Torch Users - MAPP or Propane

[MnDave]

I ran out of propane the other day and had only MAPP (which I use for loosening stuck bolts). So I ran MAPP, liked it, went to buy more and thought... Yikes $7 vs $3.

Propane worked for years so I am think I will stick with propane.

Does anyone have any compelling reasons to use MAPP over propane or visa versa?

Any warnings about torches in general (besided the obvious)?

MnDave

 

[MasterMech]

MAPP should only be used in torches designed for it. Some propane torces are not up to the higher temps from MAPP.

As far as is it worth 2x the price? I know it's a lot faster soldering pipe with MAPP but you're just starting fires then I wols stick with the 'pain.

 

[Wildo]

3 & 7 wow you guys get it cheap we pay 5 & 13

 

[tobaccogrower]

i use mapp. gun is in my shop so i use it for more then just lighting the stove.

 

[blades]

Mapp produces a hotter flame than propane. You can braze with Mapp but not with propane.

 

[northernontario]

I've got a dual-purpose torch... bought it in the MAPP kit for soldering some larger copper pipe. I've got the MAPP cylinder stored with my plumbing supplies, and the torch now lives by the stove with a propane cylinder. A cylinder lasts a long time... well over a year... especially if you've got good kindling. I use splitter trash, birch bark, and finely split hardwood. And I've found the secret to splitter trash... get some disposable yard waste bags (double layer brown paper)... at the end of your splitting session (end of the day), grab all the trash and fill the bag. I keep it in the shed... It's obviously not bone dry, but it works really well. If the stuff sits on the ground overnight, it absorbs more moisture and is that much harder to dry out.

I also use the same torch with my beekeeping equipment to light my bee smoker. This torch sees year-round use.

 

[DickRussell]

My son's a plumber, and he uses only MAPP for copper work, because it does burn hotter, and so heats up the joint faster for the solder to flow. Propane takes longer, so there is more spread of heat farther from the joint, which ought to be avoided in some cases.

Propane is the saturated three-carbon compound (CH3-CH2-CH3), with only single C-C bonds. MAPP stands for methyl acetylene - propylene - propadiene, a mixture of three different C3 hydrocarbons. The first of those has a triple bond (think acetylene, CH-CH, with a methyl group tacked on). The second has one double bond between two of the carbon atoms. The third has double bonds connecting both end carbons to the middle one. It's those triple and double C-C bonds that give rise to the added heat release when the stuff is oxidized.

 

[MnDave]

MAPP should only be used in torches designed for it. Some propane torces are not up to the higher temps from MAPP.

Agreed. And that may explain why 2 cheap torches are now in my garbage. They would stay just a little lit after I turned them off.

I finally invested in a Bernzomatic TS4000 (cast aluminum boby) I checked and it is rated for MAPP gas.

MnDave

 

[MnDave]

3 & 7 wow you guys get it cheap we pay 5 & 13

This was for the tall skinny (14.1 oz) bottle. The map may have been closer to $8.

So which do you use for creating a good updraft before you light?

MnDave

 

[MnDave]

And I've found the secret to splitter trash... get some disposable yard waste bags (double layer brown paper)... at the end of your splitting session (end of the day), grab all the trash and fill the bag. I keep it in the shed... It's obviously not bone dry, but it works really well. If the stuff sits on the ground overnight, it absorbs more moisture and is that much harder to dry out.

I will have to give that some serious consideration. I hate to waste anything that burns.

I get a lot of splitter trash because my wood is pretty bad right now. About a third of my wood came from a 3 acre lot I bought and much of it was on the ground for a looooong time. I will be done with that junk wood after this season. I am sick of splitting and having ants all over the place.

One of my neighbors gave me all the waste from his cedar deck project. I have been cutting the deck boards in 5-6 inch lengths and splitting them with a hatchet - firestarters for maybe 5 years. Be nice to your neighbors and they will be nice to you.

MnDave

 

[MnDave]

My son's a plumber, and he uses only MAPP for copper work, because it does burn hotter, and so heats up the joint faster for the solder to flow. Propane takes longer, so there is more spread of heat farther from the joint, which ought to be avoided in some cases.

Propane is the saturated three-carbon compound (CH3-CH2-CH3), with only single C-C bonds. MAPP stands for methyl acetylene - propylene - propadiene, a mixture of three different C3 hydrocarbons. The first of those has a triple bond (think acetylene, CH-CH, with a methyl group tacked on). The second has one double bond between two of the carbon atoms. The third has double bonds connecting both end carbons to the middle one. It's those triple and double C-C bonds that give rise to the added heat release when the stuff is oxidized.

I plan to start using MAPP for plumbing. Hadn't thought of it.

Thanks for the interesting chemistry lesson. I get it.

I noticed that they have O2 cylinders and brazing kits. I can't wait to find an excuse, I mean a project, so that I can buy that cool stuff. I have never brazed anything. I have a wire feed and a stick welder.

MnDave

 

[northernontario]

I will have to give that some serious consideration. I hate to waste anything that burns.

I get a lot of splitter trash because my wood is pretty bad right now. About a third of my wood came from a 3 acre lot I bought and much of it was on the ground for a looooong time. I will be done with that junk wood after this season. I am sick of splitting and having ants all over the place.

One of my neighbors gave me all the waste from his cedar deck project. I have been cutting the deck boards in 5-6 inch lengths and splitting them with a hatchet - firestarters for maybe 5 years. Be nice to your neighbors and they will be nice to you.

I'm storing my bags in my chicken coop (no chickens in there right now). Nice and dry, lots of ventilation, and right beside the woodpile. I've got two buckets I use to carry stuff into the house... one full of birch bark, one full of splitter trash.

Recently read about someone clamping their hatchet (I think it was a fiskars) into a vice... set wood on blade, hit end of wood with hammer. Nice controlled kindling splitting. I'd be cutting that cedar longer... 12-14".

 

[Wildo]

This was for the tall skinny (14.1 oz) bottle. The map may have been closer to $8.

So which do you use for creating a good updraft before you light?

MnDave

I use dry cedar and a strike anywhere when I light one up. I burn 24/7 so I've been working on the same cord of cedar for 4 years. I just use MAPP for recreational plumbing and mechanics work. A coleman 4D battery powered air pump lasts longer, works better, and is cheaper I do believe.

 

[FanMan]

I noticed that they have O2 cylinders and brazing kits. I can't wait to find an excuse, I mean a project, so that I can buy that cool stuff. I have never brazed anything. I have a wire feed and a stick welder.

Don't waste your money. The little Bernzomatic O2 cylinders last about 30 seconds, and with no regulator, by the time you get the flame adjusted, you're out of O2.

 

[WES999]

I use propane unless I need to get something really hot,like brazing I have the TS 8000, it is a lot hotter the the smaller torch.
For sweating copper (1/2 -3/4) propane provides plenty of heat. I use the torch all the time for lighting my stove.

 

[MnDave]

Recently read about someone clamping their hatchet (I think it was a fiskars) into a vice... set wood on blade, hit end of wood with hammer. Nice controlled kindling splitting. I'd be cutting that cedar longer... 12-14"

Yep. Hatchet in the vice. Helps save fingers and toes.

I'll try some longer pieces. I get really long kiln dried scap oak, cherry, maple, ash, walnut from a local boardshop for $0. I get enough to last a couple years. Really nice people at that shop. They heat the place with scrap wood and it smells so good in there that I hate to leave.

MnDave

 

[MnDave]

A coleman 4D battery powered air pump lasts longer, works better, and is cheaper I do believe.

I am confused about how you use an air pump. I can see where air helps get the fire going. Is that what you do? Use it instead of a bellows?

MnDave

 

[MnDave]

Don't waste your money. The little Bernzomatic O2 cylinders last about 30 seconds, and with no regulator, by the time you get the flame adjusted, you're out of O2.

Thanks for the heads up on that. I think that I will go with a small acetylene/oxyegyn tank setup with a cutting and a brazing torch. I just need the right project.

MnDave

 

[MasterMech]

Thanks for the heads up on that. I think that I will go with a small acetylene/oxyegyn tank setup with a cutting and a brazing torch. I just need the right project.

MnDave

Still quite expensive. Cheap torch setup w/tanks is $300 plus $50-60 to get 'em filled/exchanged the first time. And those #1 tanks don't take long to empty either.

 

[Wildo]

I am confused about how you use an air pump. I can see where air helps get the fire going. Is that what you do? Use it instead of a bellows?

MnDave

Yes use it as a bellows .