Stove pipe upgrade

[RockCastile]

I'm on my second season with a single wall stove pipe (press/snap together type from hardware store) that continues to give off strong paint fumes at every startup when my magnet thermometer on pipe gets into the supposedly optimal 400 degree range. I'm ready to upgrade. Ideally I would like to go with Duravent DVL but I saw an older post on here about someone getting paint/metal fumes off this brand of DVL at startup. Anyone had this problem with Duravent? If I thought there was any likelihood of this being an issue, I would rather go instead with one of the brands of pre-formed single wall that the manufacturer claims "DOES NOT" give off paint fumes. Anyone have "no fume" single wall? Is their claim about fumes accurate?

 

[Marshy]

I'm not sure anything like that exists. That might just be form my lack of experience so other may chime in on that regards. I know for a fact that you will get the curing smell from DVL just like the single wall. Why don't you just run the stove hotter one time so the pipe gets to 5-600F and then you'll never have to worry about it again?

 

[RockCastile]

Yes, I might try firing it hard to try and gas off all the fumes at once. But another thing I like about the brands of supposedly "no fume" single wall is that the ones i have seen are pre-formed and (near) perfectly round which to me seems like the more flush connection at the joints would strengthen (tho perhaps only marginally) the draft at the stove's air intake.

 

[Highbeam]

I'm on my second season with a single wall stove pipe (press/snap together type from hardware store) that continues to give off strong paint fumes at every startup when my magnet thermometer on pipe gets into the supposedly optimal 400 degree range. I'm ready to upgrade. Ideally I would like to go with Duravent DVL but I saw an older post on here about someone getting paint/metal fumes off this brand of DVL at startup. Anyone had this problem with Duravent? If I thought there was any likelihood of this being an issue, I would rather go instead with one of the brands of pre-formed single wall that the manufacturer claims "DOES NOT" give off paint fumes. Anyone have "no fume" single wall? Is their claim about fumes accurate?

Whoa there! You are getting it way too hot. Your thermometer is a surface meter for the stove top and only on the stove top is 400 the beginning og the "normal" range. On the stove pipe the range is totally different and much lower. Usually 250 at the bottom and up to 450 on top.

 

[Squisher]

I have single wall on my stove in my house and in my shop. Both welded seam, and snap together. I have zero paint cure smell from either set ups. Both burned off the first few times they got hot and really hot and now they are fine. Ime it's not the norm that pipe continues to give fumes indefinetly. Just bought at the local hardware stores and no mention of 'fume free' or not. I can assure you the snap together pipe in my shop is of the cheapest type made and I get no fume issues from it and I just installed it this last fall.

 

[Marshy]

@RockCastile, Im not quite sure what snap together pipe is that you are using. I only know of the stuff that is crimped at one end. If its the crimped style you should use some self tapping screws to hold that single wall pipe together. It will be a very bad day if that pipe ever came detached with a firing burning. Check your local hardware stove and get some self tapping screws and use 3 at each connection between pipes.

 

[webby3650]

Fume free pipe? I've never heard of anyone claiming this, or any pipe continuing to omit smell once it's been fired a few times. It really sounds like you are overfiring it to me. Like highbeam said, if 400 is your surface temp then it's screaming hot internally!

 

[Squisher]

On my meeco magnet the optimum range is 250-550. And on my condar it's 230-475 as best operation. So no 400 is not smoking hot. 550+would be. I run right up past 400 surface temp every reload.

 

[bholler]

Fume free pipe? I've never heard of anyone claiming this

ventis claims it. And it is better but still not fume free

 

[Squisher]

I measure my exterior single wall pipe temp on my summit with a auberin unit with the ring thermocouple. It's much faster acting than the magnet springs and deadly accurate when compared to the magnet and my IR gun. I've seen over 700 on it more than once. I don't aim to go that high but I don't always watch as close as I should.

it's caused me no issues.

 

[bholler]

I've seen over 700 on it more than once. I don't aim to go that high but I don't always watch as close as I should.

set your alarm man. Mine is set at 450 I usually shut it back at 400 but It has hit 450 more than a few times

 

[Squisher]

For me running up good and hot on each reload heats my chimney right up and builds a strong draft so that I have a good pull and am able to,cut my air back hard and still maintain really hot stove temps for most of the load.

If I set my alarm at 450 it'd go off nearly every time. I cruise at 400 and it drifts back down throughout the burn to anywhere in the range of 200-250 by the end. I heat my stovetop up to 600+ every load too and it will drift down to 300-400 throughout the load. These are numbers for when I want the heat. Not shoulder season burns.

 

[bholler]

If I set my alarm at 450 it'd go off every time. I cruise at 400 and it drifts back down throughout the burn to anywhere in the range of 200-250 by the end. I heat my stovetop up to 600+ every load too and it will drift down to 300-400 throughout the load. These are numbers for when I want the heat. Not shoulder season burns.

You run the surface of your pipe up to 600 on every load???

 

[Squisher]

I didn't want to derail the op's thread. Just pointing out that 400 is not smoking hot for exterior single wall pipe temps. It's well within the range of what manufacturers mark on their slow acting magnet thermometers as optimum burn temps.

The condar at over 475 just says wasting fuel. And the meeco which lists its optimum burn right up to 550 just says too hot after that.

Here's my current load with air cut right back. Settled in for the long hot haul.

 

[Squisher]

You run the surface of your pipe up to 600 on every load???

No, my stovetop to 600+. But 400+ every load for my exterior fue temp. And I don't bat an eye if that gets upwards of 500. I agree with the meeco thermometer. I'm good with right up to 550. 600 I consider to hot.

 

[bholler]

No. But 400+ every load. And I don't bat an eye if that gets upwards of 500. I agree with the meeco thermometer. I'm good with right up to 550. 600 I consider to hot.

I am not worried that it is to hot till it hits 600 either but if I run it much above 400 I fell I am wasting heat. I cruise with my pipe temp at 250 to 275 and stove top at 600 to 700 That seems to give me the most heat while still getting good burn times. Yes I can run it higher but the pipe temp goes up allot without increasing the stove top temps that much. But I totally agree 400 is not to hot. I think it is to hot to cruise at because you are wasting heat but not going to damage anything.

 

[Squisher]

It's been discussed on here a bit before that I think I see some higher temps because I'm reading 12"s up, at about 18"s up i see about 70-80 degrees less with my IR gun, which I verify too against the auberin readout. So where and how you measure all comes into play too. I am commenting on my particular setup.

But I will maintain to the OP that 400 exterior stove pipe temp measured 12-18's above the flue collar is not super hot and if you are all installed and properly setup I'd run it up a good bit higher than that to try to 'cure' your paint before replacing the pipe.

 

[bholler]

But I will maintain to the OP that 400 exterior stove pipe temp measured 12-18's above the flue collar is not super hot and if you are all installed and properly setup I'd run it up a good bit higher than that to try to 'cure' your paint before replacing the pipe.

Agreed.

Btw I am measuring at 20" just above my stack damper.

 

[Squisher]

I bet that explains most of the difference in temps, the 8"s. And interesting what a difference that can be.

 

[Highbeam]

Your class A chimney is only rated for up to 1000 continuous and if we believe that internal temps are 2x surface temps then we know that 500 surface temps are the redline. This is why I don't exceed 450 on the surface of single wall pipe and recommend you don't either!

The OP was under the false impression that 400 was the bottom of the "ideal" range for pipe surface temps. It is not. It is way up near the top. No telling how high the OP was running the flue temps when he started smoking the paint.

 

[bholler]

if we believe that internal temps are 2x surface temps

It is only 2x the surface temp 1/3 of the way across the pipe it is cooler in the center and much cooler on the outside. But I still agree 450 is the highest I like to see regardless. I am not worried about it if you occasionally go up to 600 or so but it should not be a regular thing. Chimneys and liners are rated to 2100 intermittent so 600 is just fine at times. And 400 is absolutely not way to hot.

 

[Squisher]

Well I've already pointed out what manufacturers are willing to print on thermometers that they are selling as stovepipe monitors.

Highbeam I feel the OP was kind of obscure on his description. It'd be hard to conclude either way if he meant the optimum zone started at 400 or that he was smelling the pipe around 400 and it was in the optimum zone. But until they chime back in I couldn't say for certain what he meant. But yes if he was running up way past 400 he may have been getting to hot. But if he is just hitting 400 and the pipe is starting to smoke(which is about where they'll burn off at to start). Then a run or two hotter like up to 500+ may solve his issues. We'll have to wait to hear back.

 

[Squisher]

And I'll add. If the OP is running crazy hot as you assumed. Why is his pipe not cured?

I run hot. Zero offgassing paint fume problems. As they are well cured.

 

[webby3650]

And I'll add. If the OP is running crazy hot as you assumed. Why is his pipe not cured?

I run hot. Zero offgassing paint fume problems. As they are well cured.

Perhaps he's getting some creosote build up between high burns and it's lighting off on his next big fire? Maybe it's some smoke leakage rather than paint curing? Perhaps some type of sealant in the joints that's not needed and offgassing? We really need a lot more details to know what's going on here. After about the first week I've never smelled any odor from the pipe unless it really got to rippin, and no smell up to that point. Double or single wall..

 

[Squisher]

I agree. More info to know the full story.

I was mentioning in my first reply I felt it may not be a pipe curing issue. It seems to me that single wall pipe cures right up once it gets really hot a couple of times. I just went on to clarify based on the only real figure that was given that 400 is not super hot for exterior single wall pipe measured 12-18"s above the flue collar. If it is in fact a stovetop thermometer that the OP has and is using as a stovepipe thermometer and he is in fact way overshooting 400 exterior single pipe then yes there is potentially something much more dangerous happening here.

But if you read my posts I referenced exact temperatures and provided pictures of my setup. When questioned I provided measurements too. And I stand by the numbers that I posted. It's how I burn everyday. I clarified about not going to 600 every reload, that was an overshot. I also mentioned that I've seen 700 as a mistake, not as normal running. I nowhere condoned overfiring and again provided pictures of my stovetop and stovepipe operating right in their prime zone, tucked in after a reload.

So again I was giving the OP the benefit of the doubt that he would read my responses and not assume that running up to 700 or even 600 was how to run. But that running up to 550-600 to cure his pipe would be more than safe to do so if he hasn't yet.