VC what?

[RandyBoBandy]

it's 75 degrees in my house and maybe 20 outside. I've filled my stove twice today. I understand VC has had a rough go with management in past years but I feel the stove has a bad reputation that it doesn't quite deserve. I know my encore will never hit the burn times the BK guys are getting, however, I wouldn't trade my top loader in for any other stove at the moment. I'm doing the same run of the mill gasket work everyone is doing. I guess the way I see it is.... at the end of the day I have a beautiful cast stove that works great for me. Not only is it a beautiful "piece of furniture" in my living room....it also heats the sh!$ out of my house.

 

[huauqui]

It is always nice to hear of someone whose stove is doing just what they want it to. Thanks for sharing a good story with us.

huauqui

 

[DAKSY]

The VC problem has NEVER been with the stoves.
They ARE fine cast pieces & the DO work as well as they were designed to do,
based on the state of the (burning) art in place when they were new.
The VC problem, at LEAST from MY standpoint, has been in the support for
the product line. None of the multiple owners & their "management"
folks ever took the time to learn the techniques as to how the stoves were best used,
& how all the various components were designed to work AS A UNIT to properly burn
wood & heat our homes. Tehy only wanted the company as a CASH COW.
The folks who are supposed to be filling orders for replacement parts don't
know the difference between a griddle quadrant & a fireback.
You are happy with your VC stove & so are many others. Their components wear out
& can be rplaced easily with basic hand tools.
There aren't a whole lot of designs out there that are as user/repair friendly.

 

[fire_man]

it's 75 degrees in my house and maybe 20 outside. I've filled my stove twice today. I understand VC has had a rough go with management in past years but I feel the stove has a bad reputation that it doesn't quite deserve. I know my encore will never hit the burn times the BK guys are getting, however, I wouldn't trade my top loader in for any other stove at the moment. I'm doing the same run of the mill gasket work everyone is doing. I guess the way I see it is.... at the end of the day I have a beautiful cast stove that works great for me. Not only is it a beautiful "piece of furniture" in my living room....it also heats the sh!$ out of my house.

Good to hear your positive experience with VC. I think the stove's bad reputation comes from numerous issues many owners have experienced over the years. Enough people complain enough times about similar problems and a stove gets a negative reputation. I cannot speak about the Encore since I never owned one but I have found the reviews and comments about the various stoves I have owned to be extremely accurate.

In 2007 I planned to replace my beautiful but too small VC Resolute with another VC stove. I found Hearth.com and read some not so great stuff about VC and changed my mind.

My 1989 VC Resolute was a great stove which I loved and the reviews agree. Same with my Woodstock stoves. Sorry you feel your stove get's a bad rap.

What specifically are the complaints?

 

[webby3650]

This is a timely thread. I'm returning a VC to a customer at this very moment. It needed such extensive repairs we brought it back the shop. $1571 later it's going back home... It's only 10 years old.
The problem I have is the vulnerability of the stoves. The cost of ownership after the initial purchase can be astronomical! We see it all too often.

 

[webby3650]

I'm glad you are enjoying your stove. I've had a few VCs and liked them just fine.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

It is understandable to be scared away from a VC especially after reading your post. That is a crazy amount to have to pay for repairs. Can the extensive damage be attributed to poor user operation or was it a stove from the "bad" years? Let's hope they turn things around. It would be a shame to see such a beautiful stove disappear.

 

[begreen]

Although VC makes excellent and beautiful castings, their achilles heel has been the innards, most notably the fragile refractory package. I've pulled out a couple gorgeous stoves because their owners got tired of having the stove rebuilt every few years. Their cat stoves like the 2550 have a better track record. The court is still out on the newer stoves. We've had reports here of some 4-5 yr 2N1 stoves that have already seen an interior rebuild.

 

[webby3650]

It is understandable to be scared away from a VC especially after reading your post. That is a crazy amount to have to pay for repairs. Can the extensive damage be attributed to poor user operation or was it a stove from the "bad" years? Let's hope they turn things around. It would be a shame to see such a beautiful stove disappear.

Often times it is the operator. But on the other hand, if the stove had traditional inner workings there would be little to no damage in the same amount of time. This particular stove is a "bad" one. Non-cat encore...

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Any feed back on how the newer flexburns are doing?

 

[bholler]

There aren't a whole lot of designs out there that are as user/repair friendly.

Really?????? I can honestly say that just about all stoves i work on are more repair freindly than most VCs. Yes they had some very good stoves but they have also had some very bad ones and none of them are particularly easy to work on. And they are far from the easiest stoves to run correctly.

 

[fire_man]

Even my trusty very old VC Resolute was NOT an easy stove to work on.

 

[redhat]

Any feed back on how the newer flexburns are doing?

I'm on year one with a flexburn Encore 2040, working great so far.

 

[redhat]

It is understandable to be scared away from a VC especially after reading your post.

Yes, and that's a problem. People come here looking for info on the new VC stoves and then they read a post like Webby's talking about a 10 year old model they don't even make anymore. So folks go away assuming all the new VC models are going to be problematic too and they don't even give VC a look.

 

[bholler]

From what i have seen the new stuff is better but still has expensive internal refractories and is still a down draft. They are easier to work on but still harder than most. So from what i have seen an improvement but only time will tell. Also many of us in the industry have had to deal with the problems with them for years so yes many of us have a pretty poor opinion of the company and they will have to work hard to over come that.

 

[Rearscreen]

Even my trusty very old VC Resolute was NOT an easy stove to work on.

I have a Progress now, I used to have a Resolute and loved the top loading feature. Sold that stove with a previous house. But low and behold last year I bought another house which came with a Resolute! (Progress replaced it) but the Resolute is in the garage waiting for an overhaul.

 

[fire_man]

Rearscreen - I switched the Resolute for a Fireview, then to the Progress. I know what you mean about the top loading feature, it was nice.

My old 1989 Resolute is still in use by the guy I sold it to. What an amazing stove.

 

[defiant3]

The VC problem has NEVER been with the stoves.
They ARE fine cast pieces & the DO work as well as they were designed to do,
based on the state of the (burning) art in place when they were new.
The VC problem, at LEAST from MY standpoint, has been in the support for
the product line. None of the multiple owners & their "management"
folks ever took the time to learn the techniques as to how the stoves were best used,
& how all the various components were designed to work AS A UNIT to properly burn
wood & heat our homes. Tehy only wanted the company as a CASH COW.
The folks who are supposed to be filling orders for replacement parts don't
know the difference between a griddle quadrant & a fireback.
You are happy with your VC stove & so are many others. Their components wear out
& can be rplaced easily with basic hand tools.
There aren't a whole lot of designs out there that are as user/repair friendly.

I don't think there has ever been a more complex, over-engineered, more diffucult to service wood burning stove than the Encore. Coupled with the lack of service network and knowledgable customer support from the company, this is like the last stove on earth I'd advise anyone to own. Oh yeah, the parts are expensive and WILL wear out. Glad there are some who like theirs, but I've been servicing these things since they were introduced in '86. I wouldn't own one. Tell me, are there unicorns there in your alternate universe?

 

[Simonkenton]

I bought a new 1988 Resolute and ran it for 6 years, what a great stove. Got my mom to buy the same model and year stove and she still has it and it still works great. I also got my brother to buy the same stove and he loved it.
Hell, I was a part-time VC salesman, should have gotten a comission.
Well, I just built a new house and it was time for a shiny new wood stove. I have read too many sad stories on this forum about VC for me to be suckered into buying a new one.
Knowledge is power and you can acquire knowledge on this forum.
Vermont Castings made the best stove in the industry 28 years ago. Shame on them for letting their stove quality decline so much.
I bought a Jotul Oslo and I love it. Cast iron, it resembles the beautiful VC and it is a great stove.
Thank you hearth.com forum for giving me the knowledge.

 

[claydogg84]

Yes, and that's a problem. People come here looking for info on the new VC stoves and then they read a post like Webby's talking about a 10 year old model they don't even make anymore. So folks go away assuming all the new VC models are going to be problematic too and they don't even give VC a look.

What exactly makes that a problem? It's called research. If someone is going to drop $3,000 on a new stove, they should be aware of the previous issues VC has had. Sure, the new stoves may be great, but they could also be the same money pits that the previous models have been.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Time will tell l guess on the new flexburns. I will admit the stove can be temperamental to run at times but with all the thermos in place it's not bad at all. For now I'm going to enjoy my encore and difiant. Enjoy whatever burn season we have left guys.

 

[webby3650]

What exactly makes that a problem? It's called research. If someone is going to drop $3,000 on a new stove, they should be aware of the previous issues VC has had. Sure, the new stoves may be great, but they could also be the same money pits that the previous models have been.

Thank you

Yes, and that's a problem. People come here looking for info on the new VC stoves and then they read a post like Webby's talking about a 10 year old model they don't even make anymore. So folks go away assuming all the new VC models are going to be problematic too and they don't even give VC a look.

Would you prefer I talk about older VC's? Maybe newer VC's? The story is gonna be the same. I have to work on these things all the time, the info I share goes much further than the single stove sitting in the corner of my living room..
I'm here to share my experience and offer help if I can, just maybe I can prevent someone from dropping $3K on a stove that's not for them. I'm very happy to hear success stories with the 2n1, one season deep isn't a success story though, the verdict is still out. Regardless it's still full of very expensive parts and if you can't work on it yourself it'll cost you a bundle eventually. Many people do not want to spend anything on a stove after the initial investment. Too many dealers are selling VC against stoves that will have nearly zero maintaince cost and allowing the consumer to believe that's going to be the case with the VC. That is just not a reality with any VC.

 

[begreen]

I would love to be recommending Vermont Casting stoves again. Their castings are still first class. The original Resolute was our first big stove purchase back in 1980. It was a great performer. With the Defiant, Vigilant, Resolute and Intrepid VC developed a loyal following and achieved legendary status. In between then and now many of us have seen heartbreaking stories of owners that relied on the good reputation of the original VC products to make what they thought was an informed decision on a new VC stove. I recommended a Resolute to a personal friend and she bought one in 1990, a Resolute Acclaim. This was her sole source of heat. That stove was rebuilt like clockwork, 3 times in ten years. The rebuilds were not due to abuse or mis-operation. The refractory package simply degraded over time with 24/7 operation of the stove. Many of us have seen similar painful and costly stories. Through the early 2000's we watched VC swap owners almost seasonally. Then finally the company was brought under the Monessen umbrella and hope has rekindled for new success. Most of us still love the beauty of these stoves but are wary of recommending them until time proves that they will stand up. So far there are reports of 4-5 yr old 2N1 stoves that are still showing issues. We need to wait and see how well the new flexburn performs over the next 4-5yrs at least to know whether they have put past weaknesses behind them or not. Or wait for a new internal design or a new stove from VC that eliminates weaknesses.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/upgrading-encore-2n1-for-a-blaze-king.131743/
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/problem-with-vc-encore-cat-noncat.134769/

 

[webby3650]

it's 75 degrees in my house and maybe 20 outside. I've filled my stove twice today. I understand VC has had a rough go with management in past years but I feel the stove has a bad reputation that it doesn't quite deserve. I know my encore will never hit the burn times the BK guys are getting, however, I wouldn't trade my top loader in for any other stove at the moment. I'm doing the same run of the mill gasket work everyone is doing. I guess the way I see it is.... at the end of the day I have a beautiful cast stove that works great for me. Not only is it a beautiful "piece of furniture" in my living room....it also heats the sh!$ out of my house.

Please don't think I'm trying to beat up on VC's or run down your thread. I'm truly happy it's working good for you! I'm always interested to hear how the current stoves are holding up. My parents and inlaws both heat with cat Encores, it keeps me busy! My dads stove was a total rebuild that I picked up for free.

 

[RandyBoBandy]

Please don't think I'm trying to beat up on VC's or run down your thread. I'm truly happy it's working good for you! I'm always interested to hear how the current stoves are holding up. My parents and inlaws both heat with cat Encores, it keeps me busy! My dads stove was a total rebuild that I picked up for free.

No worries. These are all legitimate reasons to stay away from a VC at this point in the company's rocky career. I am currently experiencing great performance out of both of my VC heaters. Hopefully they can turns things around. If not when the time comes I may just have to look at a joutel or a Woodstock.