Pellet surge protector questions

[Cheeks]

I read online somewhere that it should be UL/1449 approved, at most 400 volts clamping, and least 600 joules absorption. Does that sound about right? I have a GCI60 (EnviroM55) pellet insert.

I've also read that some people do whole house surge protection. Has anyone done that in place of, or to supplement the direct plug surge protector?

Any protector recommendations? I would need several plugs since we have a lamp, tv, cable box, dvd player nearby too.

Thanks for any info.

 

[smoke show]

Any protector recommendations? I would need several plugs since we have a lamp, tv, cable box, dvd player nearby too.

Thanks for any info.

http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-TL...T3Q2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1330114915&sr=8-1

 

[imacman]

Many of us are using this unit....comes in white too:

http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-UL...cp_4_S9XX?ie=UTF8&refRID=1E7J17GF54GJTR4YEPVZ

 

[john193]

This is what I'm using with my Mt Vernon. The single plug was ideal for me as my stove is plugged into its own outlet which is hidden behind furniture.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006BBAB/ref=ox_ya_os_product

even with a surge protector, unplug your stove during the off season

 

[Rowdysdad]

I've had great luck with these.

http://www.amazon.com/Tripp-Lite-IS...id=1378092922&sr=8-2&keywords=triplite+isobar

 

[smoke show]

I would need several plugs...

Many of us are using this unit....comes in white too:

I read Cheeks post as needing more than 2 receptacles.

 

[Cheeks]

Well I do have a lot of plugs in that area near the fireplace. It isn't necessary that they all go through the same protector, but most of my other are your standard Staple's powerstrip/surge protector. In fact one failed recently and my computer monitor was fried (so was our cable line and septic processor).I was thinking I get a good one and put everything through it. Thanks for all the feedback!

 

[imacman]

I read Cheeks post as needing more than 2 receptacles.

Then the one you mentioned would fit the bill.

 

[BrotherBart]

Yeah those both have 140v clamping voltage which is great protection. My units are rack mount 330v clamping but twelve outlets each and 20 amps. And cost a car payment.

 

[westom]

In fact one failed recently and my computer monitor was fried (so was our cable line and septic processor).I was thinking

To understand why it failed means learning how surges do damage and why that protector did not claim to protect from that type of surge. The concepts were originally introduced in elementary school science.

Lightning seeks earth ground. A path for a 20,000 amp electric surge is via a wooden church steeple destructively to earth. Wood is not a good conductor. So 20,000 amps creates a high voltage. 20,000 amps times a high voltage is high energy. Church steeple damaged.

Franklin installed a lightning rod. Now 20,000 amps are via a wire to an earthing electrode. High current creates near zero voltage. 20,000 amps times a near zero voltage is near zero energy. Nothing damaged.

Lightning seeks earth ground. A lightning strike to utility wires far down the street is a direct strike, incoming to every household appliance, destructively to earth. Appliances are not a good conductor. So lightning creates a high voltage. Lightning current times a high voltage is high energy. Appliances damaged.

For over 100 years, facilities that cannot have damage installed superior earthing connected low impedance (ie 'less than 10 feet') via one 'whole house' protector. Then high current creates near zero voltage. 20,000 amps times a near zero voltage is near zero energy. No appliance is damaged.

A lightning rod does not do protection. A connection to and the earth ground electrode defines that protection. A protector does not do protection. A connect to and the earth ground electrode defines that protection. Where was the earth ground connection for that failed protector? Does not exist.

Some incoming wires do not even need a protector. Best protection for cable TV is a short (ie 'less than 10 foot') hardwire connected to earth ground. No protector required. Telephone wires cannot connect directly to earth. So the next best thing, a 'whole house' protector (installed for free by the telco), makes that same connection to earth.

AC wires are entering without an earth ground connection if you did not install a 'whole house' protector. Even that monitor's protector and protectors recommended by others needs protection only provided by an earthed 'whole house' protector. A low impedance connection (ie 'less than 10 feet', no sharp wire bends, etc).

A lightning rod or protector are only as effective as its earth ground.

 

[Harman Lover 007]

Class dismissed.......

 

[briansol]

I use the ups in my sig. buys me about an hour of run time post-power, plus has a 'pure sine' like line modifier (avr) to clean up dirty signals, and has 1030 joules of surge clamp.

Through the avr, it automatically increases low utility power and decreases high utility power to a consistent and safe 110/120 volts. If incoming utility voltage drops below 90 volts, or exceeds 140 volts the units automatically switch to battery back-up power, so the surge is behind the scenes entirely. where these trip lites turn off power, my stove keeps on burning, for up to an hour....

 

[westom]

I use the ups in my sig. buys me about an hour of run time post-power, plus has a 'pure sine' like line modifier (avr) to clean up dirty signals, and has 1030 joules of surge clamp.

My 120 volt UPS outputs 200 volt square waves with a spike of up to 270 volts. Ideal power for electronics. And may be potentially harmful to motorized appliances. It is also called a pure sine wave output. They did not lie. Square waves and spikes are nothing more than a sum of pure sine waves.

Read specs for that CyberPower UPS. It does not even claim to be a pure sine wave. It is an adaptive sine wave. Meaning it can also output square waves and spikes. A pure sine wave (as many desire) typically means a UPS costing about $1000.

Destructive surges are hundreds of thousands of joules. So what does 1030 joules do inside the CyberPower? 1030 means it only uses 340 joules during a surge. And never more than 690 joules. Cyberpower claims near zero protection during a destructive type of surge. But just enough above zero so that many will 'know' it does surge protection.

 

[briansol]

hence why I said pure sine LIKE. it is not pure, but it's close.
I've driven my stove off a pos generator, and it screamed and whined real bad. hated it.
on the ups, it's completely happy as if its plugged into the wall.

read up more in the docs... it runs invertor mode on battery.
it only uses the AVR when on street power, which has its waves already in a nicer shape from the lines. if the voltage is over 240, it shuts off the street power and goes to running on the battery inverter. Thus, hopefully, not passing on the surge to the device.

It's certainly not the be all end all device. its 190 bucks. what do you expect?
but consider that the strips and tripp lites mentioned offer only like 1300 vs this 1000 joules, it's not much difference really by your own point.

 

[westom]

hence why I said pure sine LIKE. it is not pure, but it's close.
I've driven my stove off a pos generator, and it screamed and whined real bad. hated it.
on the ups, it's completely happy as if its plugged into the wall.

Some background: If a UPS is a sine wave, then it says so with spec numbers such as %THD. No such numbers means it is probably far from a sine wave. Ideal for electronics. And potentially harmful to motorized appliances. At $190, it is questionable. Not as bad as a $60 UPS.

"The strips and tripp lites mentioned" also do not claim to protect from typically destructive surges. Take a $3 power strip. Add some ten cent protector parts. Sell it for $25 or $60. A profit center with near zero joules that only claims to protect from a type of surge that typically does not do damage. A completely different device, unfortunately also called a protector, does protect from all types of surges.

Surges occur so quickly that maybe 100 consecutive surges could pass through a UPS before its AVR kicked in.

How often do your incandescent bulbs dim to 75% intensity? Never? Then AVR is doing nothing useful. Protection from voltage variations is predominately hearsay based mostly in fear. If your voltage is changing significantly, then your bulbs are doing major intensity changes.

If voltage is at 140 volts, then incandescent bulbs are failing about 6 or 7 times faster.

If AVR is needed, then it is also needed for a refrigerator and furnace.

BTW, battery life expectancy for a typical UPS is three years.

 

[skibumm100]

I did a whole house unit.

(broken link removed to http://www.intermatic.com/Products/SurgeProtectiveDevices/IG_Series/IG3240RC3.aspx)

I also have a cheap power strip at the stove but that's because we plug in laptops and stuff there also. I can't say how effective the whole house unit is. The green LED is still on. It's been installed about 8 months. Personally, I think we get a little carried away with our zeal for surge protection for our stoves. A lot of stuff in my house has electronic circuit cards and motors and they don't fail every time we get a thunderstorm or lose power (or half of it) from ice storms. What makes a stove any different? If they are that electrically "fragile", someone didn't do a good job designing it. S*&% happens, stuff blows up. If you get a big enough strike, your stove will be one of the minor problems. I ran mine off a plain old "dirty power" generator for a few days last year....before the surge protector. No funny noises, no problems. I've run six days on the genny at a pop and no problems from anything. I run my whole house off it except for electric HW, elec stove and the clothes dryer. Protection is good but I don't lose sleep over it. You guys can all link back to this thread when I'm asking how to fix my burned up control board.

 

[Cheeks]

skibumm, i agree with your statement: "A lot of stuff in my house has electronic circuit cards and motors and they don't fail every time we get a thunderstorm or lose power (or half of it) from ice storms. What makes a stove any different? If they are that electrically "fragile", someone didn't do a good job designing it. S*&% happens, stuff blows up."

anyhow, i've ordered the isobar4ultra tripp lite. one for my computer stuff too. thanks for all the input.