Problems with harmon p68

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jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
Have a harmon P 68 lost the motor with in 3 weeks of using stove.Since than i have a new motor and the sqeeking noise.but now i find that i am burning a lot more pellets i have a very low flame but the big thing it is not pushing the ash over the edge and the service tech says everything is ok.What could be the problem i find the pellets are staying around the bottom of the burn pot and it takes a long time to get them moving a liottle bit.
 

newf lover

Minister of Fire
Jul 17, 2008
671
Eastern CT
I'm certainly no expert, but do own a P68. What motor are you talking about? Feed motor? The flame on my P68 is very large, like this, which is a link to Harman website.
http://hnh.hearthnhome.com/Video/productRawVideos/HarmanP68PelletStove.swf
The pellets burning and auger turning should push the ash over the edge. If you are saying you have a very low flame, something is not right. Not feeding enough pellets? The ESP not reading the temperature correctly? Where is your room sensor? If I have mine in back of the stove, the stove behaves very differently than when I stretch it out and put it on the floor next to the stove.
When does the stove squeak? When the auger's turning? Mine squeaked when I got it,a nd after several visits they grinded the crap out of the auger; it's been fine since.
Anyway, I think more info is needed before anyone can try and help. The service tech doesn't sound very impressive so far...
 

jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
room sensor is behind the stove.the feed motor gave out and was replaced i do believe it is the motor from the noises coming out of it but they say i am wrong
 

newf lover

Minister of Fire
Jul 17, 2008
671
Eastern CT
Are they telling you the squeak is normal??!!! What are they saying it is? Properly working pellet stoves don't squeak. If they are fairly close by I would pay them a visit, preferably with other customers around and talk nicely but loudly. Is this a 3 week old stove, or did you buy it used? when you say the big thing is it"s not pushing ash over the edge where is it going?
 
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Lousyweather

Guest
Depending on the p68, dont forget that Harman changed the feed motors from 4 rpm to 6 rpm.....if you had an old 4 rpm model, and they replaced it with a 6 rpm feed motor, all other settings the same, you'd use pellets at a prodigious rate.......gotta check those serial numbers on p68's to determine which motor it needs to be....just a guess....

As for the squeek......check for carbon buildup at the end of the auger....
 

jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
i bought the stove new in august stove was made feb 2009 so i am assuming it is a 6 rpm motor what it was replaced by who knows i will have to check as for the noise i did everything that i found here on this site to do but nothing worked still have the squeek and yes the dealer is saying the noise is normal but when i say it didn't happen with the first motor they say it would of.I also have to say when it starts up the flame is fine but after it reaches it temp and shuts doen it burns the pellets by the auger than when it kicks in again and fills the burn pot it only fills the spot that was completly burned.picture a big whole it fills it so nothing gets pushed out
 

HEMI

Feeling the Heat
Aug 17, 2009
465
connecticut
when i burn mine in temp mode my flame is fine then when it reaches its temp the flame goes down to a small one, or the stove will shut down because its not calling for anymore heat....if your in temp mode your not gonna have a consistent flame......mine also has yet to push ash over the edge for the simple fact that i'm really not getting enough for it to do that. if your in temp mode i think your running pretty normal....but hey what do I know, just my 2c
 

newf lover

Minister of Fire
Jul 17, 2008
671
Eastern CT
If you are getting enough heat, and the stove is getting up to temp, I wouldn't worry too much about the ash. I am assuming it starts right up, you have no problem with it shuting down when it shouldn't etc. I would, however be concerned that your stove squeaks and your dealer thinks it's normal. Is the squeak all the time, is it when the auger turns, or is it just once in awhile? Unless it's just once in a great while, it is not normal. If you are not handy, I would get someone who is and take a look at the feed motor to see what they put in there. Also, do you have a digital camera that also takes movies with sound? If so, I would record the noise and stove and go down to the store. It's harder to ignore someone or BS them when they are standing in front of you.
 

jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
i am getting enough heat at it starts fine but since the problem had come to our attention by noticing a small flame i am burning a bag of pallets in less than a day and that woories me but thanks everybody for your in put it is great
 

jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
one question how can i find out what size my feeder motor is 4rpm or 6.it was 10 degrees outside last night and i burned almost a bag of pellets at a temp of 70 feeder at 4 filled up hopper at 4.00pm and and to fill again this morning at 8.00 am
 

Bkins

Minister of Fire
Mar 16, 2009
623
Jersey Shore
Pellet stoves can, and will, use pellets at a good rate when you are trying to maintain 70 degrees. Outside temps will have a big effect on how fast you go through pellets. What does your Harman lit say about the pellet useage ranges? 1 bag of pellets while holding 70 degrees in 16 hours seems about right, or even good, to me. This is the first year that I have run pellets stoves and I am surprised at the rate they go through pellets. I thought I could get away with 1 1/2 bags a day running both stoves on low from 8AM to 10 PM. We don't run heat at after 10 PM. I can see now it isn't going to happen. My useage will be highher.

Pellet stoves have some noise involved with their running. When are you getting the noise you are hearing. I would agree with you that if you didn't have it before they replaced the augar motor then something is amiss.

Bkins
 
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Lousyweather

Guest
jerf said:
one question how can i find out what size my feeder motor is 4rpm or 6.it was 10 degrees outside last night and i burned almost a bag of pellets at a temp of 70 feeder at 4 filled up hopper at 4.00pm and and to fill again this morning at 8.00 am
well, easy enough to tell which motor it is, one can either time the rpm's of the auger in test mode, or, most of the motors are labelled on the side of the magnet.....a 1.1amp motor usually is also labelled as 6rpm's, for instance...also, motors which came from harman will often have the part number irght on them...a 6 rpm motor is p/n 3-20-09302.......
 

jerf

New Member
Oct 25, 2009
19
centeral newfoundland
well got one thing fixed and that is the squuek.took back of stove to see if replacement feeder motor was a 6 rpm which it was noticed a little give in the motor with the shaft so i loosened the bolt on shft-motor pushed it all in what it could and tighten it up again and guess what no squeek.now if it would push the pellets up to where it was on the first motor i will be happy again.
 

SXIPro

Minister of Fire
Sep 28, 2009
705
Northern MA
I'd shut it down and then restart it after a bit using the instructions for initial startup in the Owners Manual.
 

summit

Minister of Fire
Aug 22, 2008
1,900
central maine
squeaky harman stoves happen to us with a fair amount of frequency...

Number 1 cause (90% of the time) is a ridge of carbon that builds up where the auger tube/shaft meets the pot (due to lack of burnpot scraping or crap pellets), causes the tip of the auger to drag across it and make a squeak intermmittently every time it turns a full rotation.

Sometimes it iss the slider plate in the bottom of the hopper/top of the feeder box. Easy diagnostic is to dump a tube of powdered graphite lube into the bottom of the hopper next time it is empty, then run it... if it stops, then the problem lies with the slide plate, and it needs some sanding on the edges.

Or it could be the brass bushings the slide plate yoke hinges on (needs some high temp lube a sanding to get the burrs off or needs some lube).

or lastly, the eye shaped bracket that holds the auguer itself into the back of the feeder needs the bolts tighted equally, as one being way too over tight can cock the auger in an slight angle and cause the auger to squeal against the end of the shaft when everything gets hot and swells.

other wise, it's the motor.
 
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Lousyweather

Guest
Summit's suggestions, as usual, are right on the mark....another though....the fines chamber can be almost full, putting alot of strain on the whole drive mechanism, and this can cause any number of interesting noises......
 

Elad

Member
Oct 31, 2008
19
Northern Mn
Jerf, I also had/have the same problems you have.

Was aok for 1 1/2 days, then gearbox failed.
They replaced it with a 6rpm. Not sure what came out but stove was new from last May (09)

I too now have squeaks but not sure if its slide plate or augar, but it started after new motor.
I also am going through about same as you for pellets. Was below zero up here in Norther Mn.
Unit is in basement blowing up the stairs. House nice and warm (mid 70's) and humidity is below 15%
Pellets are stored in basement with dehumidifier so I know pellets are aok. Friend uses same
premium hardwood pellert with no problems. Setting is 4 also for auger, but 1st day I was at 2 and it
was making a nice fine ash line like manual says it would. Now, can't find the sweet spot, but higher
seems to help a bit.

I am wondering though about your ash problems? Have you resolved that problem?

I get clinkers built up that can't get pushed out so I have to scrape em out morning & night.
Yet, the pellets will dance in the pot
I am venting through house chimney and tried opening up the Tee at the chimney as I thought
too much draft was causing the problem. Closed it again.
Later, I also opened up my dryer vent to allow fresh air into the house. A little air comes through.
I know my house is not that well tight...
Does not matter however, I still get them clinkers :(

Color is gray, not brown (flash seemed to changed it)
Dsc00604a.jpg

Actually looks more like this in black & white
Dsc00607.jpg

Flames come from rear and angled towards the glass door than upward when it gets this full of clinkers
Dsc00608a.jpg

Clinkers will crumble easly
Clinkers.jpg


Also posting about this here: https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/46820/
 

Elad

Member
Oct 31, 2008
19
Northern Mn
Talked to the Dealer and his tech called back after viewing these pics.
He notice that there was too much air blowing in the pot.
I removed the cap on the Tee before exhaust enters the chimney and even opened the trap door at bottom of the
chimney as too much of a draft was not helping.

There is an adjustment in the control panel that service techs use to set the combustion blower speed.
He told me to move it counter clockwise to reduce the air but only 1/16 - 1/8.
This is something that the techs mess with using special test equipment that plugs into the bottom port.
Be sure to mark your original position before you mess with it.

Well, I did that but not didn't see much of an effect. I ended up turning that pot all the way down.
The trimpot is the white plastic just below the word MOTOR and right of Igniter lamp. You'll need a small screwdriver.

P68Control.jpg


Yep, it did move the fire line up more but still not at 1" from edge which is needed to move the fines out.

Makes sense as my 1st day of use, the chimney was cold and not pulling as much.
Still, it seems too much air. Will try restriction the inlet opening on the air intake after talking to the dealer more.
But for now, it looks much better, but will see overnight...
Uodate line: After 4 hours later, them clinkers are still being formed and not being pushed out :(
I ran it empty and did another cleanout of the unit... Lots of fines inside the firebox (below the holes-inside by ignitor)

Strange, setting at 4 gives higher flames than at max (6)... Was not the case before setting trimpot down.
MOV00602 is the old settings video (second one).
The Video (MOV00622) is the results of the new settings. (I should of waited more before taking a movie)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/SamaritanElad[/youtube]
 

GVA

Minister of Fire
ELAD
the 1" ash lip is only to set the stove at maximum burn.
It's there for the owner to set the stove so that pellets aren't pushed into the ashpan.
Depending on pellets, venting, draft. you may never get the burning pellets within that 1" I never did.
But I never needed to set my stove that high anyway.
The clinkers you are seeing are more likley a pellet issue
 
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