MagnaFlex said:
Had testing posted, Franks mentioned that they can no longer hang me.. LOL.. But in regards to what you said about one man's liner. All liners that have passed UL testing have been tested already in a perfect chimney- and pass. Insulation is approved on it's own for the manufacture of the insulating blanket. I pulled our UL and it doesn't really say anything about it besides it staying in place.
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oconnor said:
Marsh said:
Thanks. Going with the insulation. Does MagnaFlex sell the insulation kits with the liner?
Whatever product you get, make sure you get the instructions first, before you buy it. One mans liner that is approved with insulation is not the same as the other fellows, who hasn't had the testing done, even if they are exactly the same material and design. In the end, the only way to install an insulated liner is by exactly following the manufacturers instructions. Magnaflex's liner looks like a great idea, but I have yet to see the instructions and UL listing on it. Last I heard he was working on getting it posted to his site.
The trouble is, your liner wasn't tested with a blanket insulation, therefore, it isn't approved to a zero/zero specification when installed with a ceramic fibre blanket - only when installed with thermix. To bad you can't post your actual instruction sheets or ULC certificates (labels that go on the product), 'cause in the end, they are what the insurer is going to want to see. Without clear instructions for your product detailing how ceramic fibre blanket insulation can be used, I could not recommend it's use based on what I have seen here or elsewhere as far as documentation goes.
As for your comment on saying that any approved liner can be brought to a zero/zero install spec with insulation, I clearly say that is not correct. I've seen liners that state they may not be installed with insulation, and others that say their ULC1777/CAN 635 certification is only valid when a specific product is used.
Here is a quote from a competing product's manual:
Insulated Liners
In general insulated liner systems will provide better performance than
non-insulated systems. An insulated system will accumulate less creosote
and provide better draft than a non-insulated system. Insulation is
a code requirement for some installations, see the table on page 5 to
determine if insulation is required for your application. The EXCELiner
system is certified to UL 1777 for zero clearance when it is insulated with
one layer of ¼” foil faced insulation.
The types of insulation accepted are :
- Premier Refractories Canada, Type LT; 8 lb/cu.ft
- All Fabrication Inc., Hi-Temp Blanket; 8 lb/cu.ft
- Thermal Ceramics, Kaowood blanket; 8 lb/cu.ft
- Thermal Ceramics, Cerablanket; 8 lb/cu.ft
- Carborundum, Durablanket; 8 lb/cu.ft
In this instance, using Thermix to insulate this liner is not in accordance with the instructions provided, and would not meet code, as code compliance requires following the manufacturers instructions.
It would seem that your instructions, if based only on the test doc you post, would require only the use of Thermix. Ceramic Fibre blanket is not mentioned in this document. How then would one show their insurer that your product meets the specs when installed with a thermal blanket type insulation?