Pellet stove Install issues

[dizzymisslizzy]

Hello everyone, I'm brand new here and to pellet stoves so bear with me. We just finished our garage and bought a Castle Serenity pellet stove and a Duravent vent kit. My husband and I installed the stove ourselves and it sets off the smoke alarm every time we run it. We siliconed the joints upon install, then added silicone where the collar meets the vent on the back of the stove, wrapped the joints in self fusing silicone tape, got fed up and wrapped the entire vent in silicone tape, and it is STILL leaking smoke somewhere. I've fired it up twice since then with the light off and a laser beam/flashlight and I can't see any more leaks.
We installed the vent exactly according to its instructions, except we added a 45 degree elbow for a corner placement. I believe there is a joint inside the wall thimble where the pipe meets the tee, could that be the leak? We did not tape there after caulking and placing the vent.
We're fairly handy, we've installed our Drolet Savannah woodstove in two houses and it operates and passed inspection with no problems. It's been our primary heat source for 16 years, so it's a bit mind boggling that pellet stoves turned out to be such a nightmare. We've been researching and troubleshooting this thing for weeks. I really don't know what else to try.
Again, I'm a total noob here so thank you for your patience and help!
PS as you can see we broke the OAK during this process. We will repair it once we get the stove operational.

 

[bogieb]

We installed the vent exactly according to its instructions, except we added a 45 degree elbow for a corner placement. I believe there is a joint inside the wall thimble where the pipe meets the tee, could that be the leak? We did not tape there after caulking and placing the vent.
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If there is a joint inside the wall thimble, the install is not correct. There should NEVER be a joint inside the thimble or wall.

Also, the stove may be emitting enough off-gassing from the paint to set off the alarm. After a couple of runs the paint should burn in.

 

[stvigi1960]

My Harmon smoked the first 3 times I ran it during startup. Determined it was burning off oil or paint used during manufacturing, no problems since.

 

[rickwai]

If it is a pipe leak you will smell wood smoke. If it is the stove burning off paint and oils from manufacturing it will smell hot. What kind of smell are you getting?

 

[gfreek]

If there is a joint inside the wall thimble, the install is not correct. There should NEVER be a joint inside the thimble or wall.

Also, the stove may be emitting enough off-gassing from the paint to set off the alarm. After a couple of runs the paint should burn in.

Yes

 

[dizzymisslizzy]

I suspected the paint initially but ran it full blast for over two hours, plus for an hour at least five other times and the alarm still goes off after about 45 minutes. I believe it is the smell of smoke, it has a distinct scent not exactly the same as wood stove smoke but not chemical-y as I would expect curing paint to be. I just don't know where else a leak could be at this point, other than inside the wall.
So we if need to get that seam moved out of the wall thimble I have a few questions.
1. As you can see in the picture, the seam is pushed in there because the vent runs vertically up the outside of the garage and is secured with an anchor at the top. So to move the tee (?) at the bottom outward, and the seam with it, the vertical vent will then be several inches away from the outer wall. Is that acceptable and safe? Would I look for an anchor that sticks out a ways and discard the one that came with the kit?
2. I'm pretty sure that once we move this whole setup backwards, that the corner of the stove will be less than the 5" from the wall required by the building code. So we would have to add a horizontal length to the vent inside to get the stove far enough out from the wall... That would mean two 12" straight pieces, plus the adapter and elbow before the tee instead of just the one in the pictures. Is that going to cause problems?
Thank you for the responses so far! I'm really at a loss here.

 

[Mt Bob]

Are you sure your outside air is sealed off?

 

[zrock]

A couple of things did you run a pipe through the thimble or did you just use the thimble itself as the pipe? All the ones i have ever used you run your stove pipe through the thimble. Are you sure you smoke detector is not picking up the heat from the stove and tripping the alarm. You say you just finished your garage so is it a living space now or still used as a garage? If its still used as a garage check you local building code and insurance, most places i have seen require the stove to be 18-24 inches off the floor so if their are any fumes from leaking gas or something it will not ignite instantly..

 

[Pelleting In NJ]

Try unsealing the OAK pipe.

 

[nh-jjyy]

we hired someone to install for us and the first burn, I could see some smoke in the room. but after that, no more smoke again. Your installation is not right, you should not have smoke leaking

 

[tbear853]

I suspected the paint initially but ....... etc ............. I'm really at a loss here.

I'd pull that vent down, then put it back with a single piece of pellet vent through that thimble so that there is NO joints inside the wall. In your pics, I see the end in the house, but that piece never made it out the other side. Might just need a few more inches longer piece of vent. They are available like 12" long, 18, 24, etc. That Tee should not enter the thimble outside. A longer piece will mean a new wall bracket.

I can't tell, for sure, but it looks like the outside air intake is maybe too close to pellet vent exhaust exit too, may be that is letting or even pulling smoke into the home.

The pellet flue gases are being pushed out and fresh air is being pulled in ... by a fan. It ain't by convection alone.

 

[gfreek]

Is the wall opening for OAK sealed off for now ?? You could be sucking in the exhaust into the area ... One thing to consider is access to the rear of the stove, enough room for service ? I see no issue with further away from the corner.. Maybe a 6 or 12 inch pipe, get the pipe joint out of the wall thimble. Quick search found, adjustable wall straps, wall strap extensions, enough space away from the wall or make a diy spacer block for the straps..

 

[rickwai]

I never liked that box store style of Duravent withe the rope gasket. We use the PelltVent Pro which is oring type sealed. No silicone or tape needed. Just twist lock and it is 100% sealed. We just did a install yesterday that is an identical set up as yours and not a trace of leaks.

 

[stvigi1960]

I have to ask, if you have it inspected by the building inspector? Where I live in Massachusetts it's the law. When my stove was installed by professional installers the building inspector had to sign off as acceptable. Your homeowners insurance may not payout if there was a fire and no inspection was performed. This may differ in other states.
My insurance agent also asked me the
same questions about it being inspected when I called to inform him of the install ( my insurance did not go up).

 

[VintageGal]

I install my smoke detectors inside and outside of my bedroom. That is my lawful requirement. You might not need to have a smoke detector near the stove.

 

[stvigi1960]

I install my smoke detectors inside and outside of my bedroom. That is my lawful requirement. You might not need to have a smoke detector near the stove.

Did you try the dollar bill test on the door?,

 

[dizzymisslizzy]

A couple of things did you run a pipe through the thimble or did you just use the thimble itself as the pipe? All the ones i have ever used you run your stove pipe through the thimble. Are you sure you smoke detector is not picking up the heat from the stove and tripping the alarm. You say you just finished your garage so is it a living space now or still used as a garage? If its still used as a garage check you local building code and insurance, most places i have seen require the stove to be 18-24 inches off the floor so if their are any fumes from leaking gas or something it will not ignite instantly..

Yes the pipe is run through the thimble, but the joint is in there. Is it possible for heat to trip a smoke alarm? We've never had that happen with the wood stove in the house. It is usable space now instead of garage but detached from the house. Is that building code specific for pellet stoves? It wasn't in the manual and the wood stove is up to code at floor level.

I'd pull that vent down, then put it back with a single piece of pellet vent through that thimble so that there is NO joints inside the wall. In your pics, I see the end in the house, but that piece never made it out the other side. Might just need a few more inches longer piece of vent. They are available like 12" long, 18, 24, etc. That Tee should not enter the thimble outside. A longer piece will mean a new wall bracket.

Ok, that's good information thank you. So it shouldn't be an issue for the vertical section to be out a ways from the house? Wind won't damage it or something?
I'm definitely going to do this, but just out of curiosity why aren't joints allowed in the wall thimble?

Is the wall opening for OAK sealed off for now ?? You could be sucking in the exhaust into the area ... One thing to consider is access to the rear of the stove, enough room for service ? I see no issue with further away from the corner.. Maybe a 6 or 12 inch pipe, get the pipe joint out of the wall thimble. Quick search found, adjustable wall straps, wall strap extensions, enough space away from the wall or make a diy spacer block for the straps..

I will definitely test it with the OAK sealed off, it isn't right now. If you could link a suitable wall strap I would be very grateful, if not ill do some digging myself.

I never liked that box store style of Duravent withe the rope gasket. We use the PelltVent Pro which is oring type sealed. No silicone or tape needed. Just twist lock and it is 100% sealed. We just did a install yesterday that is an identical set up as yours and not a trace of leaking

I never liked that box store style of Duravent withe the rope gasket. We use the PelltVent Pro which is oring type sealed. No silicone or tape needed. Just twist lock and it is 100% sealed. We just did a install yesterday that is an identical set up as yours and not a trace of leaks.

Hindsight is 20/20... I just bought the one recommended with the stove. I have this book marked for the future when replacement time comes.

I have to ask, if you have it inspected by the building inspector? Where I live in Massachusetts it's the law. When my stove was installed by professional installers the building inspector had to sign off as acceptable. Your homeowners insurance may not payout if there was a fire and no inspection was performed. This may differ in other states.
My insurance agent also asked me the
same questions about it being inspected when I called to inform him of the install ( my insurance did not go up).

Not yet as the stove is not operating properly. Once it's fixed of course we will.

 

[gfreek]

Not sure which Pelletvent you have but here are some links for wall straps:

3'' PelletVent Pro Adjustable Wall Strap - 3PVP-WSA

3'' PelletVent Pro Adjustable Wall Strap - 3PVP-WSA - 3PVP-WSA - The Simpson PelletVent Pro Wall Strap is used to support vent pipe or tee sections and adjusts to provide 1" - 3" clearance.PelletVent Pro is a ve - NorthlineExpress.com

www.northlineexpress.com

3'' PelletVent Pro Wall Strap Extension - 3PVP-WSA-EXT

3'' PelletVent Pro Wall Strap Extension - 3PVP-WSA-EXT - 3PVP-WSA-EXT - The Simpson PelletVent Pro Wall Strap Extension is used with the Adjustable Wall Strap to increase extension from wall.PelletVent Pro is a venting system - NorthlineExpress.com

www.northlineexpress.com

 

[dizzymisslizzy]

Beautiful. I will make these changes and give an update after. Thank you so much to everyone!

 

[tbear853]

but just out of curiosity why aren't joints allowed in the wall thimble?

Every joint is a possible leak at some time, you don't want them hidden in a wall surrounded in close quarters between flammables like wall studs or insulation, etc. Pellet vent does get hot to your hand as you know, but you're just feeling a outer shell spaced away from the much hotter inner stainless steel liner. It's a thin stainless steel, but it survives hot corrosive flue gasses that may also be carrying red hot, even glowing, embers or fly ash.. The wall thimble is usually very close to the stove itself, so the exhaust gasses are still thier hottest. The exhaust from a pellet stove is being pushed through the pellet vent, it is under a pressure, it is not being drawn by convection. If a leak happens at a joint, flue gasses will escape ... hot flue gasses. You don't want that inside a wall.

 

[dizzymisslizzy]

Just to update everyone who helped out... OAK is definitely not the problem we ran the stove with it blocked and smoke detector went off as usual. I'm waiting on parts to see if re-sealing and moving that joint in the wall helps.
Had a relative over who has used a pellet stove for 20 years and he suggested the stove itself might be defective. Is that possible? Thoughts?

 

[mtnbiker727]

Just to update everyone who helped out... OAK is definitely not the problem we ran the stove with it blocked and smoke detector went off as usual. I'm waiting on parts to see if re-sealing and moving that joint in the wall helps.
Had a relative over who has used a pellet stove for 20 years and he suggested the stove itself might be defective. Is that possible? Thoughts?

Fix the obviously wrong situation inside the wall of your house, and then if you still have smoke, start thinking about other things after that.

 

[gfreek]

Any update on this ?