Venting a Harman P 68-3 90-degree angles?

[paula]

Hello,
I'm looking for advice to "reinstall" a Harman P 68 in my new-to-me home (originally purchased in 2010-but works great). We are planning to install it in the basement with floor vents to help heat the open concept living area directly above the stove. The question is ... Can we use 3 x 90-degree elbows (two with clean outs-one inside and one outside)? I attach a schematic below. I'd appreciate any advice or experience!

 

[Whitenuckler]

Hello,
I'm looking for advice to "reinstall" a Harman P 68 in my new-to-me home (originally purchased in 2010-but works great). We are planning to install it in the basement with floor vents to help heat the open concept living area directly above the stove. The question is ... Can we use 3 x 90-degree elbows (two with clean outs-one inside and one outside)? I attach a schematic below. I'd appreciate any advice or experience!

View attachment 344640

I have a P43 professionally installed and certified in the basement with exactly that configuration using 4 inch Excelpellet

 

[Washed-Up]

Just put a clean out T outside before the last vertical rise it’ll make cleaning a bit easier

 

[paula]

Thank you for your replies. We will give it a try!

 

[Whitenuckler]

Thank you for your replies. We will give it a try!

If you can go with 3" for the OAK, that would be better, and try for 4 inch vent.

 

[NS P-68]

Actually I would install a double tee on the outside which has an additional outlet directly across from the one going into the house.
I have pretty much the same venting and if I were to do it again I'd definitely install one. The standard tee makes using cleaning rods pretty much impossible. I use a weighted string and pull a brush through.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Actually I would install a double tee on the outside which has an additional outlet directly across from the one going into the house.
I have pretty much the same venting and if I were to do it again I'd definitely install one. The standard tee makes using cleaning rods pretty much impossible. I use a weighted string and pull a brush through.

That's a great idea for the outside. I couldn't use the clean out tee on the outside hardly at all to go into the basement. That would have made it very easy. The inside tee was still useful to some degree, and I will be doing the rope pull method myself next year. You sure know your stuff !

 

[bogieb]

You may want to consider using 45* elbows inside the house. That is what my P61a has (professionally installed). It makes for easier cleaning if you use a rod or soot eater and if there is a power failure the angle does not restrict the smoke movement as much as 90's do. Using 45* elbows does take up a bit more room, but I appreciate that I can get behind the stove without any issues (especially as I get older).

I am not arguing that the way you show won't work or be safe, just throwing something out there to think about.

 

[paula]

Thanks all. A double T outside and two 45s in place of the 90 inside is the new plan!🤞

 

[Whitenuckler]

You may want to consider using 45* elbows inside the house. That is what my P61a has (professionally installed). It makes for easier cleaning if you use a rod or soot eater and if there is a power failure the angle does not restrict the smoke movement as much as 90's do. Using 45* elbows does take up a bit more room, but I appreciate that I can get behind the stove without any issues (especially as I get older).

I am not arguing that the way you show won't work or be safe, just throwing something out there to think about.

I can't get a good look at behind my stove at all, and because it's in a corner, it get's tight to lay down and try and get my arms in there. Luckily my blowers don't get dirty, so all of my cleaning is out in front. I am going to have to figure out the best way of disconnecting the stove to slide it out for a major repair. I also wish it was raised up 10 inches. It would make it easier to clean I think.

 

[paula]

One more question please... we will be drilling a hole to accommodate the 4" exit vent through cored cinder block. Is cementing around the pipe sufficient? Or do we need to install a wall thimble?

 

[Whitenuckler]

One more question please... we will be drilling a hole to accommodate the 4" exit vent through cored cinder block. Is cementing around the pipe sufficient? Or do we need to install a wall thimble?

Is your wall just cinderblock? No insulation? I hope you are in a warm location? If it is non-combustable, they would just mortar it in. I had a solid concrete wall they core drilled through, so they use some RTV on the outside as the gap was perfect. My basement had a plywood wall with some insulation so they used a thimble on the inside to get the clearance
Edit - I made a mistake. I don't have a full thimble. It's just a metal mounting plate? Not sure what the proper name is. Once the pipe is passed the interior wall it's 8 inches of concrete.

 

[paula]

Is your wall just cinderblock? No insulation? I hope you are in a warm location? If it is non-combustable, they would just mortar it in. I had a solid concrete wall they core drilled through, so they use some RTV on the outside as the gap was perfect. My basement had a plywood wall with some insulation so they used a thimble on the inside to get the clearance
Edit - I made a mistake. I don't have a full thimble. It's just a metal mounting plate? Not sure what the proper name is. Once the pipe is passed the interior wall it's 8 inches of concrete.

Thanks. But now i wonder if we do need some extra insulation. It is just cinder block and no other wall cover, tho only the top 3 feet or so is exposed, the rest is underground due to slope. It is not solid and i think has 2 cells. And we are in a moderately cold zone in central NY.

 

[Whitenuckler]

Thanks. But now i wonder if we do need some extra insulation. It is just cinder block and no other wall cover, tho only the top 3 feet or so is exposed, the rest is underground due to slope. It is not solid and i think has 2 cells. And we are in a moderately cold zone in central NY.

Well worth insulating. Otherwise the stoves heat will be lost. If it's a slope the basement walls would only be partially covered on one side ie walkout? basement

 

[bogieb]

One more question please... we will be drilling a hole to accommodate the 4" exit vent through cored cinder block. Is cementing around the pipe sufficient? Or do we need to install a wall thimble?

The cinder block is non-flammable, so you don't actually need a thimble as long as there is no insulation and/or sheet rock covering the wall. Use a chimney cement around the exhaust pipe.

However, that cinderblock wall will soak up the heat and shunt some of it to the earth so you will use a lot of pellets heating it. I covered my basement walls with rigid foam then reflectix, and installed a floating floor (damp concrete floor) in 2017 and use about 2 tons less. And, of course if you do something similar, you will need a thimble (as well as ensuring the stove is far enough from the wall to keep the required clearances).

First pic is of some of the rigid foam installed (summer 2017)

I can't find a picture of the foam just covered with reflectix. This next picture is later (spring 2018) when I installed metal strapping on top of the reflectix to put up sheetrock on about 2/3 of the walls,