PLEASE HELP!!!!! Newbie with a major problem!!!

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Hi to all, I have been reading around on the forum for the past couple of weeks but just created my account today so I would first like to say Hi to all and I appreciate any help anyone gives me.
So lets just dive right into this, I just purchased an Englander 13-NCI Stove Insert. The stove arived today and I am thrilled with its apearance and manufacturing. I have an existing fireplace encased with brick and was going to break out the brick, install my new unit, and then mortar flagstone around it.... So I thought..... Upon breaking out some of the brick today I have discovered that I have a pre-fab fireplace that just sits in a dead space in the corner of the room on an outside wall with no firebrick. (I am surprised the house has not burnt down with some of the fires we have had in it). So what should I do? I want to keep my Stove insert as paying for the freight to ship it back is out of the question, plus, I want the look of a fireplace in the living room. I know that basicly I have to build a fireplace from scratch, but how do I do it? Since this has come to light I will probably move the fireplace to an inside wall while I have the chance. I am a major do-it-yourselfer and dont have the funds right now to hire a professional but I feel I have what it takes to complete this job safely with a little help from friends in the forum.
Any advice, help, or further needed questions are greatly greatly appreciated and I look forward to becoming a wood burning guru!
I have also included some pics of what I am dealing with to aid in solving my delema.

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Ok, I have been searching around on the web and so far it seems that I can get away with installing my insert just about anywhere with my Flex King linere without much work, So do I need to construct a surround made of firebrick or can I use cement board and or plain brick to build a surround and mount for my insert?
Thanks again guys/gals for any help!

 

[ckdeuce]

Ok, I have been searching around on the web and so far it seems that I can get away with installing my insert just about anywhere with my Flex King linere without much work, So do I need to construct a surround made of firebrick or can I use cement board and or plain brick to build a surround and mount for my insert?
Thanks again guys/gals for any help!

I went to englanders web-site and looked at the install specs, and on page 4 it says that it has to be in a masonry fireplace and not a wood framed unit with bricks. I'm noe expert, just passing it allong. Chris

 

[doubledip]

Hi to all, I have been reading around on the forum for the past couple of weeks but just created my account today so I would first like to say Hi to all and I appreciate any help anyone gives me.
So lets just dive right into this, I just purchased an Englander 13-NCI Stove Insert. The stove arived today and I am thrilled with its apearance and manufacturing. I have an existing fireplace encased with brick and was going to break out the brick, install my new unit, and then mortar flagstone around it.... So I thought..... Upon breaking out some of the brick today I have discovered that I have a pre-fab fireplace that just sits in a dead space in the corner of the room on an outside wall with no firebrick. (I am surprised the house has not burnt down with some of the fires we have had in it). So what should I do? I want to keep my Stove insert as paying for the freight to ship it back is out of the question, plus, I want the look of a fireplace in the living room. I know that basicly I have to build a fireplace from scratch, but how do I do it? Since this has come to light I will probably move the fireplace to an inside wall while I have the chance. I am a major do-it-yourselfer and dont have the funds right now to hire a professional but I feel I have what it takes to complete this job safely with a little help from friends in the forum.
Any advice, help, or further needed questions are greatly greatly appreciated and I look forward to becoming a wood burning guru!
I have also included some pics of what I am dealing with to aid in solving my delema.

Read this before installing
http://www.englandsstoveworks.com/manuals/13-NCI.pdf

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Yeah, I read the same thing, but I think I am around my major worry of having to build a full chimney all the way up to the roof. I believe I can just build a masonry hearth and casing around my unit, and then install the flex liner in a dead space through the attick and out the roof.
Anyone have any thoughts on this???
Thanks for your help!

 

[ckdeuce]

Yeah, I read the same thing, but I think I am around my major worry of having to build a full chimney all the way up to the roof. I believe I can just build a masonry hearth and casing around my unit, and then install the flex liner in a dead space through the attick and out the roof.
Anyone have any thoughts on this???
Thanks for your help!

Don't think so. A liner into a chimney, not "dead space". Now if you bought class A chimney, it can go in an enclosed dead space with 2" clearance. But not a liner. Again, I'm no expert, but a liner will NOT protect your home if it is just in dead space. I will leave this for those who know more than I, but please be safe.
Chris

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Will do, I dont plan on doing anything untill I have definate answers. I am on hold right now waiting to talk to a tech with englander stoves.

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Well..... I found out that if I keep my fireplace location I can use my existing flu and run my FlexKing insulated flu liner straight up it from my stove. I have been told I can tear out the old pre-fab unit and put the insert in its place and then I can encase the unit in firebrick and that will keep my safe from any fires.
Does anyone have anything to add that I should also be aware of or to look out for?
Thanks again

 

[BrotherBart]

Well..... I found out that if I keep my fireplace location I can use my existing flu and run my FlexKing insulated flu liner straight up it from my stove. I have been told I can tear out the old pre-fab unit and put the insert in its place and then I can encase the unit in firebrick and that will keep my safe from any fires.
Does anyone have anything to add that I should also be aware of or to look out for?
Thanks again

Who did you find that out from?

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

I was told this by a masonry foreman that is a buddy of mines boss. They are part of the Brick layers union and have installed several inserts before so I would asume they know what they are talking about but I just wanted to get as many opinions as possible.

 

[Hurricane]

What you have installed now is called an insert by some people. If they installed the zero clearance insert that way it would be fine but not the insert you are looking to install. I would get my info from a certified installer, the manufacturer and the local inspector that needs to sign off on it. I can tell you that the local inspector will be going by what is in the owners installation manual.

 

[ansehnlich1]

I am NOT trying to be smart here, but I don't get a good feeling about this install.

I looked at the manual and I highly recommend you do the same.

Maybe you should contact a professional wood burning appliance installer for advice....AND contact your insurance company to get their input too.

You ain't gonna want to hear this but, for the cost you'll spend on building a masonry fireplace to code, along with a hearth that meets code, along with a chimney that meets code, you may very well be better off trying to trade out that insert for a standard wood stove of your choosing and run class A pipe the tradtional way straight up through the internal envelope of your home if that is possible.

 

[pen]

I am NOT trying to be smart here, but I don't get a good feeling about this install.

I looked at the manual and I highly recommend you do the same.

Maybe you should contact a professional wood burning appliance installer for advice....AND contact your insurance company to get their input too.

You ain't gonna want to hear this but, for the cost you'll spend on building a masonry fireplace to code, along with a hearth that meets code, along with a chimney that meets code, you may very well be better off trying to trade out that insert for a standard wood stove of your choosing and run class A pipe the tradtional way straight up through the internal envelope of your home if that is possible.

My thoughts (and condolences) as well. That's a good insert, you'll have no trouble being able to find a new owner. I really think it would save you a lot of work (if nothing else) in the end. The other nice thing about a free standing stove versus an insert is that you don't need the blower to get lots of heat from them. When the power goes out, i'll take a stand alone over an insert any day.

pen

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

Ok, First I would like to say I realy appreciate all of the info you have all given me, your concern for my safety is the same as mine and is why I am on this forum. I did some more researching and found an article on here about converting an existing zero-clearence unit.
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/wiki/Convert_Prefab_Fireplace/
I am not trying to argue with anyone as I am no position to do so but this is basicly doing the second of the two options, except going a step further by insulating the unit with brick up past the stove top, up to the existing flu which is a class A triple liner flu. The unit will sit on a cement pad 8" thick, covered with firebrick. The folks and Englander told me that basicly if this unit had legs it could be used right out in the open, but it doesnt so sitting it on my set-up of cement/firebrick is the same as inserting it into a fireplace. As an extra level of safety I am installing a flex-King insulated liner from the stove to the cap.
Like I stated, safety is my no. 1 concern and I just wanted to get as much input as possible on this and see if anyone could add to it.
Thank you all again for your help!

 

[Dix]

Where's Mike?

I know he's busy right now, but....

 

[Creek-Chub]

Where's Mike?

I know he's busy right now, but....

He's probably sleeping. I played phone tag with him a few times today, and he was swamped.

 

[CamaroCrazyChris]

New post started... See the following post...

"Considering your advice and not my brick layer!"

Thanks again to all!