Really hot...

[Mr. Kelly]

Ok, I suspect all of us have done this at some point or another...

Has this happened to you?

I had a smoldering little fire going awhile ago in my PE Summit, with just a couple of small splits. I put a full load in there, not even sure it was going to catch, and left to go finish some errands before bed.

In about 12-13 mins, I'm in the other room, and I smell that familiar smell of baking paint. I go running as fast as my feet can carry me into the stove room, remembering that I had loaded it up, to find the fire roaring, and the thermometer in the pipe absolutely pinned to the max. Not sure I've ever seen this. You could hear the pipe roaring... as if there was a major blaze inside the thing, and the pipes were just crackling with expansion/contraction. Plus, worse of all...the interior of the bottom pipe that connects to the top of the stove, which has these little slots in the bottom of the outside sheath, was RED HOT. I mean bright orangey/red.

Obviously, I was very concerned. I did what I probably shouldn't have, and closed off the air almost entirely, and the stove began cooling off rapidly, and the interior pipe turned back to dark.

Any likely long-lasting effects to pipes, stove, etc.?

Anything to check for? This probably lasted for about 5 mins. max.

If I encounter this again, would you solve it any differently?

Stories/solutions encouraged!

Thanks for your thoughts!

 

[Keyless Chuck]

I'm not an expert by any means, if I was in your shoes I would just replace the stove pipe. Check for any other visual damage higher up in the chimney as you are replacing the pipe that turned red. Others will give better advice I'm sure lol

 

[Mr. Kelly]

Thanks for your suggestion.

What is it that makes you feel you would want to change the pipe? My initial belief was that it got hot, expanded, cooled off... And then contracted to normal size. What could result?

 

[Oregon aloha]

If the paint cracked then I would think some damage my have been done to the pipe, but I'm no expert either. I would also check the door to make sure it didn't warp and the door seal was still good and take a good look inside the stove and baffle area for any damage.
I'm glad you were on top of that and safe. Happy burning.

 

[Mr. Kelly]

If the paint cracked then I would think some damage my have been done to the pipe, but I'm no expert either. I would also check the door to make sure it didn't warp and the door seal was still good and take a good look inside the stove and baffle area for any damage.
I'm glad you were on top of that and safe. Happy burning.

I then wonder what could actually happen to a stove pipe under theses conditions...? When I took it apart this summer, it seemed to consist of merely two layers of metal with space in between. Is there more than meets the eye? It certainly sounded like a raging fire was going on inside the pipe, but I've heard that before with no ill effects.

I have blasted that stove in a similar way a handful of times in the five years I've had the thing, and I've yet to see any major problems. Not that I would let myself be reckless or careless.

There are other considerations... Like the stove had been burning for a couple of hours prior to that, but I wasn't tending it, and it was a smoldering event. When I loaded it up for the night it had never even gotten
very hot, leading me to believe that the casing of the stove may not have taken on much of the heat of the blast, which may have lasted only about ten mins.. I wonder if the stove pipe was the main victim of the heat, and not the actual stove, given that the stove heats up more gradually. The stove top thermometer, if working properly, was only showing in the boarder line range of overburn.

Waddaya think?

 

[Bagelboy]

I've had this happen 4 or 5 times over the 22 years I've owned my Jotul. Scares the heck out of you. I must say, there was no damage and the pipes were fine. I never actually had one turn red, but I can tell you, I remember that paint burning smell and I believe that the inside of my pipe was probably burning any creosote up because it sounded like a freight train. My double wall pipe was impossible to touch. Like I said, no pipe damage at all. I would check to see if the catalytic converter is damaged. I did find out some time later mine had cracked, but I don't know if it was from the last incident.

 

[Mr. Kelly]

I've had this happen 4 or 5 times over the 22 years I've owned my Jotul. Scares the heck out of you. I must say, there was no damage and the pipes were fine. I never actually had one turn red, but I can tell you, I remember that paint burning smell and I believe that the inside of my pipe was probably burning any creosote up because it sounded like a freight train. My double wall pipe was impossible to touch. Like I said, no pipe damage at all. I would check to see if the catalytic converter is damaged. I did find out some time later mine had cracked, but I don't know if it was from the last incident.

Thanks for the story! Glad your stove survived!

Not all stoves have catalytic converters, right? Don't think mine does, no?

 

[Charles1981]

I've done this twice now... I think damage CAN be done but I'm really hoping it is only from repeated events. My catalyst is still fine, no cracks, no crumbles, still fires off normally. The bypass closes normally, still getting the same burn time no change in the stove performance.

It does suck though...because its completely your fault.

I think, but this is subjective wishful thinking, that melting warped stoves with crumbling catalysts happen when you say have a run away and there is nothing you can do to stop it short of fire extinguisher because there is a severe air leak somewhere or your ash pan gasket got busted somehow or something weird (or you left the house and didn't realize you f'd up)... And the stove is subjected to hours of intense heat... hopefully (and the two times I've done it so far have only been for 15-25 minutes) no long term damage happens down the road.

Fingers crossed!....?

 

[Oregon aloha]

probably burning any creosote up

My thought also. A good old fashion chimney fire. With an old masonry chimney this could have had a different outcome. You did the right thing cutting off the air supply. That's the only way I know of to quickly fight a creosote fire without calling in the professionals.
I mentioned the paint because it will fail before the pipe will. Bad paint could = bad pipe. Stove pipe won't last forever, but a real long time.

 

[Bagelboy]

Mr Kelly, I don't know if your stove is a cat stove or not. I would do a thorough check both inside and out. If in doubt, call your installer or stove dealer, but I would think if you visually see everything is good you are probably fine. Maybe light a small fire to check for leaks or problems. I'm no stove expert, just my advice.

 

[Mr. Kelly]

Well, I continued said fire and went to sleep shortly thereafter... So I'm hoping no new disasters are in sight!

 

[Bagelboy]

I really would think everything is fine. Wouldn't make a habit of it

 

[Sprinter]

Not all stoves have catalytic converters, right? Don't think mine does, no?

That's right, and your PE is a non-cat.

 

[vwmike]

I wouldn't worry about it either, as long as there's no visible damage or warping you'll be fine. PE stoves will certainly take the odd over fire, pretty sure mine has been run hot all it's life judging by the fact that all that was here for firewood was mill ends.

 

[rideau]

What kind of pipe do you have? It will be rated to a certain number of stove fires of a certain duration. You state this is your fifth or so such event. ICC pipe, which is about the best made, is rated for two fires of 30 minute duration, I believe. Most other pipe I believe maxes out at ten minute fires, and only several. Stove pipe is cheap. If I were you, I'd be getting a new length of stove pipe and inserting it, so I'd have the comfort of knowing I have a nice, new, rated for "x" number of fires, for the NEXT event, which it surely sounds as if you will have. Then, after getting that new stove pipe installed, I'd get a nice loud manual timer, and set it every time I load the stove, for 5 minutes, since it seems this happened to you in only about 12 minutes, and NOT leave the stove unchecked for any long period of time when starting a load. One of these times you may not be so lucky with such an episode, and may not catch it as quickly.

Another easy step to cool the stove down quickly is to turn a standing fan on high and point it at the stove.

 

[bag of hammers]

One startup here a while back - went from stone cold to 1000+ deg in the time it takes to make a pot of coffee. I caught it before it went off the rails, but it was amazing how fast it went up. What did you load up with? I like to toss in a bit of the very dry pine / spruce I have stacked, but a bit too much and it will go nuclear on me in no time.

 

[Mr. Kelly]

What would be likely to happen if one surpasses the "fire duration" rating of a pipe? Hard to imagine that it would become imminently unsafe. Yes, it would be a good idea to replace it... but not convinced it's yet lived its life to its potential. The pipe in question is an "telescopic" pipe, so it wouldn't be quite as cheap as if it were a regular. Plus, it's a short run with a couple of elbows... so it would add up.

How about the outside pipe? Think it was part of the fire, if there was one? There's about 6 ft. of pipe before it hits the 90 degree elbow outside going up.

So far, today, stove seems to be in good shape, as well as the pipe.

Any other catastrophe or near catastrophe stories?

 

[Knots]

When I was a teenager I left the bottom door open on my parents' Glacier Bay with a load of coal in it. The stove was glowing red when I finally shut it down. The stove was fine after that, but I think it took a year off my life...

 

[D8Chumley]

I had a runaway with the old Federal, woke me up in the middle of the night. First one, scared the living crap outta me. I didn't know what to do, flue temp pegged, sounded like a train. Shut all the air down and prayed... it worked. Thats something you will never forget