Newbie girl - How to make the most out of wood and coal?

[oska]

Hello,

I'm a newbie girl to burning wood. I live alone and recently purchased a Harman Mark 3 - which can burn both wood and coal. I was told to burn wood in the earlier part of the year and then switch over to coal when it gets very chilly.

My question is this:

How do I burn wood most efficiently for heat production?

Should I:

A. Open the vent all the way, and let wood burn bright and hot and get the house up to 83F and just let the house slowly cool over time.
B. Open he vent a smidge once it gets going with embers, and let a bunch of big wood smoulder all day long and keep the house at 75.

I usually put a small lay layer of anthracite coal on the bottom of my fires because I found that this keeps the stove hot long after the wood has burned out - and it only uses a small amount of coal. Is that a good idea or am I doing a horrible thing?

I love anthracite - I don't know why other peopel don't put a nice pile of the stuff in their stoves while they burn wood - it's incredibly hot burning and completely passive (I don't have to do anything, no coal added - just put a little pile there and it gets red hot and amplifies heat maintenance throughout the day).

Please help answer my question!

I am so frustrated burning through big piles of wood each day and getting my house up to 85 degrees rather than smouldering it. I read here that smouldering burns JUST AS QUICK as with flames - and that with flames there's wood gasses that are also burned - so it's ultimately the best way to go.

Please help a newbie girl

 

[oska]

Hello,

I am a newbie to all this and have been experimenting with anthracite coal and wood. I have a really important question about burning anthracite coal in my Harman Mark 3:

When burning a full load of coal, is it more or less efficient to keep the air intake valve fully open or just open a smudge?

Does it matter?

Should I just leave it open all the way with less coal or should I let it smoulder over time so it all doesn't get burned up?

I've read that for wood it's better to leave the air intake valve fully open at all times so that it burns hot and most efficiently, but is this the case with anthracite coal?

Please help, thank you

 

[begreen]

Welcome. First and foremost you want to burn dry wood. How it is burned depends somewhat on the stove. As a general rule it is not good idea to run the stove with the air wide open. That usually is inefficient, sending a lot of heat up the flue pipe.

What stove is this?

 

[begreen]

Merged threads to reduce duplication and it provides the stove make/model. The Harman Mark 3 is a coal stove, not a wood stove. Page 3 of the manual says: FOR USE WITH COAL ONLY. and in the fuels section is says:
This heater is approved for burning coal only. Use of any other fuel, except for the purpose of coal ignition, is a violation of U.S. law. When and if the chimney pipe or connector reaches 500˚ f. (maximum temperature), the stove is being overfired.

The manual has good termperature and operating guidance. For more info on running the stove you may want to visit the coal forums at: www.nepacrossroads.com

 

[spirilis]

I recommend checking out nepacrossroads.com coal forum, the Hand Fired section. Generally speaking coal can be dampered down way low without much trouble IIRC, but it does burn a little more "efficiently" if you keep the damper open enough that you get the "blue ladies" - short blue flames dancing atop the coalbed that I believe represent burning Carbon Monoxide (as opposed to letting the CO just go up the chimney unburnt).

The Harman stove is also designed to burn coal best, that is to say, if wood was your only fuel source you'd be much better served with a modern EPA certified woodstove. Definitely check out nepacrossroads.com for more coal and Harman Mark 3-specific advice.

 

[oska]

USUALLY I use wood to start the coal fire. The EPA regulations are beyond ridiculous - anyone who has a coal stove will understand the critical importance of building a good wood fire before being able to ignite and keep coal burning. I cannot honestly imagine being able to start a coal fire without having a couple of chords of wood on hand.

Suddenly we're breaking the law if we forget to put coal in after we start a fire? Cmon, that's obvious BS.

It seems obvious to me that the EPA law is just a way for the companies to sell more Wood stoves - I have burned both wood and coal and exclusively with this stove and I get a 2000 square foot house into the upper 70s or lower 80s without any difficulty and there's little smoke from the wood fire.

The man who sold me the stove told me that people burn wood ALL the time, he does it himself and encouraged me to do so.

If it's DESIGNED to burn coal - how could that make any difference, it's all steel isn't it? If anything, the hot coal fire is going to burn off any creasole - and in some ways these stoves are BETTER at burning wood than coal because of the ability to interchange between the two fuel sources readily.

I could be totally wrong about this, because I am a newbie afterall

I'm sorry if I came off rude I just got so angry with such a silly rule that everyone breaks routinely.

 

[spirilis]

I doubt you're actually breaking any laws, and you are right that coal fires need a wood fire to get them started. I think once you really get the hang of that stove you'll end up burning loads of coal at low rate that can ignite a new load, etc...

The stove can obviously burn both wood or coal but one feature of a true "wood" stove is most/maybe all the combustion air hits the wood at level or from above, not below like with coal. I am not sure if the Mark III has adjustable airwash air but if so, a good approximation would be to close your lower air control near the ashpan completely and rely on the airwash air for the fire. Clean burn woodstoves also have additional secondary combustion air at the upper firebox or a catalytic combustor.

A stove admitting underfire air, like all coal stoves, will burn wood way too fast with little control and poor burn times. But that underfire air and shakable grate is required to burn coal correctly. So while you are right that it can burn both coal and wood, it's obviously engineered to burn coal best and doesn't include the efficient secondary combustion system that modern woodstoves employ to get the most heat out of the wood.

 

[begreen]

Take it up with Harman, it's their documentation. Note that they do make the exception for starting the fire, they just haven't designed the stove for wood burning. -...Use of any other fuel, except for the purpose of coal ignition

Running the stove wide open with a wood fire almost certainly will overheat the flue. That is an unsafe condition.

 

[oska]

I doubt you're actually breaking any laws, and you are right that coal fires need a wood fire to get them started. I think once you really get the hang of that stove you'll end up burning loads of coal at low rate that can ignite a new load, etc...

The stove can obviously burn both wood or coal but one feature of a true "wood" stove is most/maybe all the combustion air hits the wood at level or from above, not below like with coal. I am not sure if the Mark III has adjustable airwash air but if so, a good approximation would be to close your lower air control near the ashpan completely and rely on the airwash air for the fire. Clean burn woodstoves also have additional secondary combustion air at the upper firebox or a catalytic combustor.

A stove admitting underfire air, like all coal stoves, will burn wood way too fast with little control and poor burn times. But that underfire air and shakable grate is required to burn coal correctly. So while you are right that it can burn both coal and wood, it's obviously engineered to burn coal best and doesn't include the efficient secondary combustion system that modern woodstoves employ to get the most heat out of the wood.

That was such a helpful response

Thank you so much.

 

[begreen]

5.8 CONTROLLED FIRING Also key to operational safety is avoiding overfiring the stove. This stove features a manually set air intake damper, mounted on the ash door. This consists of a cast, threaded dial, which when turned, allows for adjusting an air gap between the dial and the ash door. Once a fire is established, the main factors determining the position of the intake damper are how much heat is needed and the need to limit overfiring. Stove parts or chimney connectors glowing red are a sure indicator that the damper should be closed down. A chimney connector thermometer is highly recommended for setting the maximum air setting. This can be placed in the first straight section of the chimney connector. As temperatures approach 450º F, limit air so as to reduce the intensity of the fire. Lower temperatures are an indicator of more efficient operation. Keep load doors and ash doors closed, except when attending to or starting fires. Maintain door gaskets in good condition, and inspect them before, during and after the heating season.

The manual is here:
http://static.legacystoves.com/user/150313-InstallManual_Mark_I_II_III.pdf

 

[Dix]

Coal stoves are starting with a wood fire, allowing a wood coal bed to build so the added coal can ignite and start to burn. Once that happens, and as long as the coal fire does not go out,or there are enough coals left to start a new load of coal, there is no need to add firewood to coal stove.

Load, build, bank, shake in the AM for a new load, reload, left it gas off,bank off, and forget about it until time to reload is my experience.

 

[oska]

Related question: how do I install a flu thermometer? Should I ask my friend to come drill a hole in my pipe and stick this little fellow right in there?

Where should I put it, right at the output, at the top, or in the middle of my black pipes?

http://www.amazon.com/Thermometer-3...8850010&sr=8-1&keywords=flue+pipe+thermometer

 

[begreen]

Probe thermometers are for double-wall stove pipe. Do you have single or double-wall stove pipe? If single wall this is the thermometer to get:
http://www.condar.com/Stovepipe_Thermometers.html

 

[oska]

Do you have single or double-wall stove pipe?

Do you have single or double-wall stove pipe?

I don't know - the two men came and installed it - is there a simple way to just look and figure it out?

 

[begreen]

What is the diameter of the pipe? If it is 6" it's probably single wall, if 7" it's probably double-wall. You could post a picture here of the pipe connection at the stove or chimney and we might be able to figure it out.

 

[oska]

It's a 6'' pipe - it's extremely hot to the touch and I just have a little bit of material in there burning - so I'm going to guess that it's single walled.

 

[oska]

These responses have made me so much smarter !! Thanks everyone!!

 

[begreen]

For single wall use a magnetic surface mount thermometer, not a probe thermometer.
http://www.condar.com/Stovepipe_Thermometers.html

 

[oska]

Thank you, this was extremely helpful.

 

[oska]

So I discovered a way to make wood burn in my stove sort of like it would in a typical "wood burning stove".

1. Put 1 inch or so of anthracite coal along the entire bottom.
2. Fire the stove up just like a wood stove.

This seems to limit the airflow sufficiently to prevent the wood from getting demolished in a short amount of time, and it also makes a really nice bed of coals from which future logs can be ignited.