Stove Install Plans for Next Heating Season.

[vandedav]

hello all,

i am planning on installing a stove this coming year to be operational for the 2010-2011 heating season. I have begun to put up firewood as I know the importance of burning seasoned wood. I have attached a picture of the layout of our house. The house was built in 2003 and is very well insulated. As it is right now, we do not spend much on propane to heat the house, but I just can't stand the fact that I have wood available and it is basically going to waste. The house is right around 1000 square feet. The Living, Dining, and Kitchen all have ~14' cathedral ceilings. The bathroom and bedrooms have standard 8' tall ceilings.

My plan is to build the hearth in the corner were the boxed X is located. I will discuss all of my plans for the hearth in a later post. Right now I would like to get your thoughts and recommendations on what stoves would be best to consider. My wife is open to many different looks, she just told me that she doesn't want a black steel box. I would like a new/newer epa approved stove. Other than that, I am pretty open to options. I know that there are hundreds of stoves available, but I am hoping to see what you would do in my situation.

I hope to heat the whole house, but I understand that stoves are designed to be room heaters. I plan on designing into my hearth the ability to move air from the bedrooms and living room past the stove. I will discuss this in more detail in the future.

Any questions feel free to ask. Thanks for your interest.

dav

 

[SolarAndWood]

I don't think you will have any problem heating the whole house with that stove location. Is your goal to eliminate propane or just reduce it and keep the house a little warmer?

 

[firefighterjake]

No specific recommendations for a woodstove . . . there are many, many brands . . . some are good, some are great, some are not-so-great . . . a lot of what makes a great woodstove for you and your specific needs however is what you want for features, what you want to pay and what you personally think looks good.

One of your first homework assignments is to figure out your spacing needs and see what makes/models would make a good fit. You've already figured that you've got 1,000 square feet. That's the first step. However, I would strongly suggest you look at stoves that are just one size larger than this . . . or stoves that heat 1,000 square feet + . . . the reason being is that the stove manufacturers do not take into consideration various climates (i.e. a 1,000 square foot home in a windy, Maine winter is quite different from a 1,000 square foot home in an area where it gets cool for a few months), how well insulated your home is (i.e. is your home a drafty farmhouse built in the 1870s with little to no insulation and old windows or a super-insulated home built three years ago), home lay out (i.e. closed, traditional rooms vs. open lay out.)

At this point you should still have quite the list of stoves to look at which would fit your need . . . so now what I would recommend is figuring out exactly what you and your wife like in terms of stove features and the look. It sounds like she is not a fan of black steel stoves. Perhaps she would like enamled cast iron . . . or soapstone. Is an ash pan important? What about having both a side loading door and front loading door? Deciding whether to go with steel, cast iron or soapstone (and listening to the various pros- and cons- of each type is one of the great debates frequently seen here at hearth.com . . . my own opinion . . . all woodstoves generate heat and heat is good -- yes they each have some advantages and disadvantages so go with what you can afford and like.)

Now right about now you may be wondering . . . what's this cat (aka catalytic converter) and non-cat (aka secondary burning) . . . how important is this to my decision? Well, only you can answer this question. A lot has been written on the cat vs. non-cat debate with supporters and opponents in both camps . . . my own take . . . I went with secondary burning tech when I bought my stove . . . now, after having been here for some time . . . I think I could go either way . . . cat or non-cat.

So, you've now weeded down the potential list . . . first finding stoves that were the right size . . . then finding stoves with the features and type of construction you like . . . at this point you need to check your local stove shops (if opting to buy local vs. buying on the internet which is entirely possible by the way -- in fact Woodstock stoves pretty much are all sold on the phone and internet) and check out these stoves in person . . . find some prices . . . ask some questions . . . and then come right back here and ask even more questions about the make/models you are interested in . . . and check out the Stove Ratings section which has all kinds of reviews on all kinds of stoves from actual users.

You final step . . . make the purchase and set the date.

A few random thoughts . . .

-- You mention heating the home . . . I will say right here and now that not only can you supplement the heating in your home, but you should be able to heat your entire home with a well placed and well sized woodstove. I heat my 30 x 40 two-story Cape almost entirely with wood . . . I do run an electric space heater in my utility room (ironically enough to keep my oil boiler's pipes warm . . . along with some plumbing pipes) and when I leave for extended periods of time (i.e. vacation in the Carribean) I use the oil boiler . . . otherwise the woodstove is the main heater in my home . . . and many folks heat even larger homes than me entirely with wood.

-- Your placement looks OK . . . I would think the better placement might be the living room. My reasoning: a) you could set up a fan to direct the heat into the dining room and into the bedrooms and b) I am an advocate of putting your heat where you will spend the bulk of your time which I am guessing would be the living room. That said, I think your idea is also sound.

-- Getting wood now is the key to being a very happy first year burner. It sounds like you're already ahead of the game . . . a common mistake made by many of us.

-- I suspect your wife may really like the enameled woodstoves and soapstone woodstoves. The two soapstone stoves to consider would be Hearthstone and Woodstock . . . there are many, many enameled woodstoves out there: Quadra-fire, Harmon, Jotul and a bunch of other ones which elude my memory.

 

[vandedav]

SolarAndWood,

I would love to eliminate our propane use completely, but with the lifestyle we live (very active and sporadic on when we are home and away) I understand that I will not be able to completely eliminate it. I would love to be able to heat the whole house whenever we are around and leave the propane furnace to sustain the temp after the fire burns out when we are gone.

firefighterjake,

that was a great post, thanks for all the information. i have been browsing on here for a while so i am pretty familiar with all of the topics you brought up. personally i like the looks of the soupstone stoves, but the enameled cast iron catches my eye as well.

I plan on making the hearth a corner install with the stove sitting at an angle into the room. I would love to have a side door, but if i remember right that the manufacturer's don't recommend using the side door in a corner install. is that with all stoves, or just a certain brand? and if you had enough clearance would it even be an issue?

ash door or not is up for debate. i know that there is some concern from some people about the ash door being another source for air to infiltrate the stove and possibly cause draft concerns. i don't mind scooping ashes if that is what would give the best performance.

the reason why i have avoided the living room is because the exterior walls of that room are lined with windows. my only real options would be to remove some windows to make a place for it, or locate it on the east wall. either of these options present a further problem of placement of other furniture in the room...with clearances to combustibles, the room gets real small real fast. like i said in the first post and didn't elaborate on, I plan on creating a system to push the cold air from the extents back to the stove location. with the size of the house and how well insulated it is, i think that i will not have a problem keeping the whole house at a fairly consistent temperature.

 

[Fi-Q]

I personnaly went with a ''Black box'' for price reason..... but man, if you'Re ready to put some $$$ into it. Some stove out there are piece of art....... You don'T have a very big house to heat, so there is hundreds of diffrent stove available.

Me, the only thing I didn'T like on most of the smaller stove, it that you have to load the wood sideways...... Anyway, look around and there is a LOT to learn here on this forums...

My father in law just bought a enmaeled PAcific Energy, what a nice stove, but 3k$ is a lot of money for the stove only.

Good luck and keep us posted....

 

[begreen]

Looks like it should work ok, especially if the opening to the living room could be enlarged to allow a freer exchange of air.

If you can examine last years bills and determine how much was used last December, January and February, that will help with sizing the stove correctly.

 

[vandedav]

I personnaly went with a ''Black box'' for price reason..... but man, if you'Re ready to put some $$$ into it. Some stove out there are piece of art....... You don'T have a very big house to heat, so there is hundreds of diffrent stove available.

Me, the only thing I didn'T like on most of the smaller stove, it that you have to load the wood sideways...... Anyway, look around and there is a LOT to learn here on this forums...

My father in law just bought a enmaeled PAcific Energy, what a nice stove, but 3k$ is a lot of money for the stove only.

Good luck and keep us posted....

yeah, i don't mind the 'black box' for functionality, but with my wife, at this point, it may be the fancy stove or no stove...so, we will see.

Looks like it should work ok, especially if the opening to the living room could be enlarged to allow a freer exchange of air.

If you can examine last years bills and determine how much was used last December, January and February, that will help with sizing the stove correctly.

for the last 4 years we have been able to get by with only filling our 500 gallon propane tank one time. we have filled it each summer when the gauge was at ~15% and they have filled to to capacity ~80%. so, we have used around 325 gallons of propane a year keeping the house at an average temperature of 68 degrees. this year we will likely use more since the living room is a recent addition. it was a screen porch that was converted into living space, so that is not factored into those heating numbers as this is our first heating season with that room. it will likely impact our heating needs considerably with all of the windows.

 

[begreen]

So maybe estimate 500 gallons/yr? If the numbers are correct that should be around 45.75 Mbtus, which isn't too bad. Seems like a nice 2 cu ft stove would work well. Depending on how often you burn and how hot you kept it, I would expect you to go through about 2-3 cords. You may want to consider a jacketed or soapstone stove for closer clearances and a softer heat.

 

[firefighterjake]

SolarAndWood,

I would love to eliminate our propane use completely, but with the lifestyle we live (very active and sporadic on when we are home and away) I understand that I will not be able to completely eliminate it. I would love to be able to heat the whole house whenever we are around and leave the propane furnace to sustain the temp after the fire burns out when we are gone.

Even being active you should be able to cut quite a bit into your propane bill . . . once you get a handle on how to run a woodstove you will learn to load 'er up and leave and the house will stay heated for several hours. Depending on various factors (type of stove, size of stove, wood, house insulation, etc.) the heat may stay in the home until you arrive back home and fire the stove back up . . . or at the very least the propane will only kick on for a bit. In either case, it is possible to really cut back on the cost of heating when you go to wood.

firefighterjake,

that was a great post, thanks for all the information. i have been browsing on here for a while so i am pretty familiar with all of the topics you brought up. personally i like the looks of the soupstone stoves, but the enameled cast iron catches my eye as well.

I have a matte black cast iron Jotul . . . if I was to buy this same stove today I would spring for the blue-black enamel version . . . and if I was to buy any stove that I wanted today I would be sorely tempted by the soapstone models . . . but would most likely still go back to my beloved Jotul.

I plan on making the hearth a corner install with the stove sitting at an angle into the room. I would love to have a side door, but if i remember right that the manufacturer's don't recommend using the side door in a corner install. is that with all stoves, or just a certain brand? and if you had enough clearance would it even be an issue?

This really depends on the make/model . . . the Oslo for example prohibits the use of the side loading door. To this day I'm not sure why . . . I would imagine if you had the clearance it should be fine . . . but I would never recommend going against a manufacturer's specficiations.

ash door or not is up for debate. i know that there is some concern from some people about the ash door being another source for air to infiltrate the stove and possibly cause draft concerns. i don't mind scooping ashes if that is what would give the best performance.

I personally think the ash door concern is over-rated. I have an ash pan (and hence an ash door) and love it. Once a week dumping . . . easy peasy. No mess. No fuss. About the only thing I learned . . . and it only took one lesson . . . was to make sure any spill-over from a full ash pan is cleaned out of the ash pan box so the ash pan door shuts tightly.

the reason why i have avoided the living room is because the exterior walls of that room are lined with windows. my only real options would be to remove some windows to make a place for it, or locate it on the east wall. either of these options present a further problem of placement of other furniture in the room...with clearances to combustibles, the room gets real small real fast. like i said in the first post and didn't elaborate on, I plan on creating a system to push the cold air from the extents back to the stove location. with the size of the house and how well insulated it is, i think that i will not have a problem keeping the whole house at a fairly consistent temperature.

I see . . . and understand . . . in an ideal world we would have movable windows and furniture would always fit perfectly wherever we wanted to put it . . . but it doesn't always work out that way. As I said, I suspect your suggested placement will still work well.

 

[jjs777_fzr]

If you are looking for suggestions I can't help but think you would have to tell us up front what exactly is your price range.
I went with black steel box for price alone - but if I could spend $2500-3000 I would consider a soapstone model.
The location you picked is great...I wish I had a layout like for the wood stove.