Why is my VC stove puffing smoke into the house?

[Prosecond]

I have a VC Defiant non cat stove that I bought new and have used for 3 years. I have only been using it a couple of days this year and it has been puffing smoke back into the room. I hate this and want it to stop. Please help me figure this out. Here is what I have:

The VC stove, 44' of 7" flex liner in an internal masonry chimney, liner has insulation wrap and I filled rest of cavity with vermiculite. It should be well insulated. Book says 6" or 8" stove pipe and 7" was as big as I could fit. Wood is all hardwood and very well seasoned. Several years css. Liner is clean and I removed the screen on cap. Stove is in basement of 3 story house. House sets on top of a hill and chimney cap is tallest this around. House is very tight newer construction. No outside air to stove.

I have very good draft. Any wood particles dropped when loading near the griddle can be sucked into the stove when I open the griddle.

I have two ideas what the problem may be. I need an OAK or something is blocked in the stove preventing the stove from venting when the damper is closed. It was just puffing smoke into the room and I openned the damper and the smoke stopped leaking out of the stove.

Thanks for any ideas.

 

[jeepnerd]

Try cracking a window open as an experiment since your house is tight.

 

[webby3650]

1 of 2 things has happened. Either the tunnels in the combustion package are clogged with ash, or a more likely problem. The combustion package in the back of the stove has collapsed. These stoves are known to have this failure after a short period of time. If so, it's a costly repair.

 

[Diabel]

So, for three years it was fine and now it is back puffing?
Do you see small explosions in the stove right before it back puffs? Or it is "puffing" as you call it, continuously?

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

Check you screen around the cap for creosote build up. The screen is low mass and condenses creosote much faster then other areas of the chimney much like ice does around your car antenna while driving in a winter storm.

 

[Prosecond]

No screen on cap. It is like small explosions. Kids had just showered and run exhaust fans. Maybe it can't get enough air. Do I need to take fire back out and check for ash behind it? I just vacuumed out the stove two days ago.

 

[Prosecond]

I am not sure if the stove has done this since installed or not. I do remember it happening last spring.

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

Sounds like back puffing and micro explosions. Did you add a bunch of wood on a really hot coal bed and shut it down?

 

[Simonkenton]

In 1988 I bought a new Vermont Castings Resolute. Burned it for 6 years, loved it. Wish I still had it, but sold it with the house that it was in. I got my Mom to buy the same model stove, she still has it and burns it regularly, never had a problem with it.
I love Vermont Castings. Made in America, beautiful, works well.

It is so sad for me to read these posts about the current VC stoves. Most of the comments on this forum are about problems with VC stoves. Wie schade.

 

[Prosecond]

The last two times the stove has done this it was about 20 minutes after a reload. Stove would be around 450 on reload. Air was wide open both times.

 

[webby3650]

This isn't your typical stove. They have a lot going on behind the scenes, and failure of these parts isn't uncommon. This "puffing" is the #1 symptom of a failed combustion package, sometimes it's just plugged with ash. If your lucky.

 

[webby3650]

Also, if you don't have a screen on the cap, you could have a bird down there. I've seen birds stuck in the combustion box outlets before. This would cause issues too.

 

[Prosecond]

Sounds like I need to let stove cool down and take it apart first. Thanks for the advice. I will update this thread after checking it out. Please if anyone has any other ideas I would like to hear them.

 

[Prosecond]

I wanted to add that the fireback does have a vertical crack. It looks tight and I was not planning on replacing it yet but if I am going to be taking everything apart I might as well replace it now. Any ideas on where I can get this part?

 

[webby3650]

I would first take the pipe off of it and look down through the flue collar. From there you can see the top of the combustion box. If it's intact, use a small hose on a shop vac and push the hose down around the sides of the box. I would try that before taking anything apart on this stove. Things often fall apart making the stove unusable until you get the parts. Make sure you're sitting down when you get the price for it all!

 

[DougA]

I've got a 30 yr old Resolute and I have had backpuffing problems with it for the last 5+ years. In my case, I close it down too much to keep it from overfiring. The stove needs to be completely redone and the cast joints repaired with stove cement. I have a replacement being installed in the next few weeks.

In your case, you say the stove is wide open and you have plenty of draft. I would agree with posts that say your air supply is plugged with ash or ?. The crack is undoubtedly causing a big problem too. Time to let the stove go cold, clean out the stove with a shovel, then clean all vents with a vacuum (MAKE SURE ALL ASH IS STONE COLD). Use a small flexible hose to get into any areas that you can. My VC has small multiple air holes that plug up and need to be cleaned every few days. Patch the crack with stove cement and then try it out to see if your puffing problem has been solved.

 

[Prosecond]

I found a youtube video (not mine) that shows what my stove is doing.

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I am not saying I agree with title. Just a video showing how my stove is behaving. Going to try cleaing more in depth.

 

[webby3650]

These stoves have what called the "everburn" system. It's been coined the "neverburn" system by its users. For obvious reasons...

 

[branchburner]

I have two ideas what the problem may be. I need an OAK or something is blocked in the stove preventing the stove from venting when the damper is closed. It was just puffing smoke into the room and I opened the damper and the smoke stopped leaking out of the stove..

Doubt you need an OAK if it's been fine for 3 years. I agree with webby, the combustion package may be clogged with ash or has otherwise failed. That is the "something" preventing the stove from venting when the damper is closed. Closing the damper forces the smoke into the CP, and if the smoke cannot burn properly there it may reignite in the firebox, causing those explosive puffs.

My stove has similar burn technology, and can also give problems if technique isn't quite right. You say it's about 20 minutes after a reload and air was wide open both times, but how soon after the reload did you close the damper... also at 20 minutes, and backpuffing started right away? Or did you close the damper sooner, and then the puffing came later?

If I reloaded my stove at 450f and left the air wide open for 20 minutes, with damper open, the stove would be about 900f. On the other hand, if I close the damper too soon, the CP will not work properly. Typically I won't run a hot reload on full air for more than 5-10 minutes or so, then bring the air back to 3/4 for a few minutes and close the damper, and then dial the air down from there. I realize you have a different stove, but I'm curious what your typical timing is for closing the damper and turning the air down. Why is your air still full open 20 minutes after reloading it at 450f, and what are the temps then?

 

[Prosecond]

I took the stove apart tonight. There wasn't much ash visable when I removed the flue collar.Took the shoe, fireback, and fountain assembly out. The fountain assembly was flaking off inside and blocking the flow out of the stove. I might be able to clean it out and make it work for a bit longer but I need to buy other parts and should just replace it now. I broke part of it by just picking it up to look at it. It was very fragile.

Need to buy fireback, shoe gasket, flue collar gasket, fountain assembly, and damper gasket, and one andiron. I am guessing at least $700 looking around at parts. Where can I find these parts in stock and order from one place?

I will try to post pictures later.

 

[begreen]

All this on a 3 yr old stove? Have you been in touch with your dealer? Isn't there any warranty coverage for any of this?

 

[Prosecond]

I actually bought the stove new in 2009. I installed the stove right away and determined that my masonry chimney was built incorrectly. I had to break out the liner and install the flex liner. After the initial fire the stove sat unused for years until I finally relined the chimney. I guess I have owned the stove for 15 years but it has only been used for the 3 winters. This was to be its 4th winter in use.

 

[Heatsource]

All this on a 3 yr old stove? Have you been in touch with your dealer? Isn't there any warranty coverage for any of this?

it sounds like a dirty 'fountain'
not a warrantee issue

 

[bholler]

actually bought the stove new in 2009. I installed the stove right away and determined that my masonry chimney was built incorrectly. I had to break out the liner and install the flex liner. After the initial fire the stove sat unused for years until I finally relined the chimney. I guess I have owned the stove for 15 years but it has only been used for the 3 winters. This was to be its 4th winter in use.

2009 to 2014 is not 15 yrs lol. But seriously have you cleaned out the combustion chamber yet if not in 3 years i would bet that is the problem

 

[Ram 1500 with an axe...]

In 1988 I bought a new Vermont Castings Resolute. Burned it for 6 years, loved it. Wish I still had it, but sold it with the house that it was in. I got my Mom to buy the same model stove, she still has it and burns it regularly, never had a problem with it.
I love Vermont Castings. Made in America, beautiful, works well.

It is so sad for me to read these posts about the current VC stoves. Most of the comments on this forum are about problems with VC stoves. Wie schade.

Hey don't get down, I love my VCToo......