Should i add more chimney?

[Banjobend]

Hi there, first time poster. I recently swapped out our old Fisher for an Englander. not sure what model it is but it said it will heat 1,800-2,400sq feet. I have poor draft now, but was fine with the Fisher. Everything I've read leads me to believe I need more chimney, so I added another 20" of class A. Even with over 16' of chimney I can't get a good draft going, plus the glass is pitch black. I have two more 30" sections of class A but the thing is getting really tall. should I keep adding to it or do I have another problem?

Here's my setup:
6" connecting pipe to support box with two slight angle changes

7" class A for 110"

Wide open cap

Good pine, which ive burned in three other stoves to check quality.

 

[bholler]

Good pine, which ive burned in three other stoves to check quality.

what is the moisture content of it? It sounds like wet wood to me.

 

[begreen]

That's an Englander 30NC. The transition to 7" pipe may be what is slowing down the draft. Do you have some construction scraps like 2x4 cut offs? If yes, how do they burn in a test fire? Are the other stoves you tested the pine in newer models or old pre-EPA stoves?

 

[jetsam]

Stick on both of the 30s and see if it helps, take 'em back off if not.

I'm not sure if using 7" pipe is a potential issue. What is the collar diameter where it hooks up to the stove?

 

[Banjobend]

I'm not sure what the moisture content of the wood is, don't even know how I would measure it. two of the test stoves are EPA and one 50gal barrel stove.

I'll bring home some scraps tomorrow and try that.

My 6" connecting pipe fits right into the stove. my mother in laws stove is 6" into 8" class A and her chimney isn't even 15' tall, yet it works fantastic.

 

[Banjobend]

Also, I still haven't seen the secondary burn happening. But that's probably another symptom of poor draft.

 

[begreen]

When was the flue last cleaned? Is there a screen on the chimney cap? If yes, check to see if it's plugging up.

 

[Banjobend]

When was the flue last cleaned? Is there a screen on the chimney cap? If yes, check to see if it's plugging up.

Less than 10 fires since I swept the chimney. no screen on cap, it's wide open.

 

[Hogwildz]

First, move that stove over, get rid of the elbows and go straight up. The new stove will not be as forgiving with moister wood as the older stove was. If the glass is black, and it ain't getting up in temp, it's either draft, the wood, or most likely both.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

First, move that stove over, get rid of the elbows and go straight up. The new stove will not be as forgiving with moister wood as the older stove was. If the glass is black, and it ain't getting up in temp, it's either draft, the wood, or most likely both.

This^^^^^^^^^^


Also, what is your altitude?

 

[Banjobend]

First, move that stove over, get rid of the elbows and go straight up. The new stove will not be as forgiving with moister wood as the older stove was. If the glass is black, and it ain't getting up in temp, it's either draft, the wood, or most likely both.

I tried running the chimney straight up, but it didn't help any. so I moved it back to the center of the hearth cause it was driving me nuts having it asymmetrical. I'm going to buy one of those moisture meters today and see what my wood is.

This^^^^^^^^^^


Also, what is your altitude?

We're are right around 3,400ft.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

I'd do all of the above, it'll help trouble shooting too.


Having a straight run will pull the most draft, so I'd move it back, at least until you have the stove running right. I'd add the additional 60" of pipe. People run 30s off 8" Terra cotta chimneys. That's 64 sq inches. Your 7" pipe has a greater area than the 6" pipe, but you're still at 38.5 sq inches... Far below. The altitude will irritate the draft, but hopefully the additional 60" compensates.

I'd also try some kiln dried wood.

 

[04HemiRam2500]

I have an englander 28-3500 furnace with a 15 foot chimney and it heats great. But I first bought a nc30 and with my weak draft it wouldn't heat worth crap. it would quickly turn the wood to coals. making the chimney wasnt an option for me so the englander furnace sits in my game room and dumps heat just like a stove wood and I love it. I heta 3000 sq. ft. with it.

From my personal experience those secondary burn tubes need alot of draft to get great performance and I feel anything under 20 feet wont give you the performance these stoves can dish out. Then you have the two bends on a short chimney which also is no help.

Lastly, I wonder how ell insulated your house is cause this stove might not be able to keep up if it is too drafty!! How much fuel did you go through with the old stove?

 

[edyit]

how are you running the stove? i know a few people who swapped out older style stoves like fishers for a newer epa stove and had nightmares because they were trying to run them the same way, ie load it get it to start burning then choke the air way down on it to slow smolder, the newer epa stoves need to be brought up to temperature to support secondary combustion. my best advice to you is get 2 thermometers if you don't have them already, 1 for the stove top can be magnetic, and one for about 16 inches or so up the flue, can be magnetic if single wall or probe if double wall and get yourself a cheap moisture meter from lowes harbor freight etc. if you're not running hot enough or your wood is wet then you'll get black glass like that.

 

[Banjobend]

Ok. so I just purchased a moisture reader and when I get home I will put the two 30" class A's on. I have a thermometer on the stove top and an infrared for the connecting pipe.

What is considered dry wood?

What should my stove top and connecting pipe (single wall) temps be?

My Fisher ran good at about 450° stove top.

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Split a split and test a piece in the middle. When the cold hit I'd run the stove in thgthge 600s and reloaded when the coals told me to.

 

[bholler]

What is considered dry wood?

under 20%

 

[edyit]

remember to test the fresh split piece at room temp, cold frozen pieces outside will give a false low moisture reading

 

[husky345 vermont resolute]

First, move that stove over, get rid of the elbows and go straight up. The new stove will not be as forgiving with moister wood as the older stove was. If the glass is black, and it ain't getting up in temp, it's either draft, the wood, or most likely both.

But then it won't be centred on the hearth

 

[Banjobend]

So I tested several pieces of warm, fresh split wood and it varies between 5% and 15%.

I added 30" of class A, but I couldn't get both of them on due to the height of the chimney.

I started a fire, got it up to 500° on the top before I shut the door and it seems to be working better. still not seeing that secondary burn, should that happen all the time or just when I dampen it down?

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Damping it down, little by little, will cause the air to be fed by the burn tubes.

 

[Banjobend]

I'm starting to think that I'm just burning it wrong. I got a rippin hot fire in there now and it's doing pretty good. holding a flame with the damper half closed. I guess we'll see what the glass looks like in the morning.

 

[begreen]

It's counterintuitive but the stove will burn hotter and longer with the air closed down as far as possible without choking the flames and smoldering the fire. Give it a try. Shoot for lazy flames on the wood. You should get quite a light show from the secondary burn.

 

[Banjobend]

Had a good choose all night long and kept the house nice and warm. this morning the glass was still a let black but not bad.

Now, my only issue is that I'm still getting a good amount of smoke when the door Is open. our house is by no means "sealed tight", but would it be beneficial to install the outside air intake?

 

[jetsam]

Now, my only issue is that I'm still getting a good amount of smoke when the door Is open. our house is by no means "sealed tight", but would it be beneficial to install the outside air intake?

More chimney height can help. So can warming the flue. (Also, as previously mentioned, eliminating the elbows.)

Do you get smoke coming out when reloading, or only on a cold start?

Does it smoke only when the clothes dryer/exhaust fan is running, or does it always do it?