Trisodium Phosphate and SS flue liners....Harmful?

[tfdchief]

Does anyone know if SS flue liner manufactures have a problem with the use of "Creosote Removers"....most of which use trisodium phosphate? I can't find anything in the literature on my SS liner that addresses it.

 

[BrotherBart]

Everything I have seen says the jury is still out on it. No evidence so far of damage. Are you getting glaze or chunks with a liner?

 

[cycloxer]

Stainless steel is resistant to TSP. It shouldn't be a problem. Several studies have been done including:

http://jds.fass.org/cgi/content/abstract/12/3/252

 

[tfdchief]

Everything I have seen says the jury is still out on it. No evidence so far of damage. Are you getting glaze or chunks with a liner?

Some glaze the top 2 1/2 ft of the flue. I brushed it the other day and the majority came out.....and some of that had been sluffing off and falling to the stove. I just wondered because I have some and have never used it.

 

[cycloxer]

I did a little research on TSP and its effect on Stainless Steel. Stainless seems to be quite resistant at cleaning solution levels. It is used in the food and beverage industry to clean a lot of their stainless processing equipment.

 

[littlesmokey]

Processing solutions are in the less than 2% solutions and at less than 180 °F . The sticks are burnedor vaporized in a stove, I am not aware of any studies so far that look at that effect. I am aware of the damage to galvanizing and stripping the zinc coating, and am also aware that it will etch certain metals including SS, it dulls the sheen, but that may be it's abrasive properties.

In my less than scientific opinion, you are not going to wake up tomorrow and learn you have ruined your stove by using the product. That said, why not burn cleaner and sweep more often and not worry about the chemical effects?

 

[elmoleaf]

With a cat stove, I'd be concerned that something like that could damage the cat, rather than the flue liner.

 

[cycloxer]

Yeah I agree. It's most likely not going to damage your liner, particularly if you do it once or twice. The long term effects are tougher to analyze, though stainless steel is pretty tough and TSP is not really that corrosive. A better solution is to burn in the 400-600 degree range with dry wood so that you get complete combustion. Okay, I realize that we are all guilty of violating ideal burn conditions now and then. Other than that, brush out the flue. I wouldn't want to rely on a chemical cleaner to do the real job for the long term.

 

[tfdchief]

I agree with all that burning correctly and cleaning the flue regularly is the most important thing. I just thought that maybe used right before I clean, the flue would be easier to clean, material loosened. I have an old smoke dragon and have burned it successfully for over 25 years with no problems, no flue fires. However, as you know, it is more difficult to do that with a non EPA stove. I also recently connected my insert directly with a new SS liner. For the first 25 years it was venting into the firebox on my Majestic ZC fireplace in which it is inserted. The only problem I ever had with that set up was that the top of the expansive fire box, where the flue gases expanded and slowed immediately after exiting the stove, creosoted badly. It never caught fire because I think the gases expanded and cooled to fast to ever get going. Big mess to clean out each year though. Now, directly connected I worry more about a flue fire. So I am checking regularly and cleaning....hence the question about TSP, just something I thought might help.

 

[littlesmokey]

Keep a stash of that quick hot burning pine handy. Burn it as hot as you dare every week or so, and treat your neighbors to the wonderful smell someone is making. Couldn't be you unless they see the heat rise from the stack. That's enough in my opinion to control the bad creosote problems in an older stove. You still need to brush and especially try and burn as efficiently as possible. The TSP is costly and unnecessary.