Rusted

[mainegeek]

Hello everyone

I purchased a ton of pellets today to get us started for the year. So, I decided tonight was a good night to fire her up. In the spring, I cleaned everything out completely including removing the fans and vacuuming and cleaning the entire flue line. I took a wire brush to the metal parts including the baffle and painted the baffle and the inside of the fire box with high temperature paint. Imagine my surprise when I opened her up for the first visual inspection of the year and saw the attached images.

Background information: The stove is a Quadra Fire Mount Vernon AE. The stove was installed back in November of last year and has only had 3 tons run through it at this point. Notice the baffel is literally splitting and big chunks of metal are falling off on their own; the Quadra Fire logo is lifting away (not just the paint!). This is NOT the condition I left it in.... there was no exposed metal... it was all cleaned and painted.

So... is the stove safe/ok to operate with the baffle in that condition?

Would you consider this a warrantiable item? The stove is less then a year old and was professional installed by the dealers installer.

I'd appreciate your comments. Thanks

 

[mainegeek]

Ok, I've thrown caution to the wind.... removed the loose pieces, vacuumed out what was left and filled her up. I'll have a talk with the dealer tomorrow.

Still interested in others comments though... am I being an over protective parent? lol

 

[jtakeman]

Ok, I've thrown caution to the wind.... removed the loose pieces, vacuumed out what was left and filled her up. I'll have a talk with the dealer tomorrow.

Still interested in others comments though... am I being an over protective parent? lol

Over protective NO! I would be MAD as heck if that were my stove. Only one year old. Wow!

I would call the dealer and tell him this isn't exceptable. IMO anyway. That has to be a defect.

See what others say.

Is that piece removable???

jay

 

[mainegeek]

Over protective NO! I would be MAD as heck if that were my stove. Only one year old. Wow!

I would call the dealer and tell him this isn't exceptable. IMO anyway. That has to be a defect.

See what others say.

Is that piece removable???

jay

That's how I'm feeling.... I saved all the large pieces in a ziplock bag. I plan in bringing the pieces, those pictures, the manual (pointing out maintenance section), the receipt for purchase and receipt for install. I don't feel I should have to buy a new baffle at this age. And if they tell me I have to then should I expect to have to replace that piece every year? That's rediculous!

Yes, that piece is removable.... I checked behind and there was only "minor" surface rust; nothing I'm concerned about if I continue to maintain it.

I'm thinking defect as well.... the chunks seem to be coming off in layers... really strange, almost like it was poured twice and the metal is layered?

 

[acowherd]

What is the date of manufacture on that stove? Is there a tag or metal stamp to confirm the date it was made?

 

[mainegeek]

What is the date of manufacture on that stove? Is there a tag or metal stamp to confirm the date it was made?

I'll need to verify but I'm fairly certain it was built in late summer/fall of 2008. We purchased our stove in May of 2008 and had to wait for it to be built because of the demand last year. The dealer got it in around this time last year and the installer was booked 4 weeks out. So, we had to have it installed on mid Nov of last year. None of the other parts are rusted like that... just the baffle

As for date stamped on that peice... I'd need to see if it hasn't fallen off yet....

 

[acowherd]

Yes that baffle looks to be defective. I am not sure if this can happen with a pellet stove....but was there any type of an over fire?

Edit: Is the area that is rusted a removable cast iron piece, and behind that is there a steel baffle? If it is just a decorative piece that would be easy to get warrantied, and exchanged out.

 

[mainegeek]

Yes that baffle looks to be defective. I am not sure if this can happen with a pellet stove....but was there any type of an over fire?

Please forgive my ignorance but what is an over fire? I assume you mean running the stove beyond its stated manufacturers specifications? If that is what you mean then no. The stove was set to hold 72 at the thermostat. The flame height was set to 0 and pellet mode was set to soft wood. We use the stove to supplement our oil usage. We do lean heavier on the stove setting it slightly hotter then the oil thermostat--but should it not handle these normal operating conditions?

 

[acowherd]

That sounds great. I lean on 2 stoves to heat my house, and only run my heat when I am gone for more than just one day. Please read my edit above^^^^^^...

I assume you mean running the stove beyond its stated manufacturers specifications? Yes that would be bad.



An over fire is mainly in wood stoves. If the wood stove is glowing red it is being over fired.

 

[jtakeman]

Most pellet stoves have a 200º High limit snap disc. The stove will not run without resetting.

I don't think it would get hot enough to over fire with this safety.

jay

 

[mainegeek]

That sounds great. I lean on 2 stoves to heat my house, and only run my heat when I am gone for more than just one day. Please read my edit above^^^^^^...

I assume you mean running the stove beyond its stated manufacturers specifications? Yes that would be bad.



An over fire is mainly in wood stoves. If the wood stove is glowing red it is being over fired.

Yeah, the Mount Vernon is "supposed" to have an overheat sensor and "should" shut itself off. I'd assume that the computer would fail start up if these sensors are not working correctly...

Edit: Is the area that is rusted a removable cast iron piece, and behind that is there a steel baffle? If it is just a decorative piece that would be easy to get warrantied, and exchanged out.

The baffle is one piece... it's the plate you see where the Quadra Fire logo is lifting away. That's a good question though and one I considered earlier tonight. Perhaps the cast iron is the back and the top logo and ridges were poured of a different material. Like I said, it seems to be pealing a layer off and the ridged design seems to be splitting.

Any one else with a Quad have the same issue?

Edit:

Most pellet stoves have a 200º High limit snap disc. The stove will not run without resetting.

I don’t think it would get hot enough to over fire with this safety.

I guess that confirms no over fire

 

[acowherd]

My Harman Accentra Insert has a few cast iron decorative pieces in that you take out to get to the baffles (heat exchangers) to clean. once the stove is cleaned you put the decorative cast iron pieces back in.

What kind of paint was used? Stove bright?

 

[acowherd]

Most pellet stoves have a 200º High limit snap disc. The stove will not run without resetting.

I don't think it would get hot enough to over fire with this safety.

jay

Unless it is defective.....


Yes I agree... just trowing stuff out there.

 

[jtp10181]

Never seen one do that before. They did have some problems with the baffles cracking though. I can tell yours is the new design because the baffle does not touch the fire pot where the drop tube comes out. Here are a couple of my initial thoughts..

Maybe a little to harsh /hard with the wire brush treatment?
What paint exactly was used?
Do you live by a body of water? I see a large river runs through your town.
Excessive moisture in the home? Have a whole house humidifier? Do your windows ice up in the winter a lot?

Anyway, I don't think the dealer should have a problem replacing that under warranty. But if it happens again, I would suspect its not a defective part, but circumstances.

 

[mainegeek]

My Harman Accentra Insert has a few cast iron decorative pieces in that you take out to get to the baffles (heat exchangers) to clean. once the stove is cleaned you put the decorative cast iron pieces back in.

What kind of paint was used? Stove bright?

Rust-Oleum High Heat; says its good to 1200 degrees. It's basically flat black engine paint.

According to the manuals blown out part listing diagram this piece is the baffle and sits in front of the heat exchangers. It may just be decorative but I always assumed it was to keep the flame directly off the heat exchangers.... so, yes, I did figure this piece would eventually fail with the direct flame on it but I don't think I am wrong to think this is premature?

 

[mainegeek]

Never seen one do that before. They did have some problems with the baffles cracking though. I can tell yours is the new design because the baffle does not touch the fire pot where the drop tube comes out. Here are a couple of my initial thoughts..

Maybe a little to harsh /hard with the wire brush treatment?
What paint exactly was used?
Do you live by a body of water? I see a large river runs through your town.
Excessive moisture in the home? Have a whole house humidifier? Do your windows ice up in the winter a lot?

Anyway, I don't think the dealer should have a problem replacing that under warranty. But if it happens again, I would suspect its not a defective part, but circumstances.

No I don't think the brush treatment was to hard. It is was a small hand held brush and I only used it to loosen the loose paint that had peeled. At that time there was no rust but I remember being concerned when I saw some splitting in the ridges.

Paint: see above^^^

Yeah I'm considering that as well. I don't live directly on the coast but the penobscot river does pass a few miles from my house. My profile says I live in Bangor but I actually live in Winterport.

Moisture is not excessive in house. Windows don't ice up during winter

Edit: Speaking of it happening again.... if they do replace it what can I do differently to avoid? Remove baffle from stove? While searching tonight on this forum I saw posts about stuffing cloths into the intake exhaust tubes... does this help?

 

[acowherd]

My Harman Accentra Insert has a few cast iron decorative pieces in that you take out to get to the baffles (heat exchangers) to clean. once the stove is cleaned you put the decorative cast iron pieces back in.

What kind of paint was used? Stove bright?

Rust-Oleum High Heat; says its good to 1200 degrees. It's basically flat black engine paint.

According to the manuals blown out part listing diagram this piece is the baffle and sits in front of the heat exchangers. It may just be decorative but I always assumed it was to keep the flame directly off the heat exchangers.... so, yes, I did figure this piece would eventually fail with the direct flame on it but I don't think I am wrong to think this is premature?

I don't know about rust-oleum...but if it is high heat it should be fine.

So this piece does come out to clean the heat exchangers? I have flame guide on my xxv.. but the flame does hit the exchangers some. On my XXV there is no decorative piece between the flame and exchangers.

I don't think that part should fail ever. I take mine out all the time to clean and they are thick and heavy.

 

[jtp10181]

The baffle is not decorative, it is a crucial part. The baffle directs the exhaust flow across the heat exchanger fins to extract maximum heat. Without the baffle the exhaust could travel directly through the exit at the lower rear of the stove without passing through many of the fins. The fire would probably be sucked down towards that area also, from the pull of the combustion blower.

Let me know if the dealer gives you any crap, the part for sure has at least a 1 year warranty on it. There is no obvious abuse to the stove or to that part. To me it looks as if you must have strapped it to the underside of your car and drove it around all winter in the salt and snow. It could have been a bad batch of materials... hopefully we do not see a bunch more like this.

Next year I would suggest putting a desiccant inside the stove to help keep humidity out during the summer.

 

[freeburn]

I've heard of baffles cracking on that stove. I'd definitely look into getting that replaced with warranty!

 

[mainegeek]

I don't know about rust-oleum...but if it is high heat it should be fine.

So this piece does come out to clean the heat exchangers? I have flame guide on my xxv.. but the flame does hit the exchangers some. On my XXV there is no decorative piece between the flame and exchangers.

I don't think that part should fail ever. I take mine out all the time to clean and they are thick and heavy.

Yes there are two fasteners on each side that hold this plate in. once you remove it you have access to the heat exchangers.

It is thick and heavy. I would not have expected that carnage from that plate of steel.

I'm torn; I love the stove but hoping the dealer isn't a d!ck about it. I paid WAY too much money for this stove to have it start falling apart in less then a year from install. It should last at least a couple more years before I should have to put serious money into this thing (IMO). When I bought it I figured it would take 2 to 3 years to start paying for itself! I haven't even gotten anywhere near where this thing is no longer a negative financial impact.

 

[jtp10181]

I've heard of baffles cracking on that stove. I'd definitely look into getting that replaced with warranty!

Yes, I already mentioned that his baffle is already the new design, where the drop tube does not come in contact with the fire-pot. So that original design flaw should not have been a factor in the problem.

mainegeek, just check with the dealer tomorrow or when they are open next. Let me know if they give you any crap about it. They should have no problem getting credit from Quad, so they should be willing to order you a new one no problem.

 

[acowherd]

The baffle is not decorative, it is a crucial part. The baffle directs the exhaust flow across the heat exchanger fins to extract maximum heat. Without the baffle the exhaust could travel directly through the exit at the lower rear of the stove without passing through many of the fins. The fire would probably be sucked down towards that area also, from the pull of the combustion blower.

Let me know if the dealer gives you any crap, the part for sure has at least a 1 year warranty on it. There is no obvious abuse to the stove or to that part. To me it looks as if you must have strapped it to the underside of your car and drove it around all winter in the salt and snow. It could have been a bad batch of materials... hopefully we do not see a bunch more like this.

Next year I would suggest putting a desiccant inside the stove to help keep humidity out during the summer.

The baffle for his stove is not decorative I agree... mine on the other hand is questionable. My XXV looks just like my insert without the decorative pieces in it.


I like to put desiccant in my stove as well. I also like to take G96 Gun treatment (3 in 1) and spray and wipe down all inside pieces.

 

[Jack Morrissey]

Im no expert by any means, but it looks as if water has been coming in the top of the stove. Is this an insert??

 

[mainegeek]

Next year I would suggest putting a desiccant inside the stove to help keep humidity out during the summer.

I like to put desiccant in my stove as well. I also like to take G96 Gun treatment (3 in 1) and spray and wipe down all inside pieces.

Good information! I had never heard of desiccant. Interest thought on the gun treatment... do you not paint at all?

Perhaps I should have spent more time on this forum last year and read everyone's suggestions... but I'm not about to say this is negligence; I'm hope you all agree; now hopefully the dealer does as well...

 

[acowherd]

there is no paint on my cast iron baffles (decorative pieces) just bare.

The only painting i do is just touching up the outside.


Strait from the G96 gun treatment website:
"This is the single and best gun care maintenance product ever designed to solve a gun owner's cleaning, lubricating and corrosion protection problems. A unique formulation of active lubricants will not freeze, oxidize or evaporate. Designed with a pleasant odor, this gun treatment is assured perfect firing from 50 F below zero to 350 F."