Which burns fewer pellets: Maintenance Flame or Constant Burn #1?

[Orson_Yancey]

Hi, I have a Harman P68 which I purchased in June 2014. During the shoulder seasons, I like to run the
stove all night at a low setting. I was wondering. Which uses fewer pellets? A maintenance flame or
constant burn #1 (stove temp #1)? From what I can tell, I would say that the maintenance flame uses
fewer pellets, has the smaller fire, and produces the least heat - less than any setting of constant burn.
For those of you who have not experimented with the maintenance flame, you can run a maintenance flame
by setting the igniter switch to "manual" after you get the first fire in a room temperature mode.
A maintenance flame means your
fire never goes out, even when the thermostat (room temperature) has reached the set point temperature.

 

[bags]

Hey Orson,
I run my P68 the same way during the shoulder season or whenever outside temps warrant it. Currently I am running Room Temp with the igniter in manual. I have my temp dial set at 5 just above the 75* mark so the distribution blower runs constantly also. I have the feed rate set at less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. This is the minimum I can run this stove and it works well for me. It is pretty miserly on pellets in this set up or uses the least this way vs. any other settings or modes.

My house stat is reading 76* which is too warm for me but the wife and kids like it. The stove just maintains a nice low flame and you can hear the few pellets being used. I have found this mode and settings to be the best for me this time of the year.

 

[Tonyray]

Hey Orson,
I run my P68 the same way during the shoulder season or whenever outside temps warrant it. Currently I am running Room Temp with the igniter in manual. I have my temp dial set at 5 just above the 75* mark so the distribution blower runs constantly also. I have the feed rate set at less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. This is the minimum I can run this stove and it works well for me. It is pretty miserly on pellets in this set up or uses the least this way vs. any other settings or modes.

My house stat is reading 76* which is too warm for me but the wife and kids like it. The stove just maintains a nice low flame and you can hear the few pellets being used. I have found this mode and settings to be the best for me this time of the year.

running the same way..P61A
My only concern is with such a low feed rate, the majority of the flames are back in the burnpot as opposed to out front.
guess it's not a potential problem?

 

[Funnydirt14]

Hey Orson,
I run my P68 the same way during the shoulder season or whenever outside temps warrant it. Currently I am running Room Temp with the igniter in manual. I have my temp dial set at 5 just above the 75* mark so the distribution blower runs constantly also. I have the feed rate set at less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. This is the minimum I can run this stove and it works well for me. It is pretty miserly on pellets in this set up or uses the least this way vs. any other settings or modes.

My house stat is reading 76* which is too warm for me but the wife and kids like it. The stove just maintains a nice low flame and you can hear the few pellets being used. I have found this mode and settings to be the best for me this time of the year.

I've been running my P68 room temp manual. Running in maintenance burn with Temp dial 5 1/2 and my distribution blower does not run unless the thermostat calls for heat and ramps up the fire.

 

[Orson_Yancey]

Hey Orson,
I run my P68 the same way during the shoulder season or whenever outside temps warrant it. Currently I am running Room Temp with the igniter in manual. I have my temp dial set at 5 just above the 75* mark so the distribution blower runs constantly also. I have the feed rate set at less than 1 in between the 1 and the red hash mark. This is the minimum I can run this stove and it works well for me. It is pretty miserly on pellets in this set up or uses the least this way vs. any other settings or modes.

My house stat is reading 76* which is too warm for me but the wife and kids like it. The stove just maintains a nice low flame and you can hear the few pellets being used. I have found this mode and settings to be the best for me this time of the year.

Yes, even in the shoulder season on some days, the maintenance flame puts out more heat than I need. I have not yet experimented with turning down the feed rates so as the choke off the pellet feeding. I do like the constant, even heat of having
a flame all the time.

 

[Orson_Yancey]

running the same way..P61A
My only concern is with such a low feed rate, the majority of the flames are back in the burnpot as opposed to out front.
guess it's not a potential problem?

I do not think there will be any problem with having small flames in the back of the burn pot.

 

[bags]

running the same way..P61A
My only concern is with such a low feed rate, the majority of the flames are back in the burnpot as opposed to out front.
guess it's not a potential problem?

Tony, I doubt it matters at all with the recessed flames. If you think about it when the stoves ramp up and the flame comes out more the heat then is way more intense on the back of the pot and flame guide anyway.

Either run it like you stole it when needed or coast along and save fuel when temps permit and you can stay comfy that way. It is cold here today and I am off. The weather is crappy so I have stolen the wife's favorite part or her end of the coach sitting here on the lap top in shorts, T-shirt, and nothing on the wheels. I have the 68 cranking a bit now feed rate 4. It's time to throttle feed down to about 1.5 to 2 or so now. Getting too warm.

I had her throttled down to feed rate less than 1, Room temp manual with temp dial set at 5.25 = 5 1/4 all night and this AM and the house stat was reading 70*. The farthest away areas were reading 68*. Since temps are dropping I cranked it up for a bit to get the house stat to 76*. Now I'll maintain that or 74-75* for this evening and tonight. I'll probably wind up feed rate 2 as it will be 22* or so over night.

That's still pretty well idling along with a slight pick me up. I ramped up to clear out the pot and get the house's core temp up 5 degrees. It di that in 20 minutes. What kind of temps are you getting there? PA and KY have been similar so far. And both much warmer than last year.

First time I've really ramped the 68 up thus far. Man that thing gets hot! I forgot almost. I opened the door, and did a quick scrape right after loading a bag. I think I burned my legs LOL!

So far this season I've been burning it since Oct and only used right at a ton and a 3rd. Less than 1 1/2 tons so far. I like that! This time last year right about now I was hitting 3 tons burned already. Then a ton a month approx. for Jan. - March and then a few bags as needed up until tax time.

Have a happy New Year. No plans here just taking it easy. probably won't leave the house at all. Wife and daughter are out shopping. They're nuts! I avoid the crazy crowds and insane drivers this time of the year. I avoid malls at all times but especially all shopping joints from Nov. - the end of Jan. The crazies can have at it. LOL! Not my bag of tricks.

 

[Tonyray]

Tony, I doubt it matters at all with the recessed flames. If you think about it when the stoves ramp up and the flame comes out more the heat then is way more intense on the back of the pot and flame guide anyway.

Either run it like you stole it when needed or coast along and save fuel when temps permit and you can stay comfy that way. It is cold here today and I am off. The weather is crappy so I have stolen the wife's favorite part or her end of the coach sitting here on the lap top in shorts, T-shirt, and nothing on the wheels. I have the 68 cranking a bit now feed rate 4. It's time to throttle feed down to about 1.5 to 2 or so now. Getting too warm.

I had her throttled down to feed rate less than 1, Room temp manual with temp dial set at 5.25 = 5 1/4 all night and this AM and the house stat was reading 70*. The farthest away areas were reading 68*. Since temps are dropping I cranked it up for a bit to get the house stat to 76*. Now I'll maintain that or 74-75* for this evening and tonight. I'll probably wind up feed rate 2 as it will be 22* or so over night.

That's still pretty well idling along with a slight pick me up. I ramped up to clear out the pot and get the house's core temp up 5 degrees. It di that in 20 minutes. What kind of temps are you getting there? PA and KY have been similar so far. And both much warmer than last year.

First time I've really ramped the 68 up thus far. Man that thing gets hot! I forgot almost. I opened the door, and did a quick scrape right after loading a bag. I think I burned my legs LOL!

So far this season I've been burning it since Oct and only used right at a ton and a 3rd. Less than 1 1/2 tons so far. I like that! This time last year right about now I was hitting 3 tons burned already. Then a ton a month approx. for Jan. - March and then a few bags as needed up until tax time.

Have a happy New Year. No plans here just taking it easy. probably won't leave the house at all. Wife and daughter are out shopping. They're nuts! I avoid the crazy crowds and insane drivers this time of the year. I avoid malls at all times but especially all shopping joints from Nov. - the end of Jan. The crazies can have at it. LOL! Not my bag of tricks.

feed rate less than 1, Room temp manual with temp dial set at 5.25 = 5 1/4 all night and this AM and the house stat was reading 70*.
running the same settings as you at night and thermostat in the AM in the living room get's to 75....upstairs with 3 beds/bath get's a comfy 68..
I am running same settings right now around 4PM..
as someone here said, it's using the feed rate a govener or throttle to keep the blower running constant..
I tried the same settings few days ago but used Stove/auto instead... waaaaay to warm.. was over 80- degrees downstairs and climbing.
deff a pellet saver... started mid October and just now approaching a ton used... way below last year.
Interesting to see how this setup works when the real winter hits But, with Lignetics pellets being on the small size, won't have any higher than #3 for a feedrate.

 

[Tonyray]

I've been running my P68 room temp manual. Running in maintenance burn with Temp dial 5 1/2 and my distribution blower does not run unless the thermostat calls for heat and ramps up the fire.

some of us have a problem with the distribution blower being off and all that heat going up the exhaust pipe.
using a very low feedrate [# 1] it keeps the blower running continuous because it cannot catchup therefore always blowing heat into the dwelling. Constant or stove auto will do this also but the heat it produces is too much..
just another "renegade" way of running a Harman.

 

[Funnydirt14]

some of us have a problem with the distribution blower being off and all that heat going up the exhaust pipe.
using a very low feedrate [# 1] it keeps the blower running continuous because it cannot catchup therefore always blowing heat into the dwelling. Constant or stove auto will do this also but the heat it produces is too much..
just another "renegade" way of running a Harman.

So basically with a feed rate of 1, you have the room already at temp and you are using this as a maintenance burn, but distribution fan will run. OK, I haven't learned all the tricks with the different setting. I'm with you, that setting might work good now, but what about when it gets teens and 20's.

 

[bags]

that setting might work good now, but what about when it gets teens and 20's.

When the temps outside drop just bump up the feed rate accordingly. It's hitting the lows in the 20's here tonight and did last night. So tonight I have bumped the feed up to just below 2. Probably really at 1.75. I'll look at the house stat temp when I go to bed. Right now it is reading 75* and the outside temp is currently 30 degrees and dropping.

I'll probably leave it where it is. So last night similar temps I set feed at .50 to .75 < less than 1 and it was down to 21 all night and the house was 70*. I wanted it just a little warmer overall. Actually the wife did. 70* is fine with me. So I cranked it up to feed rate 4 for about 20 minutes to get the inside temp up quick then once there I adjusted the feed rate to the 1.75 and stat temp has held pretty constant.

So as it gets colder just bump up the feed rate some to maintain your desired inside temps. For example now if I bumped feed to 2.5 it would be 80 - 82 in here with the outside temps about 23*.

Dirt,
You should be able to keep your distribution blower going at all times at whatever speed you want it blowing at set this way. You basically trick the stove in a sense. I think you also need the temp dial set at at least 5 for it to do so in room temp manual. You could set the temp dial higher and I don't think it would ever get there because like Tony just said you have the stove governed down. NOTE: My P68 is 1 year old. Some with older models report different results and it could be a different control board, red ESP wires vs. black etc; but I think you should be able to get it.

 

[Tonyray]

When the temps outside drop just bump up the feed rate accordingly. It's hitting the lows in the 20's here tonight and did last night. So tonight I have bumped the feed up to just below 2. Probably really at 1.75. I'll look at the house stat temp when I go to bed. Right now it is reading 75* and the outside temp is currently 30 degrees and dropping.

I'll probably leave it where it is. So last night similar temps I set feed at .50 to .75 < less than 1 and it was down to 21 all night and the house was 70*. I wanted it just a little warmer overall. Actually the wife did. 70* is fine with me. So I cranked it up to feed rate 4 for about 20 minutes to get the inside temp up quick then once there I adjusted the feed rate to the 1.75 and stat temp has held pretty constant.

So as it gets colder just bump up the feed rate some to maintain your desired inside temps. For example now if I bumped feed to 2.5 it would be 80 - 82 in here with the outside temps about 23*.

Dirt,
You should be able to keep your distribution blower going at all times at whatever speed you want it blowing at set this way. You basically trick the stove in a sense. I think you also need the temp dial set at at least 5 for it to do so in room temp manual. You could set the temp dial higher and I don't think it would ever get there because like Tony just said you have the stove governed down. NOTE: My P68 is 1 year old. Some with older models report different results and it could be a different control board, red ESP wires vs. black etc; but I think you should be able to get it.

need the temp dial set at at least 5 for it to do so in room temp manual.
that's correct...
my blower wasn't running this afternoon Until I set the temp at a smidgen above 5...
btw: before I jump the feed rate up as it get's colder [if/when needed] I'm going to switch over to Stove or Constant mode but use the same feed rate #1-2 settings.
May or may not do the job but I do know that the Stove mode will be hotter and just might get a few days grace before having to bump the feedrate..
Bags:
have you done this on stove mode in the colder weather?
I have not as I just discovered doing the " feed rate steers the ship" method about a month ago realizing that it overrides the room temp probe..... pretty kewl...

 

[bags]

Bags:
have you done this on stove mode in the colder weather?
I have not as I just discovered doing the " feed rate steers the ship" method about a month ago realizing that it overrides the room temp probe..... pretty kewl...

I messed with stove some last year but for some reason I remember preferring room temp. It could be that I experienced what you did as it would get a little too warm in warmer outside temps but what you are saying makes sense and I might try that and leave the feed down.

That's a good way to put it as steering the ship. Told ya I wasn't nuts. You definitely get what I was getting at. I have only seen a few others that have figured out what we are talking about and it is still highly contested throughout the Harman owner community. You, Cory, Golfuer??, and myself that I recall immediately. It does work and it does save me some pellets. Granted this year being warmer is a huge help but I know running this way certain times definitely reduces pellet use.

I also really like that it is more of a consistent and constant type of heat instead of all the off / on ramping up and down non-stop. My place stays a constant temp whereas in room temp auto it keeps it within a degree or two but it feels a lot different to me. More like a central HVAC type heat that lets the house cool some then kicks back on. Could be a mental thing but, hey, I like it and it works for me.

"Like a brick under the accelerator" is true but man at times the heating beast most definitely needs to be governed down. Otherwise there's just too much heat and smoking tires. LOL!

 

[scajjr2]

For those of us with external thermostats this "renegade method" works only when the thermostat (in my case a Skytech 3301p) is in "RUN" mode. Normally when the thermostat has reached the desired temp it shows "OFF". In this state it's in maintenance burn, the distribution blower is off and only comes back on when the thermostat calls for heat and switches to "ON" status.

After reading the above posts I wanted to see why our blower wasn't on after dropping the feed rate. I changed the mode of the thermostat to constant ON (has 4 modes -OFF, ON, manual thermostat and programmed thermostat) and the distribution blower came on. Set the feed to 1, fan to a med-low setting and we'll see how it does overnight tonight (temps supposed to be in upper 20's). Probably turn the feed and fan up a bit before bed. If it does as well as you all say in keeping the temp constant, may have to rethink whether we even need the wireless thermostat.

Our stove is vented through the existing chimney in the center of our house. So the heat up the chimney does warm the core of the house as it exits. So for us it's not quite wasted.

Never fail to learn something reading the threads on this site.

Sam

 

[Funnydirt14]

For those of us with external thermostats this "renegade method" works only when the thermostat (in my case a Skytech 3301p) is in "RUN" mode. Normally when the thermostat has reached the desired temp it shows "OFF". In this state it's in maintenance burn, the distribution blower is off and only comes back on when the thermostat calls for heat and switches to "ON" status.

After reading the above posts I wanted to see why our blower wasn't on after dropping the feed rate. I changed the mode of the thermostat to constant ON (has 4 modes -OFF, ON, manual thermostat and programmed thermostat) and the distribution blower came on. Set the feed to 1, fan to a med-low setting and we'll see how it does overnight tonight (temps supposed to be in upper 20's). Probably turn the feed and fan up a bit before bed. If it does as well as you all say in keeping the temp constant, may have to rethink whether we even need the wireless thermostat.

Our stove is vented through the existing chimney in the center of our house. So the heat up the chimney does warm the core of the house as it exits. So for us it's not quite wasted.

Never fail to learn something reading the threads on this site.

Sam

This is exactly what I was experiencing. I also have the Skytech 3301p hooked up and running on room temp manual. I had my thermostat set to thermo mode 72* with 1* swing. Feed rate 3 and temp 5 1/2. When the house gets up to temp it pretty much stays there when the stove goes into maintenance burn without the distribution fan coming on. I wonder if our thermostat will work with the feed rate at 1 and temp at over 5 in programmed mode the same way and letting the distribution fan come on. I will try it tonight and see. EDIT: Well tried in program mode and it works fine until you reach you set point which for me was 73*. Then when into main. burn with no distribution fan. In thermo mode same thing. Worked until reach set point. So if you want to run in these two modes you will have to set your set point high enough that the stove will not reach it. May work on cold days and night, but just not cold enough yet to do that here.

 

[Tonyray]

This is exactly what I was experiencing. I also have the Skytech 3301p hooked up and running on room temp manual. I had my thermostat set to thermo mode 72* with 1* swing. Feed rate 3 and temp 5 1/2. When the house gets up to temp it pretty much stays there when the stove goes into maintenance burn without the distribution fan coming on. I wonder if our thermostat will work with the feed rate at 1 and temp at over 5 in programmed mode the same way and letting the distribution fan come on. I will try it tonight and see. EDIT: Well tried in program mode and it works fine until you reach you set point which for me was 73*. Then when into main. burn with no distribution fan. In thermo mode same thing. Worked until reach set point. So if you want to run in these two modes you will have to set your set point high enough that the stove will not reach it. May work on cold days and night, but just not cold enough yet to do that here.

that's the key...all about keeping steady dist blower without reverting to Stove/constant mode and melting anything in it's path with a P68/61 during shoulder season.
setting the temp higher than you normally would.
for most of us who have a Harman that is at least 3 yrs old or more, that would be 75[ or #5] on room temp/manual..
Bags:
guess I'm losin it because I now remember that I DID use this method in Stove or Constant mode/auto for a couple nights and my pellet consumption
over night was more than in room mode Let alone 80 degrees and climbing downstairs.
also, room/auto in normal operation feels the same way to me.....
it's the firing up, then ramping down, then off... rinse/lather/repeat... feels too much like my hot water baseboard system so I also
prefer the Continuous blower running method....

and just to clarify,
on days I'm at work and that I know it is going to warmup with plenty of sun, which is the way this winter so far has been here outside Phila,
[ and out of respect for Harman technology ] I do run the normal room/auto in order for the stove to shut down in early afternoon or late morning juggling a feed rate of #2 or #4 depending on if I'm using small Lignetic pellets or longer of other brands I use.

 

[SFCJames]

Hi, I have a Harman P68 which I purchased in June 2014. During the shoulder seasons, I like to run the
stove all night at a low setting. I was wondering. Which uses fewer pellets? A maintenance flame or
constant burn #1 (stove temp #1)? From what I can tell, I would say that the maintenance flame uses
fewer pellets, has the smaller fire, and produces the least heat - less than any setting of constant burn.
For those of you who have not experimented with the maintenance flame, you can run a maintenance flame
by setting the igniter switch to "manual" after you get the first fire in a room temperature mode.
A maintenance flame means your
fire never goes out, even when the thermostat (room temperature) has reached the set point temperature.

I agree with your assessment of the maintenance burn. It has been my experience that the stove uses less pellets in room temp/manual mode. I also like the even heat rather than the temp fluctuations from running in room temp/auto.

 

[jackhammer]

I messed with stove some last year but for some reason I remember preferring room temp. It could be that I experienced what you did as it would get a little too warm in warmer outside temps but what you are saying makes sense and I might try that and leave the feed down.

That's a good way to put it as steering the ship. Told ya I wasn't nuts. You definitely get what I was getting at. I have only seen a few others that have figured out what we are talking about and it is still highly contested throughout the Harman owner community. You, Cory, Golfuer??, and myself that I recall immediately. It does work and it does save me some pellets. Granted this year being warmer is a huge help but I know running this way certain times definitely reduces pellet use.

I also really like that it is more of a consistent and constant type of heat instead of all the off / on ramping up and down non-stop. My place stays a constant temp whereas in room temp auto it keeps it within a degree or two but it feels a lot different to me. More like a central HVAC type heat that lets the house cool some then kicks back on. Could be a mental thing but, hey, I like it and it works for me.

"Like a brick under the accelerator" is true but man at times the heating beast most definitely needs to be governed down. Otherwise there's just too much heat and smoking tires. LOL!

I have been running mine in stove temp, auto most of the time. Feed on 1, temp knob on 50 degrees. It works for me. I believe you! Still messing with settings, waiting for the cold to get here, I don't mind waiting.

 

[Tonyray]

I have been running mine in stove temp, auto most of the time. Feed on 1, temp knob on 50 degrees. It works for me. I believe you! Still messing with settings, waiting for the cold to get here, I don't mind waiting.

wow.... temp knob on 50....
had to look and see if there was a 50 degree setting on my stove..lol
are your pellets burning completely on that low of a setting?
I guess so or you wouldn't be doing it...

 

[jackhammer]

wow.... temp knob on 50....
had to look and see if there was a 50 degree setting on my stove..lol
are your pellets burning completely on that low of a setting?
I guess so or you wouldn't be doing it...

That is the lowest setting, keeping the distribution blower running. When it gets colder or when warming the house, I run it higher. And yes, the pellets burn completely. When I had the stove installed, both the shop where I bought it and the installer told me not to run the feed setting below three. I would be roasted out of the house at that setting real quick with these mild temps. I shut it down many nights because we like it cooler to sleep.

 

[bags]

both the shop where I bought it and the installer told me not to run the feed setting below three.

This I think is a good example of being the generic Harman crowd consensus. I guess many just revert to the old ways because that's just the way it is, has been, and should be ideology. Fine, but I disagree with what you were told by both the shop and installer. I think many realize that feed rate 3 - 4 is a general cover all mode to run so they recommend that for a cover the butt type general rule of thumb. Sure it works pretty well but is it the best case at all times? Nope. Not here anyway.

Ask your dealer and / or tech, Then why does my stove have lower settings? I bet you get a weird look along with a blank stare while they try to think of some BS that seems to sound half way logical to them. They will be talking in circles or not have any good explanation other than 'this is what Harman recommends.' OK, with that said doctors like to hit the go to solve all antibiotics for many bacteria type ailments. Kind of a general solve it all remedy.

Now if you are not sick and have no baterial infection etc; are you going to take them. No, and not everyone is running the same fever per se.

 

[scajjr2]

My very un-scientific 1 day study- yes it does use more pellets than maintenance burn, but as the blower is always on (in this case a low setting) the whole house stays at a constant temp (72* upstairs and down).

Right now I'm inclined to run the stove in maintenance burn mode during the day during the week while we're at work (easier to get the house up to desired temp than from a cold stove), the thermostat kicks it up to 70 an hr before we get home then run it in "renegade" mode while we're home. And keep it in renegade mode weekends (Fri nite-Mon morn). Adjusting the feed and fan as dictated by the outside temp.

Sam

 

[Tonyray]

got pretty cold last night and I still left the feed on #2 and still kept us plenty warm...room/manual. did bump up the fan speed to medium speed.
only thing I noticed is I get a sizeable Ash barrier in front on the burnpot but a simple swipe by the goofy Harman tool removes it..

And remember Pellet burners, "RENEGADE" mode was coined & Trademarked by yours truly Tonyray....

 

[Tonyray]

This I think is a good example of being the generic Harman crowd consensus. I guess many just revert to the old ways because that's just the way it is, has been, and should be ideology. Fine, but I disagree with what you were told by both the shop and installer. I think many realize that feed rate 3 - 4 is a general cover all mode to run so they recommend that for a cover the butt type general rule of thumb. Sure it works pretty well but is it the best case at all times? Nope. Not here anyway.

Ask your dealer and / or tech, Then why does my stove have lower settings? I bet you get a weird look along with a blank stare while they try to think of some BS that seems to sound half way logical to them. They will be talking in circles or not have any good explanation other than 'this is what Harman recommends.' OK, with that said doctors like to hit the go to solve all antibiotics for many bacteria type ailments. Kind of a general solve it all remedy.

Now if you are not sick and have no baterial infection etc; are you going to take them. No, and not everyone is running the same fever per se.

Amen Bro..

 

[bags]

The Renegade steers the ship....

Sam, I run my stove 24/7 and do not think twice about it. Even when I am gone all day or take off for a long while. I will set the feed down accordingly if it isn't already as low as I can go during the day when I am gone. It is much easier and better here that way.

The stove off during the day vs. stove running has been discussed many times here. It is all what works for you and one's preferences. I feel that by running it that the homes core temp is kept up better and it is more efficient. It doesn't have to burn wildly to get things back up where I like it.

I also feel that takes more pellets / fuel to get things back up there because you are reheating EVERYTHING vs. just bringing everything back up a bit. Cruise and steady throttle seems to me to be the best answer. Driving around heavy footed and hot rodding sucks the fuel.

This can be highly debated but my buck fifties worth is that I have found what I like and that's it. Done. I pay for my own pellets. Besides, who likes waking up or coming home to a cold place?