That of which we will not speak... "Climate Change"

[semipro]

"DEP officials have been ordered not to use the term “climate change” or “global warming” in any official communications, emails, or reports, according to former DEP employees, consultants, volunteers and records obtained by the Florida Center for Investigative Reporting."

http://www.miamiherald.com/news/state/florida/article12983720.html

 

[velvetfoot]

Good.

 

[DougA]

Is that because projections show most of Florida underwater due to climate change? When Disney World starts advertising a snorkeling ride to visit the Magic Kingdom, there will still be some people who will deny climate change.

 

[Where2]

The rising sea level is evident in my backyard, but the manatees don't seem to mind. They just eat the leaves off the endangered mangrove trees...

 

[brad wilton]

of course theres climate change thats what the worlds been doing for millenia

 

[Snagdaddy]

The subject of "climate change" isn't done rearing its ugly head in our government. This, in my estimation, is a tactical retreat. Follow the directives back all the way to the hidden power structure.

By "climate change" it is meant "man-made climate change". Certain powers-that-be are hell bent on getting a carbon trading scheme going. Unfortunately for us, it means more taxes on our motor and heating fuels and the assignment of blame (and punishment/elimination of) everything that emits carbon dioxide, the gas that plants breathe. It is not a coincidence that human beings exhale carbon dioxide. Think about the global policies of the past and where they led.

This policy lines up with the U.N. and the push for global governance and population reduction. The United Nations latest tactic is to employ celebrities in a feel good campaign to have the young and poorly informed ram this policy through. The idea of man made climate change echoes through the halls of the world's policy think-tanks - the places where our heads of state go begging for directives.

 

[woodgeek]

Good news everyone....

—FL politicos are not in charge of US fed policy, nor that of other countries. State level pols do stupid stuff all the time....its a proving ground for folks to move up the chain, so inevitably some are going to be laughable face-plants. Very entertaining.

—Solid majorities of folks in the US are aware of anthropogenic global warming (AGW) and the importance of dealing with it in the next couple decades. These majorities become even more lopsided when you consider people under 60 in the US or um, people in any other major country. The kids and the foreigners are gonna fix this whether you want to or not.

—The means of decarbonizing the global economy (say by >80% reduction in net emissions) over the next 25-30 years have been worked out, and been largely agreed upon in draft form by the major players (US, China, EU). Most of the required technology is already developed, deployed, owned and discussed by members of this forum.

—Required changes over the next 10-15 years look a lot like existing EPA policy for modest (30%) carbon reduction, which are significantly negative net cost to the US economy...making us healthier, wealthier and more secure as a nation.

—Required changes 15-30 years from now will require technologies that exist, but which are not mature enough that their final cost (in >15 years) can be reliably predicted (e.g. EVs, grid storage, H2 economy). Current estimates suggest that costs for the next stage of solving AGW will cost 0-2% of US GDP for that period (2030-2045). Net costs, including health care savings from 2015-2030 will be even lower or likely negative.

Jack-booted thugs and middle-class crushing C taxes from the one-world govt are not required. Your electricity prices will not necessarily skyrocket.

 

[velvetfoot]

Well, it is most excellent that Iran will be displacing a whole bunch of CO2 with their nuclear plants.

 

[Snagdaddy]

"decarbonizing" is industry speak for shutting down our economy. Watch our economy being shut down as china builds as many coal plants as it wants. It is always surprising and disturbing to me that anyone would help to sell this plan to their peers.

The jack booted thugs may not be needed to sell the carbon trading plan because the powers that be are in the process of recruiting popular music singers and actors to sell this plan on the ignorant masses.

While I am sure the whole AGW plan and carbon scheme are mapped out by highly intelligent people, this ignores the fact that it is an anti-human plan based upon the lie that carbon dioxide is warming (cooling?) the planet.

Consider the following story coming from this former greenpeace founder:

http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-article/2015/03/20/why-i-am-climate-change-skeptic

 

[woodgeek]

Ah. Let's see....

China: Their coal consumption was flat or fell in 2014, while their economy still grew 7%. They did this for their own reasons (because coal pollution is killing them).

Shutting down the economy: In the US, more people currently work (broken link removed to http://www.greenbiz.com/blog/2014/01/31/us-solar-industry-employs-more-coal-gas-industries-combined)and wind industries (which are both growing at double digit rates) than in the oil and gas extraction business (which are growing much more slowly). As I said, the all-in cost of decarbonizing the economy is currently estimated to be 0-2% of GDP, and then only 20 years from now. And this is NOT counting savings in health care costs, human suffering, etc. many of which start much sooner than 20 years from now.

Ignorant masses/lie: You are actually arguing not that the masses are uninformed (ignorant), but that they are being actively misled by our leaders. In other words, you are arguing a global conspiracy theory. I generally don't believe in conspiracy theories, and need some serious evidence to do so. Pls provide.

Patrick Moore: is a moonbat. Strange bedfellows for a conservative magazine and the founder of kooky Greenpeace. He says that he is skeptical that AGW will be 'catastrophic in the near future', 'that the world would be unliveable if it increased a few degrees in temperature' and of 'doomsday scenarios from computer models'. I am skeptical of all those things too, but they're irrelevant.

Bottom line: In addition to global habitat destruction and animal extinction, projected future AGW will cause massive human suffering and be a huge hit to the future economy. Most all of that is in the future, and then mostly decades in the future, like after 2050. Power plants last 20-30 years. Cars last 15-20 years. Peoples's careers last 30 years. We can't change the basis of our society in 3 years without significant costs and pain, but that is not required.

We just need to stop investing in and building things (coal plants, low mpg cars) that we won't want in 10-20 years, and keep growing things that we want to be big(ger) business in 10-20 years (wind, solar, EVs, etc). In the end we gradually replace one economic activity for another, and end up better off. Its called progress.

 

[Snagdaddy]

Unfortunately, the solar panels are made in china. And there has been a lot of fraud in the solar industry. This fraud includes the use of innovative financial instruments.

Real progress occurs when we stop believing the lie that the earth will:

AGW will cause massive human suffering and be a huge hit to the future economy.

or any other lies that generate fear to accomplish "their" goals. I am keeping this very simple and will not be drawn into the weeds of conspiracy theories.

 

[woodgeek]

Simple is good.

Re solar. The prices those Chinese manufacturers are getting for their panels have fallen through the floor, now with very thin profits, just enough money to pay the workers the wages they demand to move to those factories/company towns (that no one in the US would work for). Most of the cost of solar installs these days is for the rest of the system, and a big part of that is local laborers who are doing the installation and inspection, which can't be outsourced. And going into good old fashioned paychecks for actual americans. Something like 150,000 hardworking americans last year according to the labor department. Is that all fraud?

As for fear...I HATE fear-mongering as a means of achieving political ends. Not acceptable, and a shame to our forebears who faced down some seriously scary chit and came out ahead. On that we can agree.

As for AGW...I am not afraid and I don't want you to be either. AGW is a future, hypothetical (yet very real) threat. Like a lighthouse 50' from a sea-cliff that is eroding a foot or two per year. Something will have to be done, but about as scary as watching paint dry. And I trust that, as people have so many times before, we will identify the threat, make a strategy for avoiding it, and somehow end up better off and more prosperous in the end.

As for the weeds, bad news. You have already been drawn into the weeds of conspiracy theories. Look around. 97% of scientists, the National Academy of Science, the vast majority of different countries' leadership, the Nobel Cmte, Exxon and the other oil companies, as well as a solid majority of regular people around the world all believe something has been demonstrated scientifically. You are taking the other side. The only plausible/logical defense is that everyone else has been duped by some vast global conspiracy that somehow has all the above actors (scientists, global leaders, oil companies, etc) in on it. How else can you explain it?

 

[begreen]

And on that note, time to wrap this one up before it becomes can material.