Signs that your wood stove is ...........

[soupy1957]

What are the signs that your wood stove is burnt out and ready to be replaced? I've heard some talk in here about over heating your stove, and wondered what evidences begin to develop.

Is it as obvious as melting of metal? Warping? What? How would I know my stove was no longer safe to use, or about to fall apart and burn my house down?

-Soupy1957

 

[EatenByLimestone]

Welp, the old potbelly's top cap was held together by furnace cement that my Grandfather put on it. That my my final clue when I tried to rebuild it.


Matt

 

[cmonSTART]

When you start getting stove envy.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

When you don't have the firebox door open and have no viewing window but still see some flames, it is time to replace.

Believe it or not, I was at someone's place and they had a stove in the porch of the house. They then forced the air into the house through a duct. When they needed to add wood they had to go out on the porch. One day I was there and could see flames reflecting off something. I looked around in back and there was a big hole. The thing simply was rotting away! They were still burning. On the good side, they did finally replace it before the house burned down but that was really scary.

 

[Battenkiller]

I started getting AARP newsletters and Social Security checks in my old stove's name, so I knew it was time to put it out to pasture.

 

[madrone]

Believe it or not, I was at someone's place and they had a stove in the porch of the house. They then forced the air into the house through a duct.

I'm having a hard time processing this. It's so wrong. Please tell me you made this up.

 

[madrone]

Soupy, I haven't witnessed any of this, but a steel stove like yours could warp and break welds if it over fired too high for too long. I'd expect some groaning noises, followed by very loud metallic bangs. The result would be gaps in the seams of the stove. A broken weld could be repaired, but I probably wouldn't use a warped stove. It's hard to imagine much else that would mean the death of an steel plate stove. Meteor strike, I suppose. Accidental load of dynamite. .357 hollow points. My stove's 10 years old and I'm pretty sure I'll be trading it in before I scrap it.

 

[soupy1957]

Speaking of "sounds" from the stove.........I'd think it fair to say that I hear my stove (only a year old) making popping noises as it heats up, but I figure that, unless the welds were to split open, it is going to hold together. I'm not imagining the walls of the firebox being melted thru at all.

I think what prompted the question, was the advice to ensure that there was a 1/2" layer of ash on the bottom of the firebox at all times, "protecting the stove." Obviously the bottom of the stove is the most subjected to the heat, and I presume therefore, the most vulnerable, and most likely the first part of the stove to wear out.

Then there are the internal fire bricks, which seem like overkill, and so I wondered why they are there, actually. There's plenty of heat from the fire! I figure either they are there to radiate the heat like the soapstone that is on the outside of some types of stoves, OR they are there to protect the stove walls from melting, or both.

-Soupy1957

 

[EatenByLimestone]

The firebricks are there for insulation. They insulate the walls from heat and allow the firebox to come up to temperature faster. This allows the secondaries to kick in faster and hopefully gives a cleaner burn. I imagine it could help on clearances also since the heat mostly leaves the front and top of the stove.

Matt

 

[blades]

Some the secondary pipes can burn out or the top baffle can give up. I mne the top baffle has had the course and I do not know if I can repair it. So it is new stove time then attack old. If I can repair it great if not well scrap steel prices were up a bit ago.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Believe it or not, I was at someone's place and they had a stove in the porch of the house. They then forced the air into the house through a duct.

I'm having a hard time processing this. It's so wrong. Please tell me you made this up.

No, this was not made up. It was a weird setup but the part where I saw the flames was the most scary. I don't understand how but that house is still standing. Today they have one of those outdoor wood burners; a real smoke dragon. I was in their house last winter again and I about froze. Everyone sat in the living room and everyone had blankets to cover themselves. A sad state of affairs if I ever saw one.

 

[SolarAndWood]

Sounds like a couple of really poor solutions to the keep the mess out of the living room problem.

 

[SolarAndWood]

Obviously the bottom of the stove is the most subjected to the heat, and I presume therefore, the most vulnerable, and most likely the first part of the stove to wear out.

We have an old steel smoke dragon insert at the camp that fell off a truck a long time ago. The top of it warped around the flue exit pretty badly. If it didn't blow so much air out the chimney or its purpose was more than a slightly more efficient fireplace, it would be a problem.

 

[soupy1957]

My wife found a small Pot Belly Stove that was designed for coal, that she put in the back yard, right NEXT to the back deck, with about 6 ft of Flue Pipe coming off the top (to nowhere) and she wants to burn wood or coal in it (for "what" I have no idea). I told her not to, because it probably has lots of breathing points (not sealed properly anymore) and I don't want to burn the deck down!! (lol). It is more likely more rational to worry about her burning the deck down, than for me to worry about burning the house down with a year old stove inside (at least, not because of stove compromise anyway).

My Laser Temperature gun came in yesterday. I bought it, hoping that the reads I get from the stove front/top, sides, will help me to validate what the magnetic Thermometer says. My original intent was to use it to read Flue Temps, but a few of you in here tell me (and I tend to believe it) that because my Flue is a double-wall, it won't give me accurate reads.

In the end, when all is said and done, I don't know how well the stove we bought will hold up, in comparison to a cast iron parlor stove, or equivelent cast iron style, ............but I would think I can get a decent amount of time out of it. Hopefully I'll learn how to keep the temp in the stove from being SUPER HOT all the time, (knowing that it will get that way when wood is first added), and keeping it more in about a 650º average, to preserve the integrity of the stove, for as long as I can.

-Soupy1957

 

[madrone]

Then there are the internal fire bricks, which seem like overkill, and so I wondered why they are there, actually. There's plenty of heat from the fire! I figure either they are there to radiate the heat like the soapstone that is on the outside of some types of stoves, OR they are there to protect the stove walls from melting, or both.

-Soupy1957

They are what brings the internal temperature of the stove up high enough to achieve complete combustion. Without them, the stove gets hot, but not always hot enough to burn clean.

 

[soupy1957]

How much does the glass on your stove door, tell the tale of the burn, and the condition of the firebox, in this mix?

-Soupy1957

 

[Battenkiller]

Then there are the internal fire bricks, which seem like overkill, and so I wondered why they are there, actually. There's plenty of heat from the fire! I figure either they are there to radiate the heat like the soapstone that is on the outside of some types of stoves, OR they are there to protect the stove walls from melting, or both.

-Soupy1957

They are what brings the internal temperature of the stove up high enough to achieve complete combustion. Without them, the stove gets hot, but not always hot enough to burn clean.

Depends on what kind of firebrick. Hard firebrick has about 4 times the thermal conductivity of insulating firebrick, or put another way, 4 times less insulating ability. I always thought that hard firebrick was added merely to protect the interior of the stove.

Most modern designs appear to be using insulating firebrick, not hard firebrick. If that gives closer clearances, it also means less heat is radiating from the stove. Yes, it may make the stove burn with less pollution as required by the EPA regs, but it doesn't seem like the ideal way to use it as a space heater. The BTU output of a wood stove is directly proportional to the total surface area at any given average temperature. If the same amount of heat is, in fact, actually getting out of the box, that can only mean that the uninsulated surfaces are hotter than a stove that has no insulation. That would seem to lead to premature failure compared to a conventional stove, at least of the uninsulated parts that are being exposed to the higher temps. And that appears to be the case from reading lots of posts here.

My stove gets real hot - inside and out - real fast... without the aid of insulating firebrick. Sure, it doesn't burn as clean as a newer stove, but that's likely more to do with a less than perfect introduction of secondary air, leading to failed secondary burns. The introduction of air at the top of the chamber through tubes beneath insulated baffle plates is a better way to go for clean burning, but I suspect mine throws off more heat quicker than an insulated stove of the same radiating surface area.

 

[soupy1957]

Battenkiller: So I guess you'd be an advocate for REMOVING the interior white bricks? I can't help but wonder what the consequences of that would be, in terms of stove integrity. I "hear" you speaking of the benefits, but what would be the downfall of such an action?

If it turns out that the popular consensus is that there aren't any appreciable or serious degredation issues, as a result of removing the white bricks, I'd be tempted ONLY if the removal was adding benefit.

-Soupy1957

 

[Battenkiller]

Battenkiller: So I guess you'd be an advocate for REMOVING the interior white bricks? I can't help but wonder what the consequences of that would be, in terms of stove integrity. I "hear" you speaking of the benefits, but what would be the downfall of such an action?

Gosh no! If your stove was designed for them, they are likely an essential part of the design in many ways. You are playing with fire (sorry) by removing it. If you don't want a stove with white (insulating) firebrick in it, get a nice old SD like my Vigilant and burn in that.

 

[soupy1957]

Oh, sorry...........guess I misinterpreted your post. My "bad."

-Soupy1957

 

[vvvv]

fbrix warm up slow & cool off slow so that the residual heat of the stove helps to heat up the reload of wood so to get to the critical burn temp sooner. preserves the stove metal too

 

[Battenkiller]

fbrix warm up slow & cool off slow so that the residual heat of the stove helps to heat up the reload of wood so to get to the critical burn temp sooner. preserves the stove metal too

I guess that makes sense, but I try to reload way before the internal temps drop that low. If it don't burst into flames within a few seconds after I drop it in, I screwed up somehow. Mornings, of course, are a different story.

 

[soupy1957]

I'll be interested to hear more about your "Morning" issues, battenkiller. I have the advantage of having a wife who is home all day, most days, and who gets up often, during the night. We should have no trouble keeping a stable fire, 24/7, provided we do things "right."

-Soupy1957

 

[Battenkiller]

I'll be interested to hear more about your "Morning" issues, battenkiller.

Soupy, to be honest, most of my morning issues actually have to do with making it down the stairs to fill the stove for the first time of the day. :lol:

I don't ever have an issue getting the stove started, even if it's cold. That's rarely the case, but since I don't and won't get up to fill it in the middle of the night, there is not a raging bed of coals like there is during my daytime refills. That's fine with me. I clean out ashes, clear accumulation from the air inlet holes, inspect latches and the action of the thermostat, maybe check the flue with a light and mirror. It also gives me a chance to run my flue temps way up without risking overfiring the stove. I like to get the flue temps up to 600-650ºF during that time. This gets my masonry chimney warmed, which allows the average flue temp to be higher and the stove to draw better. If I run my stove in updraft mode with a full charge on a hot coal bed, it needs careful observation in order for it to not run away on me. With a small charge in the morning, I can open the air wide and the flue temps won't ever go beyond around 650º. This is for my stove and flue, I can't speak for how your stove works.

A warm flue also lessens the amount of creosote buildup due to condensation. Running the stove hot for an hour each day helps to dry out any creosote that may have been left from the night before so it doesn't eventually turn to Stage 3 (glaze) creosote. If you do this every morning, you likely won't have problems with creosote buildup in the lower part of the pipe. But you need to be religious about doing this every day. Letting the pipe accumulate creosote for several weeks and then building a very hot fire just might touch off any buildup you have. To me, it's an all or nothing thing.