Somethings not right

[archer292]

I have been burning a clydesdale 24/7 for a little over a month. I have searched and read lots of good info on this site along with contacting a few other owners, turner n burner has been a great help. I still feel there is something not quite right and i am trying to figure out what it is. I will give an account of this mornings fire and would appreciate any thoughts. 630 am, hot coals from last nights load at 11pm, blower still on, turned it off, spread the coals out and made a gully down the middle from front to back and loaded four good size splits, one cherry and three locust I left the door cracked for 5 minutes got good flames , closed it up waited till it looked right and the temp was at 300 stove top, this was around 7am, turned on blowers about a third and shut air down to 50%. All is well so far, I have good flames at the wood but very little secondaries, if any. I waited another 10 minutes and turned her down 90%, ten minutes after that the fire is stable with flames at the wood a stove top of 325 but still very little secondary flame if any. So now i am at 720 with the air down 90% and flame at the wood and temp at 325. 8am, very little vissible flame and temp has begun to drop, 310. I have checked the temp every 10 minutes or so and it has been on a steady drop. 927am, all wood except the rear bottom split look to be coals and temp is at 240. Does this sound right? After everything I have read, it doesn't to me. Maybe I am wrong but temps seem low, time seems short and no light show.
The stove top temps have been higher at times but there is no consistancy. I did contact my dealer for some help and his response was " It's just a metal box " insinuating it was operator error or it was functioning properly, I'm not sure which.

 

[Chettt]

I'm not familiar with your stove but I think I would try leaving your primary open until you reach your desired temperature and then close it down. Also if the outside air temperature is above freezing, draft won't be as strong.

 

[mayhem]

Wet or unseasoned wood would do this. Are you sure its good, seasosned wood?

I know when I shut down my primary air control that the flames will die down significantly, and if the wood is damp they'll go out completely...when burning wet wood on secondary burn there is no flame and the temps will definitely die out, leafing it to just charcoal the wood until the fire dries i tout enough to burn...eventually the pile in the box bursts into flame, sometimes almost explosively.

 

[savageactor7]

Good morning archer292 I'm not familiar with your stove either but as long as your home tending the fire just burn 1 or 2 logs hot like 500 or so? 500 is still 500 whether there's 2 logs or 6 logs in the fire box.

As far as secondaries go while you can't always see the flames you'll know if it's working by looking at the chimney. No smoke secondaries are working. Chimney smokes either start up air is engaged or secondaries aren't working. Secondaries burn smoke if you don't see smoke they're working ...

 

[Rich M]

A few suggestions. First you say "good size splits", try using small and medium sized during your morning start up. Next is the locust, that's not good start up wood either, works better in a well pre heated stove with a thick hot coal bed. Finally it sounds like you are closing the air too soon and too much as well as turning on the blower too soon.

For morning start up try getting the stove back up to temp quickly by using small splits and full air. This will preheat everything nicely and give you a hot coal bed. Then load up with the larger hardwood and let it go wide open a little longer than you have been, you should have a raging fire going and then try turning down the air 1/3. If the flames die back a bit let it catch back up before you turn it down another 1/3. For your final air setting try 75% instead of 90% that should keep things hotter and give you a more active flame. At this time turn the blower on low, let it run there for a while before turning up to a medium/medium high setting. Cranking the blower too early, too high or both can cool off the fire box and effect your secondary burn.

The last thing is to make sure your wood is really dry. Wet wood will also cause the symptoms you describe. If you're unsure, buy a bundle of supermarket wood and try that to see the difference.

 

[archer292]

Thanks for the responses so far. The clydesdale is an insert not a free standing stove and the temps I am taking are from the top center of the " cook top". I have never seen the 500 mark but I'm sure that's because the spot I am taking the temps from is on an outside cover sort of speak. I will try all of the suggestions so far and keep posting. Thanks again. Good tip on the locust not being good start up wood. I would think the cherry might be better.It's definitely a lot lighter and burns quicker too.

 

[DriftWood]

Its late in the wood burning season could your chimney could need sweeping and the cap cleaning, I would start there and clean out all the all the ash and make sure noting is out of place inside the box or blocking the air intake inlets. If the cap is pluged or the baffle plate is out of place it will act as you describe.

 

[ClydesdaleBurner]

Hey fellow Clyesdale owner... I've noticed that the air control is very sensitve, at least on mine. I can have a roaring fire going with the air control down about 75% and I'll nudge it down a little more and the flames will start diminishing. I realize a lot has to do with the outside air temp and the draft, but lately I haven't been able to get the air control closed more than 75%. Any more and the fire will die.

So lately I just get it going good 100% open, then start turning it down... 75% for 10 minutes, 50% for 20 minutes and then when I get to 75% closed I stop there. Sometimes I can get it closed down to say 90%, but other times I can't and the fire suffers. So I'm happy with it 3/4 shut down. But every stove is different based on the draft, so you might have to find that sweet spot on yours. From your post it sounds like your sweet spot might be like mine, maybe around 75% closed. Give that a try.

As for the secondaries I don't have any explanation for that. I can get secondaries on each burn, but on a restart in the morning it might take a while longer because I have to get the stove temp back up to 1100 degrees (inside the firebox). Also the warmest I've had my stove top is 440 degrees and that's only happened a few times. I can usually get it to about 400 and it coasts there for a while. But sometimes if the wood is wet I'll notice my stove temp will struggle to get to 400...

Good luck.

 

[archer292]

I have had it up to 425 very few times but couldn't tell you how. There are times I leave the air open 100% and I can't get the temp over 330. Also when the air is open I have visible smoke coming out of the chimney, when I turn down the air the smoke lessens but so does the temp.

What is the baffle plate?

 

[archer292]

I tried letting the fire burn without the blower and without turning down the air. I was able to get the insert to 400 and it was still climbing. It is only one fire but seems like a big difference compared to what I was doing. The times I couldn't get the temp into the mid 300s must have been because I was using the fan too soon and then trying to make a difference with the air instead of just letting things come up in temp first. I can only guess, but Im definitely not complaining at this point. It would drive me nuts that the temp wouldn't rise, it seemed as though the fire would just stall, it would keep decent flame but not good temp. I am down to 75% and temp is 435. BIG difference so far.

THANKS

 

[savageactor7]

Good morning Archer292 ...

...Like I said I’m unfamiliar with your stove but the ‘baffle plates’ reference are the tubes you see at the top of the firebox.

As warm as it is today I’m sure your stove is out…if it is get your compressor and blow some air threw those tubes…take your time and blow it every which way that’s possible, after of course you’ve cleaned out all the ashes.

I have a different stove than yours but my blower works better when it’s colder outside on a mild day like today 35* I leave it off.

Finally you say your wood is seasoned and I believe you but it sure does sound like it's not. If you can scrounge up so old pallets and try them out just to see if they burn like your seasoned cherry and locust. I hope you can fix this cause having a stove that pleases you is very comforting. Good luck

 

[eernest4]

after you have tried what every body else recommended, if you still not happy try blowing out your secondary air tubes with compressed air. you could have some kind of partial blockage in the secondary air tubes.

Look in your owners manual to see where the cold secondary air intake is located. You may have some kind of air regulating device on the cold air intake end of the secondary tubes.
It may be hooked up to the primary air regulating lever or have its own seperate control linkage.

What ever the case is here, and your owner's manual should make clear, the nature & opperation of the secondary air regulation set up for you.

make sure that the cold air secondary air intake regulation devise is not clogged with any foriegn substance and that the control is properly linked up & opperates freely.

If you don't have your owners manual, it can be downloaded into your computer over the internet for free, from the mfg web site.

best of luck!

 

[Flame]

archer292,
I just read your post so I am a little late in the game to give my two cents. But anyway it sounds like you are on track keeping the blower off until later in the game. Although I have a different set up I found that trying to start up with hard woods can be a bit tricky. The thing is to try and get all or a lot of the wood burning (at the same time) at some put to get the wood chared for coal and to produce a lot of heat to get the temp up high and quickly (before it drops again). This way you can shut her down and kick in those primarys. I find that when using only hard woods I toss in a few (at least four for my size stove) good 12 X1 pieces of pallet wood or other very dry wood. When this ignites it seriusly brings up the heat and primes the hard wood quickly for that secondary burn. Sometimes with just hard wood I get similar results like you stated and the wood lights up but later dies down and slowly coals on with just a low output of heat. If I manage to get the stove hotter all at once in the beginning with the pallet wood mixed in then I get a completly differnt burn. I suspect that my hardwood is not completly dry as it could be also.

 

[DriftWood]

What is the baffle plate?

The baffle plate sits above the air tubes. It may be a single sheet of ceramic, a sheet of ceramic toped with fiber wool. fire brick close together or something else made of metal. The one on the Hearthstone Heritage will get pushed out of place very easily with a push from below. The problem is this allows exhaust gases to go straight up into the stack bypassing the secondary burn tubes below it. Simply look up into the open door above the secondary air tubes to see if any gaps are allowing gas to go up instead of to the fount as is normal. If it is out of place the plate needs to be repositioned.

 

[archer292]

First off thanks for all the info. It has been a big help. My manual does not go into any detail about the secondary air intake or anything like that. The baffle plate according to the manual is a grey ceramic plate above the secondary tubes, looks black to me, doesn't move and sounds like metal when tapped on. Things are better but I'm still not convinced there isn't a problem. I can get the temps up higher using the suggestions but can't sustain the heat and " usable burn time" is still rather short. Temps will rise if I wait before using the blowers or dampering down but the bottom falls out as soon as I do. I can get a decent burn time if I use the 200 to 200 degree rule of thumb, but most of the time is spent in the 250 range. It is enough to keep the house in the 70 degree range during the day but it has been in the 40s. I don't think 250 is gonna do it when it's cold out side. Still trying though.

 

[Carl]

Not familar with your stove but all I have seen have some type of insulation above the secondary plate if it is metal. This holds the heat below it to create enough to cause the secondary burn. Maybe you need to check into that aspect of it if you have only a metal plate there with no insulation. Just a thought.