 or consider an inexpensive steel stove instead. Englander and Drolet make big heaters in the $9-1100 range that will do the job without busting the pocketbook. And they have a nice fireview. (And use less expensive 6" flue instead of 8")

 

[skirby1212]

Thanks for the reply. I was also looking into the jotul F 600 as I have seen a lot of positive posts on these stoves. Can't they or the Vermont castings be run on a 6" pipe with an adapter? I'm sure they would breathe better with 8" but I only have room for a 6" pipe in my chimney unless I break out part of the damper which I really don't want to do in case I want to make the fireplace usable again down the road.

 

[brad wilton]

Hi skirby,i've read hear that soapstone takes a while to heat up but once there should be able to heat house. Whats the problem?.

 

[redhat]

If the used VC Encore and Defiant you are looking at happen to be one of the 2N1 (Flexburn) models that VC has produced since 2010 then they deserve a serious look. They are not high maintenance like the earlier Everburn or CAT models begreen referenced, and the reviews for the 2n1 have been favorable.

 

[Simonkenton]

Why are you so enchanted with a stove line that is so beset with problems? Cause it looks good?

Well, the Jotul Oslo looks good too and is very reliable. A six inch pipe is recommended for the Oslo.

 

[begreen]

If the used VC Encore and Defiant you are looking at happen to be one of the 2N1 (Flexburn) models that VC has produced since 2010 then they deserve a serious look. They are not high maintenance like the earlier Everburn or CAT models begreen referenced, and the reviews for the 2n1 have been favorable.

2N1 reviews have been mixed.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/problem-with-vc-encore-cat-noncat.134769/
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/upgrading-encore-2n1-for-a-blaze-king.131743/

 

[redhat]

Why are you so enchanted with a stove line that is so beset with problems? Cause it looks good?

Well, the Jotul Oslo looks good too and is very reliable. A six inch pipe is recommended for the Oslo.

What problems? Please enlighten me. Or are you still hung up on models that haven't been made in over 5 years?

What do I like about the new VC Flexburn? Top load, grated bottom, swing out ashpan, good heater and yeah, it looks great too.

Oslo being a non-cat is a non-starter for me.

 

[skirby1212]

Hi Brad. The soapstone does heat the house but feels like a totally different heat than the tempwood stove gave. It seems more of a radiant type of heat and we are so used to the heat the tempwood made. It was the real dry take the bone chill out of you on the coldest of days.

 

[claydogg84]

Are you sure you're running the Hearthstone correctly? I'm not trying to insult you, just wondering if it's possible to get what you've already got working correctly.

 

[skirby1212]

I am new to the hearthstone I will say. I get it up to about 350-400 degrees then choke it down so it doesn't overheat. Try not to let it go over 500 degrees per the manual. I also want to replace it as it doesn't have a long burn time.

 

[claydogg84]

I am new to the hearthstone I will say. I get it up to about 350-400 degrees then choke it down so it doesn't overheat. Try not to let it go over 500 degrees per the manual. I also want to replace it as it doesn't have a long burn time.

I'm not all that familiar with soapstone stoves and their desired temperature ratings, but it is a nice looking, expensive stove. Have you asked for advice with another thread? There are plenty of other soapstone users on here that may be able to offer helpful tips. The size of the Phoenix's firebox should be able to give you a decent 8 hour overnight burn.

 

[skirby1212]

I will check with other soapstone users. Great idea. I do like the stove and like the looks of it just not getting the heat from it that I want. Thanks

 

[stovelark]

The Hearthstone Phoenix is quite the venerable heater, up to about 2000 sqft here in NE. Its married the benefits of cast and soapstone and has a generous firebox at 2.3 cuft. The stoves being discussed (VC and Jotul) both are radiant heaters and although a bit larger fireboxes, I would expect them to be a bit more of a heat hammer than the Phoenix. Perhaps a big steel stove would be the answer? They are the best heat hammers, but aren't the most pleasing to look at. The Oslo, Firelight and their F55 Carrabassett sister are all quite capable. Probably a bit less on the wallet too, than the VCs.

 

[Rearscreen]

You should ask someone who has lived with steel, cast iron, top loaders, front loaders, side loaders, soapstones, tubes, cats in their homes. Oh that would be me. OMW as my coworkers call me. Old Man Winter. Ah but take what I have learned with a grain of salt, I'm kinda dumb in a smart way. Hey I am so dumb I installed Stephen Colberts (when he was on) fireplace on his set. (Actually it was a monitor in the fireplace set piece playing a fire)

 

[Smoked]

spikes over 500 f are fine, you just don't want to run it constantly that high. Hot loads at 300 will jump to 450 but that seems to be a comfy number for mine. Big gnarly splits in back with smaller stuff in front for longer burn times too!

 

[billb3]

My sister has a Tempwood clone and the firebox is considerably larger than 2.3 cu.ft.
It does blast out some heat though.

The soapstone is supposed to soften the punch and make sitting in the same room with it (especially close) a little easier .
Tempwoods will burn somewhat less than well seasoned wood. How is your supply ?

 

[begreen]

The Tempwood is a radiant heater. Soapstone stoves are also radiant, but less so.

I think you might consider the Woodstock Ideal Steel stove. It combines both attributes.

 

[bholler]

What problems?

No way to monitor cat temps which leads to premature cat failure or an inactive cat. Unless they added a probe in the last couple years. It is still a real pain in the ass to service which leads them to be under serviced. Yes the new stoves are much better than the old ones but honestly that still is not saying much. They still have a long way to go to catch up to everyone else.

 

[redhat]

No way to monitor cat temps which leads to premature cat failure or an inactive cat. Unless they added a probe in the last couple years. It is still a real pain in the ass to service which leads them to be under serviced. Yes the new stoves are much better than the old ones but honestly that still is not saying much. They still have a long way to go to catch up to everyone else.

No way to monitor cat temps? Really? You might want to tell the guys in the 2015/2016 VC Owners thread, they have a couple pages devoted on ways they are currently monitoring cat temps.

The new VC 2n1 models ship with a cat probe, the older VC CAT models provided a hole in the back casting for a cat probe to be inserted. Pop off the little metal button, insert cat probe, done. 30 second job tops.

Your assertion that the new 2n1 (flexburn) models have a long way to go to catch up to everyone else doesn't hold a lot of weight with me. I'm guessing you've never owned or operated one.

 

[claydogg84]

No way to monitor cat temps? Really? You might want to tell the guys in the 2015/2016 VC Owners thread, they have a couple pages devoted on ways they are currently monitoring cat temps.

The new VC 2n1 models ship with a cat probe, the older VC CAT models provided a hole in the back casting for a cat probe to be inserted. Pop off the little metal button, insert cat probe, done. 30 second job tops.

Your assertion that the new 2n1 (flexburn) models have a long way to go to catch up to everyone else doesn't hold a lot of weight with me. I'm guessing you've never owned or operated one.

Vermont Castings does have a long way to go to catch up to everyone else, in one main aspect - The consumers trust.

 

[bholler]

The new VC 2n1 models ship with a cat probe, the older VC CAT models provided a hole in the back casting for a cat probe to be inserted. Pop off the little metal button, insert cat probe, done. 30 second job tops.

did you not notice that i said unless they added a probe? I have worked on 7 or 8 newer 2n1 s and none had probes. That is what i am basing my opinion on what i see in the field every day. And the vc stuff does not work as good in the real world as many other stoves. No i have never run one and i wont be any time soon either. But i clean allot of chimneys they are hooked to and i see the real world results with average people running them.

 

[Simonkenton]

Thank you claydogg. VC has lost the trust of the people. And when they have lost me, they are in big trouble.
Back in the eighties I loved Vermont Castings. I bought a 1988 Resolute for my house, and I got my brother and my mother to buy the same stove that year. I was sort of an amateur VC salesman!
They were great stoves! I sold mine along with the house it was in, in 1995, but my mom still has hers and runs it often, never a problem.
A beautiful stove, worked great, made in America.

Imagine my dismay in the nineties when I was at a store in Atlanta that sold VC stoves and the owner was telling me of all the problems with this line of stoves.
I couldn't believe it but I didn't buy a VC, bought an Irish Waterford instead, pretty good stove.

Now, on this forum, I read time and again of people having all kinds of problems with Vermont Castings stoves.
So, two months ago, having built an addition onto my home, I needed a bigger stove and I bought a Jotul Oslo.
Vermont Castings has lost great customers like me, I don't trust them any more and won't have anything to do with them. Screw 'em.

 

[Rearscreen]

Take what I say with a grain of salt but I went to the VC "foundry" in Randolf oh about 30 years ago (sad to say) for an annual partay...it was fascinating. The cauldrons that held the liquid iron were electrically heated. They said if it ever solidified because of an outage the unit would be ruined. I saw the sand/wax relief form process. I loved VC. I have a Resolute in my garage that I plan this summer to rebuild.That stove was great.

 

[bholler]

They still have some of the best castings out there that was never the issue