Questions from a Newb

[ColoMack]

Hello everyone.

You probably don't remember me, I installed a new Englander 30-nc. This is installed in my unfinished basement (going to get started on it soon) chimney goes up through an upstairs room then out the roof. Probably 25' of chimney in all. I installed a damper on the single wall incase over draft was an issue. This is only the second time I have been able to try it due to warm temperatures in this area.

Last weekend I installed new windows in the basement and I noticed starting the fire last night and re load this morning I had to crack a window in order to get it burning good. Would new windows make that big of a difference? I have NO over draft issues, I wish it would pull a little harder but I have almost no trouble with it not drafting enough. never smokes up the house so that's good. Chimney is plenty tall over the tallest peak of the roof

On startup I usually babysit it for 20-30 minutes. Start with some paper, twigs then move up to some small split pieces then throw a couple of logs on. I close the door and shut down the air. I leave the air cracked a bit or else it chokes it down too much, is this normal?

I have a tiny little magnet thermometer on my single wall about 3' from the top of the stove. When I reload I open air, open door throw in the wood and leave door cracked until this temperature gets up to around 350 degrees. Last night stove top was anywhere from 400-500 I think. This morning it was much cooler but it was just down to the coals. Once I get temperature up I close door close air 3/4 of the way and let her run. do these temperatures sound reasonable?

Last question! Sometimes when I get the stove good and hot I shut down the air it appears like the fire goes completely out on the wood but "floats" inside the top of the stove around the tubes. as soon as I open the air a little it goes back to normal. Why is this?

Over all I am very pleased with the performance of my chimney and the stove. In the room above the stove the triple wall is warm to the touch but you can hold your hand on it. Once I get the basement insulated this is going to be awesome. It puts out the heat and I would recommend this stove to anybody.

Thank you for reading.

 

[DougA]

I don\'t have an Englander but can comment on a few generalities though. If you had to crack a window last weekend, it was probably due to poor weather conditions rather than your new windows. Unless you have a new very air tight home, opening a window should make zero difference. I live in a custom built air tight home and I only open a window when it's poor weather conditions. That means the air in the chimney is not hot enough to create good draft compared to the outside. SO - you actually do have a draft issue but probably only a minor one and only when certain weather conditions are present. See all the posts regarding smoke/poor start-up/draft in the past week!

If you have to babysit for 20-30 min. at startup, that is just crazy. Most people I know will babysit for 1 or 2 min, then come back in 5, check the fire, reload and that's it.

I would suggest that you get a digital thermometer that reads the flue gases - inside the flue. Run the wire to the main floor and you'll know exactly what is going on without having to go to the unfinished basement. I drastically changed my burning habits when I installed mine and I think you will find it's $70 very well spent.

 

[Huntindog1]

The flames up by the tubes is a good thing but if thats all you got you might stand a chance that the stove goes out a little later on.
You should open the air just a hair bit more and see if you can get a little bit of a lazy flame going on the wood like BeGreen talks about.
Its a feel of the stove , the heat built up in the stove the quality of wood you loaded and the size of the wood you loaded and etc..
You will get better as time goes on.

 

[branchburner]

it appears like the fire goes completely out on the wood but "floats" inside the top of the stove around the tubes. as soon as I open the air a little it goes back to normal. Why is this?

The secondary air enter the firebox through those tubes, and so those "ghost flames" are the burning of smoke gases and particulates, the secondary combustion that makes a stove efficient and extracts extra heat from whatever remains unburned after primary combustion.

When you open the primary air back up, you feed air back down towards the wood, reigniting the primary burning of it. The primary is burning of the wood, the secondary is burning of the smoke.

 

[ColoMack]

Ok thank you guys. With the ghost flames I usually do try to add just enough air that it is burning on the wood rather than floating. Thank you for making that clear to me, I didn't understand that.

I am hoping my "babysitting" time will be less as I get used to doing this. I did notice that there was roughly a 10mph wind out of the southeast blowing back against the house. Could have been the issue on start up but

 

[ColoMack]

it is still disappointing. I have plenty of chimney and would think I would not have any draft issues in any conditions. Opening the window helped as I watched. I opened it, flame took off and there was a noticeable difference when I closed it again until it got good and hot. Thanks guys

 

[Hogwildz]

After the initial start up flames, then comes secondary flames, then the "ghost" flames, or a wisp of a flame here and there.
Then the glowing stage.
As long as you have a good temp range, flames are not always present, but that does not mean the load of fuel is not burning away and heating.
So many are fixed that if there is no flame, then it is not burning properly. This is mostly in the beginning stages. After the nasty crap burns off and the secondaries die down, and the flames aren't rolling off the wood, if the temp is holding within an acceptable range, you are fine.
I firmly believe in closing the air down as much as possible to control the burn, and lengthen the burn time.
Some stove/stack set ups will achieve full closure of air to do this, others will require a slight or more increase in air intake.
Find what air intake setting works best for you by experimenting with where you set the air level at. If you can close it down all the way, and the stove still burns and heats fine, then your good to go. If you need to adjust for more air, then find the spot that works best for you, and in time, you will know exactly where to set the intake lever for optimal burn.
Moisture level and species of wood also plays a big role in this, but in time you will have a system in mind and everything will be second nature.
Also, the timing and temps at which you close the air down, also play a role in how well, how long and how efficient the load burns.
Most here have learned to cut the air back in stages. I myself do it at time/temps, full open, to half open, to closed.
Another factor which effects the above is what temp and with what coals you reload.
All this will come together in time.

 

[ColoMack]

Thank you Hogwildz. This is how I am learning. I don't really need to be burning but it has been so warm here I have not had the opportunity during the weekends. Finally cool enough that I can practice and see what is happening. I just don't want to be doing something unsafe and think its ok. Thank you for all the responses.

 

[Hogwildz]

No problemo.
That is why a majority of us are here. We start out knowing squat and researching, then those that stick around pass good advice along, and shatcan the not so good advice.
Burning is like anything else, hands on, is by far the best way to learn.
You will find in the following years to come, you will hone your burning skills and techniques even more.
Hell I'm going on season 9, and still do a little better every year.
If in doubt, just ask. This is a great resource for us all, and many others.

 

[DougA]

it is still disappointing. I have plenty of chimney and would think I would not have any draft issues in any conditions. Opening the window helped as I watched. I opened it, flame took off and there was a noticeable difference when I closed it again until it got good and hot. Thanks guys

I am sure opening the window helped. I've done that myself a few times but it still comes back to not enough draft caused by adverse weather IMHO. It's not that difficult to have more pressure outside than in the house, depending upon which way the wind is blowing. I've been burning actively for 30 yrs. and I am sure most experienced guys will agree that sometimes in certain weather conditions, perfect draft is elusive. My answer is to stuff a few more newspaper pages in, add some smaller kindling and if that fails, wait for another day. Even though wood is our primary heat, there is usually once or twice per year that I would rather pay for electric heat for an evening than fight with the stove and turn the home into smokehouse.