How is this for performance with only 3 splits?

[Backwoods Savage]

It is relatively warm here as we were once more into the 40's. When I got home though I got the stove going. Not too much though so I put in 3 relatively small splits. It took off right away and I engaged the catalyst at 250 stove top and 400 flue. Then I got a couple things done and got on the forum. Kept getting a bit too warm but just thought it was because maybe the temperature outside was not going down as there is a storm approaching.

I've heard many tell about the explosions and we've experienced a few over the years. Today I heard something faint as if something may have fell or something hit the house. Naturally though, I go first to the stove. Wow! It was hotter the closer I got. There was some flame but not a lot. Stove top temperature was 690. Whoops. Approaching the top line so I opened the draft slightly and it cooled down fast. That is not a typo if someone wonders. Yes, I opened the draft a bit and the stove cooled.

The amazing thing is that the splits were rather small but still the stove reached that temperature. This is the 6th day with the new SS cat.

 

[yooperdave]

Hello Dennis! I hope the ornery one is doing well-please pass my regards on.

Yes, I remember the "trick" about opening the draft. You had posted it previously (maybe well over a year ago) and I had actually tried it on my non-epa stove. Just before I bought the nc-13. I also think you posted something like "you wouldn't think it would work as well as it does".
Well, I intentionally tried it at that point of time (with the non-epa) and the results were something else. Like you said, you wouldn't think so...

Thanks

 

[wkpoor]

engaged the catalyst at 250 stove top and 400 flue.

I don't mean to derail this thread but the above quote I see quite often or something similar and I have a question. Now I haven't been burning for 50yrs (only 10 for me) but I have never seen a flue temp higher than the stove top under any conditions with any stove pre or post EPA. Just how do you do that? About the highest I can get to is 1/2 the stove top. And this is with several different mag thermos and IR confirmation. On a typical day I see no more than 200 degree pipe temp measured about 12" above outlet even with 600 degree stove top. 800 stove top I might see 300.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Perhaps it would have helped if you would describe your flue. My guess is that you have double wall pipe. The temperature is measured on horizontal single wall pipe. As for the flue temperature being higher than the stove, that indeed is normal when starting with a cold stove or even on reloads unless you reload at a much higher stove temperature than we do. After the cat is engaged and the draft turned down, then is when the stove top temperature will be higher than the flue.

When the stove top was at 690, the flue was at 380.

 

[wkpoor]

No Dennis I have a single wall pipe. I hope I'm way smarter than that. It is 6" single wall 6' to chimney 35' class A. last yr I mentioned this in a few posts also. I have never seen high temps unless I force it with a load of cardboard or something like that.

 

[wkpoor]

It has got to be something to do with the tall chimney. Today it was 57 degrees out and the draft was still good enough for me to run a 600 degree stove top with the primary and damper fully closed. You can talk all day about heat up the pipe. Thats something I have never been concerned with .

 

[Backwoods Savage]

That indeed is weird. We've had several stoves and always will get a higher temperature on flue than stove but this is for a short time. As soon as you start closing that draft, the flue temperature falls. Perhaps you just turn your draft down sooner? Also, with a horizontal pipe, that will show a higher temperature than with a vertical pipe; heat goes up.

 

[oldspark]

I dont always agree with Dennis :cheese:, but this time I do, a higher flue temp vs stove top is normal on reloads and startups.

 

[wkpoor]

This before and after damper install. I haven't noticed much difference in pipe temps with draft closed or open. I can see a difference in the flames though and on windy days before damper it was very hard to maintain a fire. Local dealer told me last week they did an install in a house with a tall chimney like mine and they had to put in 2 dampers to get draft down to mfg specs. With damper full closed I can still rip open the stove door and never ever get any smoke out the front. When I first read about people getting smoke when opening the door and then recommendation to fully open primary first I couldn't understand what the problem was but this is the only chimney I have ever burned on and never gave any thought to a condition where there was to much draft. More people have this condition than realize it and might have been part of my trouble with my last stove always overtemping.

 

[wkpoor]

I dont always agree with Dennis :cheese:, but this time I do, a higher flue temp vs stove top is normal on reloads and startups.

Oldspark I'm not disagreeing with anyone. Just trying to understand a phenomena. I think figuring this out will explain other things.

 

[Uncle]

I've heard many tell about the explosions and we've experienced a few over the years. .

Yikes......This is the first I've heard of explosions. What are these explosions like?

 

[oldspark]

I dont always agree with Dennis :cheese:, but this time I do, a higher flue temp vs stove top is normal on reloads and startups.

Oldspark I'm not disagreeing with anyone. Just trying to understand a phenomena. I think figuring this out will explain other things.

I understand totaly, dont want to hyjack this thread any more.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I've heard many tell about the explosions and we've experienced a few over the years. .

Yikes......This is the first I've heard of explosions. What are these explosions like?

Don't worry too much Uncle. They are usually so slight you may not even know about them. Most though are nothing more than backpuffing and then you will know it happened because you will smell smoke. I know of only one who had a big enough explosion to knock the top lid loose a bit and had some soot to clean up from the stove room but he was not running the stove right. A bit of operator error there. Again, this is nothing to be a big concern. The one we had was not very loud at all. Sort of like something falling in one of the back rooms or something hitting the outside of the house. But I naturally went to the stove first and when I saw the flame I knew immediately what had happened because I had the stove set for no flame. Sure was good to know we can hit 700 degrees with only 3 small splits though! I wonder what Ben Franklin would have thought? lol

 

[NH_Wood]

Dennis - when you say you opened the draft and it cooled down quickly, I assume you mean the flue temp? If I get my soapstone stovetop to 600*, it isn't going to cool down fast no matter what I do - the stone just holds the heat. Cheers!

 

[Gark]

Dennis (back to the original post theme), do you attribute the boost in stove efficiency to the new steel cat? Could the steel cats let more flow through than the ceramic for a given primary air setting? Just wonderin...

 

[DexterDay]

Dennis- Hope Judy is doing ok. Wish her a speedy recovery.

As to temps. I just reloaded and caught a couple pics. Not that big of a difference now as I have been cutting back the air before the pics.

But the Probe is pretty much dead on (I have another installed further up on the horizontal going to the thimble). And my Tel-Tru stove top is... Well... Its the most responsive and most accurate I have. Also has a "Marker" to show me how it got overnight or while Im at work (Nice feature, but pricey)

Anyways. Not meant to derail. Only post.

Stove top is about 550° (300° a bit ago) and flue is 600° (900° a bit ago).

 

[nate379]

I know I can't be the only one that would be dying of a heat stroke if I made a fire in the stove with near 60* temps outside! Anything over high 30s/low 40s for a low the stove is shut down.

I made the mistake of throwing a few small splits in the stove this weekend and getting distracted. Left the air wide open. Walked in the house an hour later and it was pushing 90* with the stove going "ting ting ting ting".... :bug:

 

[corey21]

I done that last year the stovw was 700 when i got back too check it and that was with 3 splits.

 

[Todd]

I just received and installed my replacement ceramic cat and get the same performance your getting with your new cat. New cats are very active for the first 100 hours or so before they settle in for the long haul. Temps will definitely go up fast and you have to watch a little closer.

 

[Wade A.]

I think it is a function of greater internal air space and larger surface exposure when you are able to get temps up that high with only a few splits. As you know, the heat output won't last long. You must have come in right at the peak. For me....two splits makes a sluggish fire, four gives a longer temperature climb and and a longer heat "tail", and three is what you use when you come home to a cold house and want jack the temps up quickly. I consider three splits to most often be the "Goldilocks" amount.....just right to get things going well. In my stove, it is two E/W and one on the bias atop them. I think it is that top split, crossed on the diagonal, that is really the reason for it. If your firebox is big enough to cross two on top, well....that would really be a jump start. The Castine doesn't really have that space, so three it is for me.

 

[Highbeam]

engaged the catalyst at 250 stove top and 400 flue.

I don't mean to derail this thread but the above quote I see quite often or something similar and I have a question. Now I haven't been burning for 50yrs (only 10 for me) but I have never seen a flue temp higher than the stove top under any conditions with any stove pre or post EPA. Just how do you do that? About the highest I can get to is 1/2 the stove top. And this is with several different mag thermos and IR confirmation. On a typical day I see no more than 200 degree pipe temp measured about 12" above outlet even with 600 degree stove top. 800 stove top I might see 300.

This could be as simple as Dennis using a probe meter in the flue and wkpoor using a surface meter. Another very obvious reason is the stone. Stone stoves take a long time to heat up, the fire can be blazing and heating the flue long before the stove has absorbed enough of the heat to increase in temperature.

That said, my flue temps (actual internal temps) always run higher and usually about double the stove top temps.

 

[BrowningBAR]

engaged the catalyst at 250 stove top and 400 flue.

I don't mean to derail this thread but the above quote I see quite often or something similar and I have a question. Now I haven't been burning for 50yrs (only 10 for me) but I have never seen a flue temp higher than the stove top under any conditions with any stove pre or post EPA. Just how do you do that? About the highest I can get to is 1/2 the stove top. And this is with several different mag thermos and IR confirmation. On a typical day I see no more than 200 degree pipe temp measured about 12" above outlet even with 600 degree stove top. 800 stove top I might see 300.

This could be as simple as Dennis using a probe meter in the flue and wkpoor using a surface meter. Another very obvious reason is the stone. Stone stoves take a long time to heat up, the fire can be blazing and heating the flue long before the stove has absorbed enough of the heat to increase in temperature.

That said, my flue temps (actual internal temps) always run higher and usually about double the stove top temps.

I experience the same thing on my Heritage during a cold start.

 

[Woody Stover]

with a horizontal pipe, that will show a higher temperature than with a vertical pipe; heat goes up.

I wondered about that. I've got horizontal pipe with a surface thermo sitting right behind the flue collar so that I can see it; Further back and it's in the fireplace and hard to see. Not really sure how those temps compare with readings taken on vertical, 18" up. I might try a probe at some point but it would be right at the start of the vertical tee section only about 8" in back of the flue collar.

Another very obvious reason is the stone. Stone stoves take a long time to heat up, the fire can be blazing and heating the flue long before the stove has absorbed enough of the heat to increase in temperature.

Beat me to it. I don't know how pronounced it is with the Heritage but the Fireview top is lagging way behind the firebox and flue temps. But others see the same thing with steel; I had a steel and a cast stove before but never had a stove top or flue meter before I started reading here, just a cat probe.

 

[Flatbedford]

. This is the 6th day with the new SS cat.

That is the key right there. Report back after the 156th or so day. My SS cat was like that too in January 2011, not so much now.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Dennis - when you say you opened the draft and it cooled down quickly, I assume you mean the flue temp? If I get my soapstone stovetop to 600*, it isn't going to cool down fast no matter what I do - the stone just holds the heat. Cheers!

You are correct. btw, I did not open the draft very far. Just a tad above 1 on the draft (draft settings are from 0-4). It doesn't need much.