Pacific Energy T5 or Napoleon 1100C?

[mgriffin]

Hi Folks,

My family has recently moved to a new home in Rhode Island and we are in the process of deciding which stove is correct for our home and layout. The house is a split level ranch with a total heatable space of approximately 1700 sq. ft. The living space is located on the top floor (1200 sq. ft.); 3 bedrooms and an open sitting/dining/kitchen area. The open common area is 500 sq. ft. with 11 ft vaulted ceilings, the remainder of the house has 7.5 ft ceilings. From what I can tell this fall the house is fairly tight (built 1980). The only insulation which I can get to is in the boiler room (R11), not sure if this is throughout all the walls or a thicker mat used elsewhere? The down stairs of the house can be closed off with doors and is zoned independent from the top floor, so heating this area is not a huge concern.

The stove will be installed in the corner of the common area upstairs with seating 5-7 ft away from the front of the stove (facing the stove), this will be our primary living room. We have boiled our decision down to the Napoleon 1100c or the PE T5 due to close clearances and convective nature of the stoves. We heated our last home 24/7 (850 sq. ft.) with the Napoleon 1100c and were very pleased with it's performance and burn times - perhaps a bit too much heat during the night. My original thought was to go with a slightly bigger fire box (2.0 - 2.5 ft3) due to the increase of heatable area and increased burn times, however, I am concerned with blasting us out of our living room or having to resort to burning small inefficient fires. My questions are as follow:

1) Does anyone have experience with the T5 in this type of setting with seating fairly close to the front of the stove - is it too much stove?

2) Any comments on the performance of either stove to heat the required space described - Napoleon too small?

3) What are the actual measurements of the T5 from back of the stove to the front door? The manual only gives measurements from the back to the front of the ash lip. Keeping a small footprint is important for our set up.

4) Comments on the overall quality of the PE T5 compared to the Napoleon?

I appreciate you advice!
Matt

 

[begreen]

The T5 is a pretty nice stove. It has many great features like the trivet top, etc. but what really sets it apart is the coupled air control which regulates both primary and secondary air. This helps the stove achieve some great burn times. The full stainless manifold/baffle is also a nice feature. Finally the lifetime warranty ices the cake. Between the two I would lean toward the T5, but that is because I have run the big brother of this stove for several years and our next door neighbor has a PE Spectrum which I get to play with.That and I've run never the Nappy 1100c. In light of full disclosure, I am a T6 owner.

 

[Nickolai]

+1 to what begreen stated along with PE stands behind their product with an excellent warranty and they're easy to deal with.
On the other hand, Napoleon isn't nearly as good in the customer service department, and as far as I'm concerned they don't make a product that stands up to any PE let alone a T5 or T6.

 

[Sprinter]

My original thought was to go with a slightly bigger fire box (2.0 - 2.5 ft3) due to the increase of heatable area and increased burn times, however, I am concerned with blasting us out of our living room or having to resort to burning small inefficient fires.

I think that's a good idea. The Napoleon is 1.7 cu ft which seems a bit small for your space. I understand your concern with going too large, but I had the same concern and ended up with a PE Super 27 which is the same stove as the T5 without the surround. I have about the same size heated area and our stove is just about right.

No concern about it being too large, as it is quite easy to build small fires on the warmer days and still be efficient, but it can pump out the heat when you need it and is capable of long burn times if that is important to you. The key to small fires is to use small splits so that the fire builds quickly and gets the flue and secondaries hot quickly. You can always add fuel as needed to keep things where you need them to be.

 

[Grisu]

I also feel that the Napoleon will probably be a bit small for you. You will suffer from short burn times when it gets really cold outside and you crank up the stove for more heat. I would at least look at its bigger brother the 1400.

We can sit 2 ft from our PE Super insert without being cooked out so I doubt the T5 will make it unbearable sitting close by. One more point: How tall is your chimney? The Napoleons usually like a taller flue to get enough draft while the PE stoves do also well on a shorter flue. I have mine on 13 ft of 6" liner and no complaints whatsoever about the draft.

 

[Sprinter]

One more point: How tall is your chimney? The Napoleons usually like a taller flue to get enough draft while the PE stoves do also well on a shorter flue. I have mine on 13 ft of 6" liner and no complaints whatsoever about the draft.

Good point. It may not apply here, but it seems like nearly everything I read about flue heights requires a minimum of 15' for sufficient draft in most cases. But my flue is also only 13' and I've had no draft problems at all even in warmer weather. FWIW.

 

[mgriffin]

Thanks for the information - you have furthered my hunch that the PE is a superior stove. As for the chimney, it will be a straight run through the roof. About 5.5' double walled inside and I reckon another 7'+ of double walled stainless outside? Since the stove will be on the top floor can I expect much heat to move downstairs once the top floor is fully heated? If not, should I consider the heatable space to be 1200 sq. ft. (top floor) instead of both floors (1700 sq. ft.)?


Unfortunately I do not have a dealer local to go look at the stove in person. How does the overall size compare to the Napoleon 1100c? The specs indicate it is only a few inches deeper but pictures make it look like it will take up a much larger footprint.

The information provided on this forum is very helpful.

 

[prezes13]

I have the same layout. 1994 raised ranch. My insert has 2.2 cf fire box it's large enough to heat the upstairs but no hot air will go downstairs. I would go with the bigger stove if I was you. T5 sounds good. Also I would consider installing the stove downstairs if you want the heat there. Our type of house may benefit from it, due to the openness it will make it relatively easy for the warm air to raise upstairs. I didn't do it because I didn't know any better when I was getting my stove. If I knew then what I know now I would have had a bk princess insert upstairs or bk ashford downstairs.... Good luck.

 

[Grisu]

Thanks for the information - you have furthered my hunch that the PE is a superior stove.

Don't be fooled; lots of PE fanboys and -girls here. (Myself included ) I am sure you will also find a lot of happy Napoleon owners if you keep looking.

As for the chimney, it will be a straight run through the roof. About 5.5' double walled inside and I reckon another 7'+ of double walled stainless outside?

That is short and will certainly make the T5 the better choice. Even then you may need to add some pipe. Is your house rather airtight? An outside air kit may be required for good draft.

Since the stove will be on the top floor can I expect much heat to move downstairs once the top floor is fully heated?

Expect none as warm air will not go down and yes the space to be heated will then only be 1200 sqft. Still, that's no problem with the T5 and when you want less heat just load less wood or reduce your reloading frequency.

Unfortunately I do not have a dealer local to go look at the stove in person. How does the overall size compare to the Napoleon 1100c? The specs indicate it is only a few inches deeper but pictures make it look like it will take up a much larger footprint.

Maybe that will help in figuring out how much space to reserve for the hearth: (broken link removed)

 

[Thislilfishy]

My two cents, if you're on a budget then go with the 1400 series
Napoleon, which I got. It's a no frills stove that you can burn wood in. I can't foresee any reason for needing Napoleon for servicing this thing. Perhaps some new baffles and fire bricks over the years. Now, if I had the money I most definitely would have gone with a blaze king. In fact I made my hearth pad big enough for the princess in the future if we come up with the cash or catch a sale. I think you will find the 1100 and similar sized stoves too small. I have a two story 200 year old home that's as drafty as a shed, and the 1400 keeps the house toasty in 32 degree weather. Not so sure it's gonna be able to do mid winter stuff (our weather is similar to yours I think) without some propane back up.

Ian

 

[mgriffin]

Sounds like the T5 is a good bet. Just to open another can of worms - any thoughts on cast iron catalytic stoves that would fit the bill. The crux with catalytic is that we need a close corner clearance as space is a premium in our seating area and I can't seem to find one that would take up the same foot print at the T5. It seems tough to beat the clearances of jacketed stoves which is why we ended up purchasing a Napoleon 1100 in our last home. At any rate I thought I would get some insight from the knowledge base here before I pull the trigger on the T5.

The extra maintenance and care of the catalyst is not a negative for me. The increased efficiency and burn time coupled with the ability to burn long slow fires is appealing.

Thanks - Matt

 

[jimdrea]

I have a Napoleon 1400 and I'm very happy with it.No issues at all. Good burn times and a fairly large fire box. We bought it last March to offset our oil burning .

 

[jeff_t]

Blaze King Ashford needs 4" off the corners.

 

[billb3]

<< My original thought was to go with a slightly bigger fire box (2.0 - 2.5 ft3) due to the increase of heatable area and increased burn times, however, I am concerned with blasting us out of our living room or having to resort to burning small inefficient fires.

That extra .5 will likely be appreciated in Jan/Feb.
Smaller fires will be more a case of shorter duration than more inefficient. They'll likely be the same size you were used to with the 1.7 ft3 box.

I'd be more concerned with stuffing and pushing a 1.7 ft3 box in Jan/Feb.
Depending on what percentage of wood heating you are trying to accomplish.

A ceiling fan on low might help depending on how much air movement you get from the cooler rooms of the house.

 

[mgriffin]

We will be using the stove as our primary heat 24/7. Smaller fires while awake seems logical to keep the heat in control. My concern is overheating 1200 square ft when stuffing the box for an overnight burn or while away from the house. As previously stated 500 square ft of the home has 11ft vaulted ceilings.

Any thoughts or experience running the T5 or similar stoves in 1200 square ft?

 

[begreen]

With the tall ceiling you have additional cu. ftg. to heat. The T5 will do the job. You won't overheat the place unless you want to. Run partial loads of fuel in milder weather and full loads when it gets below freezing. Or consider a cat stove that has a thermostat from Blaze King or perhaps a Woodstock Keystone?

 

[mgriffin]

Thanks begreen. The Blaze King Ashford 20 does look like a mighty nice stove. I could certainly have a less enjoyable task as the current - deciding on a new stove. Now the trick is to actually make a decision before I drive my wife mad!

 

[Offset]

Similar size home, ours has cathedral ceilings. The T5 works well, small fires to keep the damp cool nights away however when you need the heat it will pump it out. It is efficient in its use of wood, we get a good overnight burn with a great bed of coals for the morning. It burns amazingly clean.

We actually rearrange our furniture in the winter to sit in front of the stove. I could drive people out I guess but we find it comfortable to sit five to six feet away. We also have two ceiling fans 72" and a 48" that really makes a difference.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[mgriffin]

We decided to go with the t5 and have been burning it for a week now. My first impression is very good - excellent build and burn. Thanks for the previous input; it always helps to have first hand accounts from those who have used the unit.

Matt

 

[Offset]

Congratulations on your new T5. We have had our for T5 three seasons now and it is a great stove. You will not be disappointed.

Good luck.