Regency CI2600 - Not enough air?

[Maynard Rowley]

My wife and I recently had a Regency CI2600 installed in our masonry fireplace. Our house is a single story and the fireplace is on an exterior wall. The installer used 12ft of 5-1/2" insulated liner. We've been burning wood that has been seasoned at least 2 years (I cut it and stacked it in the wood shed 2-3 years ago. Tree was probably dead a year before cutting). When starting a fire we have to leave the door cracked at least 10-15 minutes. If we close the door any sooner the fire dies, even with the damper wide open. Even after the 10-15 minute burn I sometimes have trouble keeping the fire going with the door closed. Seems like it's not getting enough air. I've watched videos of the Regency CI2600 and our MAX burn (damper wide open, catalyst engaged) looks more like most people's slow burn. If we close the damper fire goes out. No flame, no catalyst activity. Can anyone tell me what might be wrong?

 

[tadmaz]

At what cat temp are you engaging the cat? Should be 400 or 500 minimum. When you have the air control wide open, the lever is to the left, correct? Also, before you load wood make sure you sweep away ash around where the air comes in/restrictor plate, this is on the bottom in the middle, towards the door. If this is covered with ash, you won't have much air coming in!

If the above fails to help, there is a post in the past that mentions the HI400, which is the same stove, where there are pics of the restrictor plate and you could perhaps try removing it short-term to see if that helps.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

Thanks for the reply. I don't engage the cat until the temp has been between 500° & 600° for at least 10 minutes or so. Air control all the way to the left as you stated. I always make sure to keep the air path clear as well.

Not sure if I have a restrictor plate or not. Tried to look this AM but couldn't really see. Took the attached pic with my phone.

 

[tadmaz]

That is the restrictor plate, remove those 2 bolts and you should be able to pull it up and out. Also if the inside top of the stove is all cast iron, it should be the newer model that has the restrictor plate.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

I will try that tonight. Really hoping we can get a wider range fire. Right now we have "moderate-low" burn and "out".

 

[bholler]

My wife and I recently had a Regency CI2600 installed in our masonry fireplace. Our house is a single story and the fireplace is on an exterior wall. The installer used 12ft of 5-1/2" insulated liner. We've been burning wood that has been seasoned at least 2 years (I cut it and stacked it in the wood shed 2-3 years ago. Tree was probably dead a year before cutting). When starting a fire we have to leave the door cracked at least 10-15 minutes. If we close the door any sooner the fire dies, even with the damper wide open. Even after the 10-15 minute burn I sometimes have trouble keeping the fire going with the door closed. Seems like it's not getting enough air. I've watched videos of the Regency CI2600 and our MAX burn (damper wide open, catalyst engaged) looks more like most people's slow burn. If we close the damper fire goes out. No flame, no catalyst activity. Can anyone tell me what might be wrong?

Removing the restrictor plate may help. But your chimney is short even for a 6" liner and absolutly way to short for a 5.5. It should have never been installed that way.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

What would you recommend? Excuse my ignorance but I don't understand how a longer liner would help.

 

[bholler]

What would you recommend? Excuse my ignorance but I don't understand how a longer liner would help.

The chimney is what ceates draft to run your stove. It creates a vacume in the stove which pulls air through to feed the fire. The taller the chimney the more draft you get. Minimum height for your stove is 15' from the firebox floor to the top of the chimney with a 6" liner. With your stove if you get over 25' you can downsize to 5.5" which reduces the volume of air.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

So you're saying I need a 6" liner and a 3' extension on the chimney?

 

[bholler]

So you're saying I need a 6" liner and a 3' extension on the chimney?

Atleast a 6" liner. It may work that way with the restrictor removed or you may need to extend it

 

[Maynard Rowley]

I just called Regency and they said that the 5-1/2" liner is fine. He said 12' is the bare minimum for height though. He is recommending a 4' extension.

He also said that a 6" liner would be worse than a 5-1/2" liner, not better.

Called the installer and they said they can add the extension (for more $$$ of course) but that they think it should be fine as-is. He said 5-1/2" and 12' is the minimum but that it should still work.

So now I'm really confused. I think I'm going to start a fire tonight with some wood that has been moisture tested and I'll take a video. Maybe my expectations are too high. If it's still not good enough I'll take out the restrictor. After that I guess all I can do is a 4' extension and hope for the best.

Thanks for the tips and advice.

 

[bholler]

I just called Regency and they said that the 5-1/2" liner is fine. He said 12' is the bare minimum for height though. He is recommending a 4' extension.

He also said that a 6" liner would be worse than a 5-1/2" liner, not better.

Called the installer and they said they can add the extension (for more $$$ of course) but that they think it should be fine as-is. He said 5-1/2" and 12' is the minimum but that it should still work.

So now I'm really confused. I think I'm going to start a fire tonight with some wood that has been moisture tested and I'll take a video. Maybe my expectations are too high. If it's still not good enough I'll take out the restrictor. After that I guess all I can do is a 4' extension and hope for the best.

Thanks for the tips and advice.

Who did you talk to at regency? Our install specs says all of their noncats can run on 5.5" but the hybrids need 6" untill 25'. And the idea that 6 would be worse makes no sense at all.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

Might be a dumb question but: is there a way to "test" if an extension will make it burn better without spending the money to have it installed? Like a temporary extension?

 

[Maynard Rowley]

The person I talked to at Regency was named "Ben".

 

[bholler]

I will check the min height i really thought it was 15 but i may be wrong on that one it could be 12

 

[bholler]

The person I talked to at Regency was named "Ben".

And was it regency or your regency dealer?

 

[bholler]

The person I talked to at Regency was named "Ben".

Ok i apologize they changed that spec on me. My hard copy of the specs from 2 years ago say 6" untill 25'. The new ones say 5.5 is fine.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

No worries! I appreciate the help.

And it was Regency that I talked to. Ive talked to the installer as well. They are convinced that it should be fine.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

Stopped at the dealer/installer on the way home. They can install a 4' extension for $400CAN. That's just materials, they won't charge for install or labor. Before we go down that road he gave me some wood to try and told me to remove the restrictor plate. It is definitely better than before. Video below is after the 15 minute "warm up" with door cracked and maybe 5-10 minutes with after logs added. Door closed and cat engaged for at least 5 minutes. This is about the most active fire we've had yet. Is this the way it's supposed to be? Or should we have the extension installed?

 

[edyit]

Might be a dumb question but: is there a way to "test" if an extension will make it burn better without spending the money to have it installed? Like a temporary extension?

yes try using a section of just single wall pipe to see if it improves draft, this will mean getting on the roof to do this

 

[Maynard Rowley]

I've removed the restricor plate at the bottom-front of the unit and that seems to have helped. Video I posted earlier may have been premature as the fire got more "lively" after another 20-30 minutes. I'll need to try a few more burns before I will be satisfied that the issue has been resolved by removing the plate.

I am still concerned that the 12' of 5-1/2" liner is insufficient to create enough draw/draft. I might try the temporary 4' extension this weekend if the weather holds up. To do this do I just remove the chimney cap and stuff the extension into the end of the liner?

Thanks again the the help/advice. I'm getting more/better info here than I'm getting from Regency or the dealer.

 

[MAD MARK]

To do this do I just remove the chimney cap and stuff the extension into the end of the liner?

That's exactly what you do. Can even leave the cap off if you want to if weather is alright with it while doing a test burn or 2.

 

[Maynard Rowley]

The cap in the picture is pretty close to a 6" OD so I think I can just remove the 4 screws that hold the rain cap in place and put a 6" pipe around it. As long as the change in diameter from 5" to 6" isn't going to cause an issue.

Also, the fireplace installers say they'll have to bust off that clay pipe flush with the top of the chimney and then install the stove pipe there. Is that the correct way to do it?

 

[Maynard Rowley]

Wife and I have decided to have the 4' extension installed. Can someone please tell me/show me the proper way of doing this? The fireplace supplier/installer wants to chisel the clay flue liner flush with the top of the chimney. Is this correct?

 

[MAD MARK]

Have you tried the temporary extension first and did it make a difference?

I'm thinking that they want to bust off the clay tile flush to have the whole top support the extra weight instead of smaller tile. Just a guess.