Whats your opinion of the GM volt electric car?

[Seasoned Oak]

A $7,500 tax credit is wothless to most people. Who pays $7,500 in income tax. Not very many people. If your paying that kind of income tax you probably dont really need the credit anyhow. Your probably pretty well off.

Thats why leasing makes sense is this instance, no need to deal with the rebate details ,it goes to the leasing Co.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

A little patience is in order here.Remember the Prius was NOT a runaway best seller when it was first introduced. When these volts start making sense to the masses cost wise,they will fly off the lots. Especially if gas hits $5 a gallon.

 

[oldspark]

Well I sort of came off negative about this car and that was not my intent, I live in an area where a lot of people who need a high milage car cant afford the price of the Volt, I am sure this is a nice car but for many just too expensive, I know a lot of people who wish they could get a hold of a Geo Metro to drive to work and we all know they are as I said before a tin can with a motor. If the car manufactors put their mind to it will will have a cheaper totaly electric car(with the issues worked out) in just a few years I believe.

 

[btuser]

We burn 70% of the oil we use for transportation. Within 5 years we could go from importing to exporting. Not a problem. Its one of the only low-hanging fruit this economy has left.

 

[oldspark]

We burn 70% of the oil we use for transportation. Within 5 years we could go from importing to exporting. Not a problem. Its one of the only low-hanging fruit this economy has left.

Been trying to do my part since 1971, Datsuns, Geo's, and Hondas.

 

[GaryGary]

We burn 70% of the oil we use for transportation. Within 5 years we could go from importing to exporting. Not a problem. Its one of the only low-hanging fruit this economy has left.

Hi,
I've had the same thought.
I drive around Bozeman and 70+% of the traffic is pickup trucks and big SUVs with one or two people.
Seems like people could own more efficient cars and get together with a few neighbors on a shared pickup for the few times its really needed?
Thousands of dollars of saved gasoline costs and tons of CO2 per year.

Gary

Tatnic -- glad to hear the solar plans works out!

 

[rkusek]

A $7,500 tax credit is wothless to most people. Who pays $7,500 in income tax. Not very many people. If your paying that kind of income tax you probably dont really need the credit anyhow. Your probably pretty well off.

The credit is being changed to 10K and also will go to the dealer instead. This change may make a big difference.

Not sure if the $7500 comment was meant to be sarcastic or not. While they say almost 50% of the population don't pay income tax (hence everything from the government is a a free gift), so it may be true. A person making a little over $35,000 could fall into the 25% tax bracket and pay over $8,750 in income taxes.

$10K to the dealer is probably the worst of all, though I suppose it does save a bit of hassle ...I remember many cases when the stove tax credit was in effect...suddenly a $2000 stove shot up to $3000+ with the lure of some tax credit to 'save you' $1000.

Wow, both of you are way off concerning taxes. A family or individual paying $7500 in taxes in not necessarily "pretty well off" by anyone's estimation. Also, someone making a little over $35,000 could be in the 25% tax bracket if they are single. However, that does mean they pay $8750 in income taxes (35,000 x 25%). You have at least the standard deduction ($5900 single, 11,900 married filing joint) or more likely a higher itemized deduction if you have a home loan. Then take $3700 for yourself and every dependent in your home that is subtracted off next. Then the tax brackets kick in (10%, 15%, 25%, 28%, 33%, and 35%) but everyone starts paying in the 10% until they max it out, then the next range is taxed at 15% up until you max out, then onto the 25% and so on. By my rough calculations a single person with standard deduction has to make about $55,000 to pay $7500 in federal and a family of 4 about $82,000 using the standard deduction.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Well I sort of came off negative about this car and that was not my intent, I live in an area where a lot of people who need a high milage car cant afford the price of the Volt, I am sure this is a nice car but for many just too expensive, I know a lot of people who wish they could get a hold of a Geo Metro to drive to work and we all know they are as I said before a tin can with a motor. If the car manufactors put their mind to it will will have a cheaper totaly electric car(with the issues worked out) in just a few years I believe.

There are Alternatives to metros already. THe Eco Cruze is under $20,000 gets around 40 average and some reviewers claim they can get it up 58 MPG at a steady speed
on a level road. Then again personally i would rather a volt for $349 a month,give it back in 2015 when there is 15-20 choices available.

 

[oldspark]

Well I sort of came off negative about this car and that was not my intent, I live in an area where a lot of people who need a high milage car cant afford the price of the Volt, I am sure this is a nice car but for many just too expensive, I know a lot of people who wish they could get a hold of a Geo Metro to drive to work and we all know they are as I said before a tin can with a motor. If the car manufactors put their mind to it will will have a cheaper totaly electric car(with the issues worked out) in just a few years I believe.

There are Alternatives to metros already. THe Eco Cruze is under $20,000 gets around 40 average and some reviewers claim they can get it up 58 MPG at a steady speed
on a level road. Then again personally i would rather a volt for $349 a month,give it back in 2015 when there is 15-20 choices available.

I was refering to people who could not afford a new car, I have a Honda Fit which I like a lot and I can get 40 with it, did not realize that you could get 58 with a Cruze, I have not seen that figure before.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

We burn 70% of the oil we use for transportation. Within 5 years we could go from importing to exporting. Not a problem. Its one of the only low-hanging fruit this economy has left.

Hi,
I've had the same thought.
I drive around Bozeman and 70+% of the traffic is pickup trucks and big SUVs with one or two people.
Seems like people could own more efficient cars and get together with a few neighbors on a shared pickup for the few times its really needed?
Thousands of dollars of saved gasoline costs and tons of CO2 per year.

Gary

Tatnic -- glad to hear the solar plans works out!

I live near a school and every day there is a daily parade of Large SUVS,Suberbans Trucks, Escalades with 1 person or 1 adult and a child for those ferrying their kids to school.
I think gas prices need to go up to trim some of the waste which i see all around me.

 

[timfromohio]

If it had a flux capacitor and ran for free I'd not buy one - GM lost my business for life after the CEO went public saying they paid back their Tarp Money (round #1) when in reality all they did was borrow more money from the government at a lower interest rate to pay back the initial loan - the one at the higher interest rate. That combined with a business model that for the last few decades was to milk as much profit as possible off of truck/SUV platforms (the margins on those are huge) while cater to the unions at all costs sort of turned me off.

PS - watch the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car" - when you see just how far ahead (IMHO) GM was with electric vehicles way back with the EV-1 and how they blew it, it makes one even more averse to their products.

 

[btuser]

PS - watch the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car" - when you see just how far ahead (IMHO) GM was with electric vehicles way back with the EV-1 and how they blew it, it makes one even more averse to their products.

They were told to kill it. We have a patriotic duty to burn through all the easy oil in the world.

Better than "Who killed the Electric Car" is a book called "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man".

 

[begreen]

Well I sort of came off negative about this car and that was not my intent, I live in an area where a lot of people who need a high milage car cant afford the price of the Volt, I am sure this is a nice car but for many just too expensive, I know a lot of people who wish they could get a hold of a Geo Metro to drive to work and we all know they are as I said before a tin can with a motor. If the car manufactors put their mind to it will will have a cheaper totaly electric car(with the issues worked out) in just a few years I believe.

There are Alternatives to metros already. THe Eco Cruze is under $20,000 gets around 40 average and some reviewers claim they can get it up 58 MPG at a steady speed
on a level road. Then again personally i would rather a volt for $349 a month,give it back in 2015 when there is 15-20 choices available.

I was refering to people who could not afford a new car, I have a Honda Fit which I like a lot and I can get 40 with it, did not realize that you could get 58 with a Cruze, I have not seen that figure before.

Here's a reviewer that got close to that. Pretty amazing mileage for a stock car.
http://www.conceivablytech.com/5728/products/chevy-cruze-eco-58-mpg-no-hybrid-magic/2

 

[oldspark]

The Cruze looks like a winner to me.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

PS - watch the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car" - when you see just how far ahead (IMHO) GM was with electric vehicles way back with the EV-1 and how they blew it, it makes one even more averse to their products.

They were told to kill it. We have a patriotic duty to burn through all the easy oil in the world.

Better than "Who killed the Electric Car" is a book called "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man".

Honda and toyota and nissan did exactly the same thing,had electrics in the 90s than KILLED em Dead.Crushed em as well. Why dont i ever hear anyone whining about them? ,its always GMGMGM

 

[Seasoned Oak]

The Cruze looks like a winner to me.

You can lease one of these babies for just $159 a month.Has 10 air bags as well. AMazing

 

[timfromohio]

PS - watch the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car" - when you see just how far ahead (IMHO) GM was with electric vehicles way back with the EV-1 and how they blew it, it makes one even more averse to their products.

They were told to kill it. We have a patriotic duty to burn through all the easy oil in the world.

Better than "Who killed the Electric Car" is a book called "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man".

Honda and toyota and nissan did exactly the same thing,had electrics in the 90s than KILLED em Dead.Crushed em as well. Why dont i ever hear anyone whining about them? ,its always GMGMGM

What were the Honda and Toyota models? I don't remember those at all. I do remember seeing the EV-1's and thinking what a great car for a commuter vehicle. They also had excellent performance for the time.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Toyota rav-4 EV , honda ev plus, nissan altra wagon.

 

[woodsmaster]

A $7,500 tax credit is wothless to most people. Who pays $7,500 in income tax. Not very many people. If your paying that kind of income tax you probably dont really need the credit anyhow. Your probably pretty well off.

The credit is being changed to 10K and also will go to the dealer instead. This change may make a big difference.

Not sure if the $7500 comment was meant to be sarcastic or not. While they say almost 50% of the population don't pay income tax (hence everything from the government is a a free gift), so it may be true. A person making a little over $35,000 could fall into the 25% tax bracket and pay over $8,750 in income taxes.

$10K to the dealer is probably the worst of all, though I suppose it does save a bit of hassle ...I remember many cases when the stove tax credit was in effect...suddenly a $2000 stove shot up to $3000+ with the lure of some tax credit to 'save you' $1000.

Wow, both of you are way off concerning taxes. A family or individual paying $7500 in taxes in not necessarily "pretty well off" by anyone's estimation. Also, someone making a little over $35,000 could be in the 25% tax bracket if they are single. However, that does mean they pay $8750 in income taxes (35,000 x 25%). You have at least the standard deduction ($5900 single, 11,900 married filing joint) or more likely a higher itemized deduction if you have a home loan. Then take $3700 for yourself and every dependent in your home that is subtracted off next. Then the tax brackets kick in (10%, 15%, 25%, 28%, 33%, and 35%) but everyone starts paying in the 10% until they max it out, then the next range is taxed at 15% up until you max out, then onto the 25% and so on. By my rough calculations a single person with standard deduction has to make about $55,000 to pay $7500 in federal and a family of 4 about $82,000 using the standard deduction.

Ok that souds right. My point is most people wont be able to use the full credit and some probably none at all.

 

[SolarAndWood]

My point is most people wont be able to use the full credit and some probably none at all.

I don't think anyone has any illusion that the Volt is the next People's Car. While Jay Leno probably doesn't need the tax credit, the $7500 or potentially $10K incentive makes someone looking at a Malibu, Taurus, gas Camry, Accord, etc consider the Volt as an alternative. With 3600 vehicles in inventory, the good taxpayers of this country are looking at a $30-$40M bill to move the stock. Who should be able to take advantage of the subsidy is probably a topic for the ash can, but the $10K tax credit has me seriously considering a Volt instead of another Camry hybrid, VW TDI Passat, etc when I wouldn't even think about it in the low $40Ks. Only time will tell if GM makes as good use of the subsidy as Toyota did a decade ago and VW is today.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

If you cant take the tax credit and want the car, be prepared to shell out about $600+ a month in car Pmts.Just another reason to consider a $349 lease.

 

[btuser]

What were the Honda and Toyota models? I don't remember those at all. I do remember seeing the EV-1's and thinking what a great car for a commuter vehicle. They also had excellent performance for the time.

The buying up and squashing of patents is an effective suppression of innovation. NiMH batteries can indeed power a vehicle good enough to get me back/forth to work, or 80% of the world for that matter. If I had $.05 KWH electricity rates I'd love it even more.

The use of oil by Americans is intentional to (pardon the pun) keep us in the driver's seat. Now that Chindia is taking off we can afford to start using less of it I guess, just as long as China doesn't get any crazy ideas. We use oil to drive, but a lot of people use oil just to eat, either through fertilizer or diesel to run farm equipment/distribution systems/or even pump water. High oil prices hurt the developing world at a much greater rate than us. Much of 3rd world debt (I hate that term) can be attributed/tracked to high oil prices, specifically the 1973 oil embargo. Once you own them, YOU OWN THEM.

 

[oldspark]

If you cant take the tax credit and want the car, be prepared to shell out about $600+ a month in car Pmts.Just another reason to consider a $349 lease.

Wouldn't the $159 lease on the Cruze make way more sense? Some people have enough money to save the planet and some just want to save there financial ass.

 

[begreen]

We're in transition. You should get the car that fits your needs and lifestyle. This article brings up one interesting perspective on the cost of ownership over 5 yrs..

http://www.greencarreports.com/news...-electric-what-do-they-cost-over-5-yrs/page-2

 

[jebatty]

The concept of car loan payments or lease payments is as foreign to me as passing gas at the end of a meal. If $$$ economy is the only consideration, then a focus on the existing high mpg cars with excellent reliability records, 2-5 years old, bought used, driven conservatively, and kept until they fall apart, is the no-brainer way to go. These cars easily run 250,000+ miles without any major repairs, perhaps no repairs other than ordinary maintenance. Mpg's range well into the 30's. And buying this way puts enough money into the retirement account, unless a person is a consumption addict, to kick the job and actually have a retirement.

That's what wife and I have done since 1986, the last new car we purchased. Our current 2007 Camry 4-cyl, 6 speed auto tranny, is spacious, very energetic, and gets 35 mpg on the highway. This is the entry level Camry model, no frills, all car and all transportation, with reliability, comfort, guts, space and very light on the $$$. Out 2005 Camry is just about the same, a little smaller on the inside, 5-speed auto tranny, and 33 mpg on the highway.

The 2005, bought used with about 30,000 miles on it, and 145,000 now, has a minimum of 5 years yet to save us money at our current 20,000 miles/yr driving rate, and the 2007 now with 95,000 miles on it, also bought used, I may be driving as my last car, as another 10-15 years of driving starts to get me pretty close to looking at life from the other side.

For an all-electric car, we need a driving range of about 125 miles, as we live in a rural area about 50 miles from the nearest large city area (90,000 pop). That driving range would cover the majority of our driving.