Oil Monster or Pellet Stove During Power Outage

[mralias]

In keeping with the potential storm heading our way in the NE, I would like to know your opinion in which unit I should run if I lose power and have to reply on my whole house generator.

The core question is does the pellet stove run more risk of failure because of the circuitry than a Becket Oil burner based on the knowledge that the generator in all likelihood does not produce a pure sine wave and does have power fluctuations ? Which would you recommend I use.

 

[imacman]

If you have a whole house generator similar to mine (Generac), the pellet stove will run just fine. It does produce a pure sine wave, since it is producing the power the same way the local utility does....a rotor spinning inside a stator winding.

I have never had an issue running the stove off the whole house unit.

 

[tsmith]

What about portable generators? Are they not also a rotor spinning inside a stator winding?

 

[briansol]

if the portable is not marked as inveter, it isn't. My stove sounded 'bad' through a non-inverter genny the few minuets i had it on. you could tell the power was crap. I wouldn't ever spend money on a non-inverter again. sure, they are much cheaper, but there's a reason for it.

 

[tsmith]

I have run my Quad off my genny already but not the Harman yet. It is a regular 6500 watt portable. Sounds like we may need it next week with this hurricane coming up the Eastern Seaboard.

 

[Augmister]

Can you use a UPS unit with sine wave technology with your stove plugged into it and with the generator running and powering the UPS unit? Will that give the the prized sine wave for your stove? Using the UPS as a "filter"? Or does that technology only kick in if the power goes out and the stove is running on the UPS battery array alone?

 

[briansol]

Most ups's will 'pass through' when they see 120v, so it won't really clean up 'street' or even generator power. it simply outputs clean power from it's own batteries.

but, some models may vary. consult the manual of a particular model to find out.

 

[jgrz0610]

Can you use a UPS unit with sine wave technology with your stove plugged into it and with the generator running and powering the UPS unit? Will that give the the prized sine wave for your stove? Using the UPS as a "filter"? Or does that technology only kick in if the power goes out and the stove is running on the UPS battery array alone?

I had the exact same question. If the generator is supplying power will the UPS just "pass through" the dirty power?

 

[jgrz0610]

Most ups's will 'pass through' when they see 120v, so it won't really clean up 'street' or even generator power. it simply outputs clean power from it's own batteries.

but, some models may vary. consult the manual of a particular model to find out.

well there's my answer...

 

[tsmith]

Does the surge protector do anything to protect the stove from the Genny?

 

[briansol]

Yeah, I was trying to find out if some pro audio equipment would do the trick.... something that would always filter line and source, but i haven't found anything under $5000. lol

 

[briansol]

Yes, the ups will still move to battery output instantly like it would if it surges or spikes or sags as a result of the generator. That's the best part about it. All your stuff can run perfect smooth even if your current isn't.

 

[Augmister]

Yes, the ups will still move to battery output instantly like it would if it surges or spikes or sags as a result of the generator. That's the best part about it. All your stuff can run perfect smooth even if your current isn't.

So the question begs.... If I have my stove plugged into the UPS when running the generator and the generator is powering the UPS, the UPS will sense the generator and kick over to battery. Now, with the generator plugged into the UPS, can it charge the batter while it is powering the stove via its battery? Or am I just asking for too much? Thanks for all of your replies. This is important to know and of great value! If I assume that the UPS cannot charge and disburse power at the same time, do I calculate the amperage of the stove and gauge that to the potential output of the UPS battery to figure my exact run time? (How much time I have to run the stove on the UPS battery.)

Disclosure: I am not an electrical engineer nor play one on TV

 

[mnkywrnch]

I actually use my oil when the power goes out,not that my generator won't run my stove it will,I just figure it's a good time work the oil monster a little bit.

 

[Shaw520]

..am I to understand it is not good to run my stove from my 8hp Powermate 4000 with surge protector inline ???

 

[MarkF48]

See #13 inthe article of the link below.....
(broken link removed to http://findgenerators.net/look-for-these-features-when-buying-a-portable-generator.html)

The THD spec may be in the operators manual of your generator or if you have the model number it might be found with an online search.

A surge protector protects equipment from sudden high instantaneous spikes of voltage that might damage equipment and will do nothing in regards to harmonics that may be produced from a generator. Certain types of power line faults can sometimes create these spikes and high voltages which is one reason to have a surge protector on the pellet stove outlet.

 

[briansol]

it depends on your stove. the manual should say if it accepts modified (regular) or only pure sine (inverter) generator power.

batteries in the ups will still charge from the genny as it runs the stove as well. That's how it always has power to it. your unit won't use 100% of the power from the wall and the controller inside the ups can divert a few joules to its battery pack.

 

[jdege]

I let the furnace run during power outages, don't want to chance any damage to the stove running off the generator. The generator is a 5500hp Honda and the stove is plugged into a surge protector on a gfi outlet, but still do not want to chance it.

 

[velvetfoot]

Are electronics at risk? The newer oil monsters are quite smart now.

 

[nate379]

Not the 2 UPS units I have (computer and TV). They go haywire with the generator running the house.

Yes, the ups will still move to battery output instantly like it would if it surges or spikes or sags as a result of the generator. That's the best part about it. All your stuff can run perfect smooth even if your current isn't.

Line power is not as "clean" as most people seem to think.



5500hp engine huh? That's a HELL of a generator!

 

[jdege]

5500 watt not hp, sorry :0)

 

[bonesy]

Folks, I think there is some misinformation here. An APC BackUPS unit will provide pure sine wave power at all times if it is in an online state, whether the power is coming from the electric company or a generator. This is from APC. The caveat is the generator must be properly sized (3-5 times the rating of the entire load that is to be connected to the generator). When the UPS is operating on battery power, it is NOT providing pure sine wave power, but rather step-approximated. Of course their disclaimer is the BackUPS product is designed for computer type loads only, but you get the idea.

 

[BurningMan]

Yeah, I was trying to find out if some pro audio equipment would do the trick.... something that would always filter line and source, but i haven't found anything under $5000. lol

I've been using one of these for TV + Audio for 3 years now.
I like it. Paid under 300$ online. Works VERY well.

http://www.apc.com/products/apcav/products/index.cfm?action=detail&base_sku=H15BLK

 

[Shaw520]

it depends on your stove. the manual should say if it accepts modified (regular) or only pure sine (inverter) generator power.

Ive looked through the OM on my Englander,... I cant find anything that says 'pure sine wave' only,... does anyone know for sure if running my 25- off my Coleman 4000 watt will damage the board ??

 

[dwizum]

When in doubt, call the vendor and ask.

I'm projecting and assuming here, which is dangerous, but I'd say it's a safe bet that the electronics in the control unit for your stove are pretty much safe (they will not be damaged) and happy (they will not malfunction) running off pretty much *any* generator, UPS, or 120v AC power souce. Assuming a robust approach to design, the fragile parts in these types of electronics are typically very isolated from the AC power source so it's really not an issue.

A more likely issue would be that the motors (auger and blower) in the unit won't like the poor wave shape, it's fairly common for inductive loads (like motors) to be "unhappy" with bad wave shapes. They may not turn at all, they may turn slowly, they may make a lot of noise. They probably won't be damaged, but they may not operate properly.

I said this in another recent thread on this topic, but if I were in this position (trying to decide if I the generator or UPS I had would be OK to run my stove in a power outage) I would take this simple approach - simulate the outage by running the stove from the power source for a few minutes. If it looks/acts/sounds/runs like normal, go with it. If it didn't, I'd consider switching to a different brand or model of generator or UPS, and I'd look for one marketed as having a pure sine wave.