New Pellet Owner here

[Toc Man]

Hi all, just wanted to throw a greeting out and thank you all for your questions and advice. Many of the threads have been interesting and educational.

My Ranch-style house was built in the 50s with plaster walls, and I'm fairly certain that only the small addition/breezeway enclosure area has any insulation (and the breezeway has terrible temperature readings on the garage side) with Drywall. The rest of the house is plaster walls with tongue and grove planks, covered in wood shingles on the outside. Only about 1,500 sq ft and oil was getting a bit crazy soI thought the pellet stove would stem off some of the heating costs. We only kept the house at about 62 but the open floor plan for the living area never really got that high, probably 59-61, the bedrooms and the bathrooms (where the thermostat is in the hallway) were always warmer 62-64with our cast iron baseboards throughout. I think my attic has the r19 fiberglass laid down, if not it's close to it and nothing between the floor but the basement usually stays about 63, with air coming up the stairs around 66, 67.

I've only had the stove since Monday and it seems almost a waste of time and money so far. I have a Harman Accentra insert and in order to burn about a bag a day I need to keep it on 1.5 at night and 2.0 during the day on stove temp with the fan setting low. On 2, It will keep the room at about 65 66, surrounding open rooms 63ish, breeze way about 61-62 and around the hallway 63-64, bedrooms hover around 60 or less. Eating about 2 bags a day to increase that another 3-5 degrees for the close rooms, and 2-3 degrees elsewhere. And I noticed almost no difference between temperature and usage with first bag $6 premium CleanFire Pacific softwood versus the $4.20 Stove Chow bags I bought from Home Depot. I know it's not much testing right now but seems like I'll be saving a lot less than what I hoped for.

I know I need at least a couple doorway fans, right now I'm using a standing fan to blow air down the hallway toward the bedrooms from the living room (where the Harman is) I have a ceiling fan right in front of the pellet stove but not sure if I've noticed any difference with it on low-down, or low-up or off.

Anyway, I'm looking to maximize the cost effectiveness of this while increasing the comfort level a little, which from everything I read, should be possible over oil.

1) So should I use the ceiling fan and which direction, consensus up/reverse on low? I have one in our bedroom too but that's the room I care least about for temp.

2) Should I stick with cheaper pellets and just burn a little more? The BTU increase doesn't seem to warrant the price increase, especially since I noticed very little difference.

3) I don't think I like Room Temp / Auto so I'm really looking at Stove Temp / Auto versus Room Temp / Manual. I have the feeder set on 4, and I haven't really tried the fan more than past half way on either setting, seems like raising the blower on Stove Temp increases consumption of pellets while Room adjusts fan speed as needed. It seems like people are split on this, so how about with my personal tastes, any suggestions?

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you,
Toc

PS. The living room, kitchen and dining room all have the same ceiling, breezeway is off the dining room behind the living room, sharing the chimney with a one foot drop and about a 60" passage with wall over the doorway blocking some heat transfer. The front door is off the living room then the hallway leads to the kitchen, making a small circle around the basement stairs, before the hallway turns towards the bedrooms and bathroom. Then both hallways have the same over-doorway wall blocking upper most heat transfer from kitchen and living room.

 

[Wachusett]

Not a Harman owner so I can't speak about the stove. Try placing the fan at the opposite end near the bedroom on the floor and push cold air back to the stove.
This generally works the best.The ceiling fan in the bedroom will probably make no difference, I would also say you need more insulation IMHO.

 

[The Ds]

Welcome! Is this a new insert, or 'new to you'? If new to you (i.e. - used), has it been thoroughly cleaned? Our stove doesn't have the fancy settings like yours, but someone with experience will be along shortly to help you

As far as the fan, we have a box fan in the hallway, facing the stove. It blows cold air toward to stove, then the cold air moves the warm stove air and circulates it. Sounds weird, I know, but it works. We have one of the ceiling fans on in the living room (stove location). It sucks the air up (too chilly blowing down - that's the summer setting). This helps with air circulation also.

 

[smoke show]

I would also say you need more insulation IMHO.

Quoted for truth.

It doesn't matter what the heat source is if the heat loss is too great its a losing battle.

 

[MCPO]

What are the dimensions and sq footage of the house . A diagram would help with the stove location.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Welcome to the forums Toc Man.

Now, I don't know what you are paying for pellets (or for that matter what you'd pay for oil) but why don't you let that stove run on auto/room and why haven't you done anything to tighten up the house?

Oil, gas, wood, coal, electricity, or pellets makes no matter a bit of work on the ole house will make a world of difference in your comfort level while reducing your overall heating and cooling costs.

ETA: You can start here: http://www.builditsolar.com/Projects/Projects.htm under energy conservation.

 

[jgrz0610]

Your layout sounds similar to mine. I have an insert in the living room that I use to heat the house exclusively (oil comes on for hot water, that's it). I'm able to do it with 2 bags a day and no fans. Granted the bedrooms are slightly cooler at the back of the house but not ridiculously. I think you may have to do some investigating on the stove. The next questions to ask, did the dealer install it, what's the venting like, did you take air temps coming from the stove, is it cleaned etc. If you've been lurking you know how it works...lol. Hope it gets resolved because your stove "should" be able to heat that house no problem, although the no insulation is scary. But, if you're heating with oil and it takes 10 gallons a day to heat the uninsulated house, crank that stove up to as high as she will go. There's no way you'd burn enough pellets to make it more expensive than oil. Just my opinion.

 

[imacman]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me like you thought that insert was going to raise the temp of the WHOLE house quite a bit. Well, that's not going to really happen.

Your research into these stoves before you bought it, should have shown that they are primarily room heaters. Expecting to heat more than the room it's in and maybe a few right next to it is unrealistic.

 

[Toc Man]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds to me like you thought that insert was going to raise the temp of the WHOLE house quite a bit. Well, that's not going to really happen.

Your research into these stoves before you bought it, should have shown that they are primarily room heaters. Expecting to heat more than the room it's in and maybe a few right next to it is unrealistic.

I did research it and considering the size of our house plus the size of the stove and talking with a couple people that owned pellet stoves... what I wanted was well within reason. I wasn't planning on raising the temperature of the house significantly but I was planning on saving money and putting the heat on the right side of the house. I want to be maximizing my usage while I'm doing it though.


Unit is brand new, installed Monday. Insulation has been on hold a little, we bought the house a couple years ago and have been doing projects as we go. I was hoping to maybe switch to vinyl siding in the next few years so I figured we would do the insulation then rather than rely on blowing it in. Maybe it's worth it now, I don't know.

I considered doing the fan on the floor but I was afraid that would cause too much cold air moving around, we don't really use the door-to-kitchen hall way much so the fan being there seemed to make sense because it was a lot more gentle by the time it rounded the corner toward the bedrooms. So low power fan on the floor isn't bothersome?

The only way I could swallow 2 bags a day would be the ~$4 bags, I was hoping to average about 1 with the $6 bags.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Most houses are not set up to maintain a decent convection loop. It requires some form of assist to distribute the warm air, the whole time you are moving it it looses heat.

Nothing magic about it. You have to generate enough heat to overcome the heat loss of your house in order to increase its inside air temperature as you do that the difference between the inside temperature and the outside increases your heat loss.

If you can heat your house to a temperature of 60 degrees when it is 40 degrees outside as soon as the temperature outside goes to 20 degrees it will require twice the amount of fuel to be burned to have an inside temperature of 60 degrees.

The very best thing to do is to stop as much of the heat loss as possible. This means locating and blocking all drafts, and those puppies can be just about anywhere.

Doing that isn't all that expensive, insulation can cost a bit if you have it done instead of learning how to properly install it and do the job yourself, one season paybacks can be had for a number of relatively simple projects.

 

[boosted3g]

Stove temp low if also the least effecient mode that the stove can run it. Crank the fan speed up and turn it to room temp. The Harman sticky will make a good read and explain all the different settings and the advantages of each.


FWIW Atticat at home depot is the cheapest and easiest insulation to put in the attic. It works awesome and takes no time to install.

 

[Toc Man]

So I know heat rises and attic would be good bet, how does that affect the summers though? You find it helps or hurts?

 

[The Ds]

Insulation in the attic will help keep the summer heat out, as well as keeping the winter heat in.

 

[Melissa220]

Your research into these stoves before you bought it, should have shown that they are primarily room heaters. Expecting to heat more than the room it's in and maybe a few right next to it is unrealistic.

Imacman, my experience is different, and perhaps that is just because of my layout. My stove is placed in the corner of my single story living room angled towards the opposite corner. I have NO additional fans running. The heat travels from the living room out into the kitchen area (40 ft) and around a corner into another room to impact the oil burner stat and ALSO around a corner at the end of that 40 ft and upstairs! my temps are 72 in LR/Kitchen, 70 in den and 64 upstairs. This is heating FAR more od my home than I expected and even more than the dealer expected when he came to my home.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Imacman, my experience is different, and perhaps that is just because of my layout. My stove is placed in the corner of my single story living room angled towards the opposite corner. I have NO additional fans running. The heat travels from the living room out into the kitchen area (40 ft) and around a corner into another room to impact the oil burner stat and ALSO around a corner at the end of that 40 ft and upstairs! my temps are 72 in LR/Kitchen, 70 in den and 64 upstairs. This is heating FAR more od my home than I expected and even more than the dealer expected when he came to my home.

Melissa, your house evidently has a decent setup for a convection loop, that is a rare occurrence, what Pete is saying is closer to what a lot of people will see.

It still amazes me that folks think that because one house can be easily heated that another house will be easy as well.

Sorry but that is just not the case.

Identical houses would be needed as would a lot of other things for house to house comparisons about difficulties in heating a house being the same.

Oh, and to the OP hot air rises if it isn't blocked, heat always flows from hot to cold.

One of the biggest issues in moving heated air around is removing the blocks and this usually means getting the cold stuff down low heading for the stove.

In the case of a stove in a basement what frequently stops it from heating more than the lower level is the colder air up stairs forming a convection blockage.

Also no matter what you do in the way of just moving the air around will even out the temperature differences in the house unless you duct the air in balanced manner.

You can even it out by ducting or properly decreasing the heat loss of sections of the house the further you get from the stove.

 

[stoaf88]

Imacman, my experience is different, and perhaps that is just because of my layout. My stove is placed in the corner of my single story living room angled towards the opposite corner. I have NO additional fans running. The heat travels from the living room out into the kitchen area (40 ft) and around a corner into another room to impact the oil burner stat and ALSO around a corner at the end of that 40 ft and upstairs! my temps are 72 in LR/Kitchen, 70 in den and 64 upstairs. This is heating FAR more od my home than I expected and even more than the dealer expected when he came to my home.

I agree, my house is around 2200 square feet. 2 floors with a basement as well.

Stove sits in family room at one side of the house and points to the kitchen and stairway.

Family room stays at around 78, kitchen around 75, upstairs hallway 72 and all 3 bedrooms (with the doors open of course) around 67-70.

The house is 2x6 construction with air tight insulation though.