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Important Magnum Baby CountrySide behind the firebox cleanout?

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by Don2222, Mar 13, 2013.

  1. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    I am working on a couple stoves that do not have enough vacuum to keep the vacuum switch closed. The stoves are clean and no visible signs of what is wrong.

    I just learned that Magnum in their product improvements have drilled holes in the back of the firebox behind the ash pan and inserted metal snap in hole caps in newer stoves similar to these.
    http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/Hole-Plug-4HFT6?Pid=search

    So what about the older BabyCountrySide stoves that are now plugged up after the 3-4 years it takes to plug that area up? Just got some pics of the newer stove with the cleanout cap!

    Magnum's new Baby CountrySide manual page 25

    BACK ASH CHAMBER AREA: Every 2-4 weeks
    Periodically inspect the back ash chambers to make sure that they have not
    plugged. Contact your local dealer for the proper cleaning tools. Clean out
    any obstruction that would cause the ash to not drop out of the chamber.
    There is a clean out plug behind the ash pan that needs to be inspected once
    a month.

    Attached Files:

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  2. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    Thanks to ChandlerR
    He pointed out the real cleaning problem with the Magnum Baby CountrySide with the upside down U behind the firewall. There are 2 slots in the upper corners just under the outer heat exchanger tubes. These slots must be clear of ash and open!
    Poking the ash around the middle of the heat exchanger tubes makes the ash fall behind the firebox onto the top of the U and clogs up the stove! To remove this ash you must tip the baby on it's side and bang the back of the firebox to disloge this ash! Scott suggests a 150 psi compressor up and behind each leg of the U. Another fix is to drill a hole above the U and near the top for a cleaning ash vac tube and then use a hole plug like the one at Graingers in the above post.

    Click on pic below to enlarge:

    From >> http://forum.iburncorn.com/viewtopic.php?t=6817&highlight=clean baby countryside
    In the middle of the heat season, I've always done a major shut down and full cleaning of my Babyside. Since I have burned half of my corn supply, I figured the heat season was half over!! [​IMG] Today was the day!

    Someone mentioned in another post about holes in the top of the "horseshoe" (which is the exhaust chamber of the Baby). I've always wondered about exhaust venting in the upper part of the stove since not all the exhaust appears to travel down and out through the bottom of the horseshoe. There HAS to be exhaust that follows the flames up through the heat exhanger tubes.

    Well, yes indeed, there are holes up there that need attention. Now, please understand, I've been burning this Babyside since 11/05 and have NEVER cleaned in this area to the extent that I did today. Previously, I simply swabbed an old paintbrush over the tubes to clean off whatever soot the scraper didn't get.

    So, when you are cleaning, (in addition to scraping out the horseshoe) pull the heat exchanger scraper out and clean real good in the upper outside corner of the fire chamber using an old paintbrush or something similar. This area would be to the outside of the outermost heat exchanger tubes. There you will find slots about 1/4" x 1.5". I poked them out, first with a small screwdriver and later with a piece of flexible cable. I know for certain that these openings are connected to the horseshoe, because the junk that was dislocated fell down the vertical sections of the horseshoe. You really have to fish around, because these slots do not directly open to the horseshoe.

    Now that the stove is completely clean (1st time in 3 years) it burns just like new.

    Sorry, I have no pics; my Canon digital took a major dump. You'll have to follow my written description.

    The thing I like is that this forum is all about corn burners helping corn burners. As I mentioned earlier, I have NEVER cleaned in this area before. Hopefully, this information will help the rest of you Babyside owners (Winn70, are you listening?).

    Oh, and AES, please create a bulletin called "Cleaning the Baby."

    Attached Files:

  3. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    You really need to get some forced air into those holes in the u shape exhaust path, 150 psi from a compressor works like a charm and you will be amazed at how much comes out. Very poor design from AES, another example of how they make product with absolutely no regard for the end user. Very typical with everything they make. They go with the energizer approach to stove building and assume that stoves are disposable and you just go get a new one or toss some money into needless parts when the thing gets all plugged up.

    On the full size countryside you can disassemble that exhaust path.

    Good luck with your relationship with AES, they're not going to create a bulletin to help anyone clean it...damn it, that should be included in the manual. It's more likely they will create a bulletin letting you know that customers must be doing something wrong...
  4. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hi Scott

    So you are saying that:
    If you pull out the ash pan and put the compressor hose up one side of the horse show area, it will be strong enough to blow all the ash above the upside down U out.

    Also make sure the slots next to the outer heat exchanger tubes are clear!

    See my picture above.

    Seems if there was a nice cleanout plug up there, (See Arrow that points up top in pic in post above) then it would work real nice! ! !)
    Maybe something like this?
    http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/Hole-Plug-4HFT6?Pid=search
  5. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Thanks again Chandler R

    This is a great Mod and that is what I like!

    From >> http://forum.iburncorn.com/viewtopic.php?t=8907&highlight=horseshoe
    I finally got around to drilling an access hole on my babys horseshoe. I measured in 6 inches from the front and down 5 1/2in from the top, or 4 1/2 for the tops lip and drilled a hole to accommodate a 1/8 in pipe plug. tapped it out and it works perfect. Now I can either blow it out with an air hose or today I used my drain snake and a vacuum and cleaned out the ash. I think charlie did it some time ago with a 1/2 inch plug, But no dimensions or pics. It doesnt interfere with the side door operation. Takes the hasssle out of getting down and tryiung to snake something up and around.
  6. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    I agree with Scott. This is a crappy design. The stove itself works well enough (especially after mods to the burn pot suggested by Dexter Day) and it's easy to clean for the quick cleanings but the *Big* cleaning is a pain. I told Don that in the Spring after I'm done burning, I tip it over on it's side and get it clean...Easy but not practical during the burning season. I'm going to drill a cleanout hole this summer and I hope it works as well as advertised. By the way, I have heard the stories about AES and fortunately there is nothing I need from them that I can't do myself :)
  7. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    Well I drilled a small screw hole in the right side. By putting a SS screw in when done, it is just an extra screw in the chassis!
    Results are staggering! Before I did anything, I hooked up the digital manometer to the vacuum port on the back of the firewall. Then I hooked up the AC test cord to the new high speed (105 CFM exhaust blower) the reading was -0.40 wg.
    After blowing the top plenum out and blocked it up, I hooked up the manometer. It read -1.60 wg. FOUR times greater ! ! !

    See video


    Click on pics to enlarge:

    Attached Files:

  8. DexterDay

    DexterDay Guest

    Don, there seem to an abundance of those stoves near you? Magnum seen a market and struck while the iron is hot.

    If you had a Leaf blower hooked up on the outside vent? I would have bet, that zero smoke/soot came in the house?


    I paint my Fireboxs every year and get zero smell in the house. The Leafblower sucks out so much air, it's amazing.
  9. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    I agree, the leafblower works well. I just wanted to prove the concept here and show where the root of the problem lies. I also have a friend that owns one and banged and shook it to dislodge the ash, but now we know it needs air pressure for the proper fix. Going from -0.4 to -1.4
    on the manometer proves this is the fix! These stoves were sold through many Home Depots in our area up until a year or so ago. These stoves are getting older now and desperately need this blow out service to be brought back to life!
  10. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    Don and Dex, I guess I'll poke a hole in the side of mine next week. I can't do the leafblower thing right now but I was thinking...If I hit the start button with the door shut and blast it with my compressed air, do you think the combustion fan will carry the bulk of the ash out?
    Don, I'm going with a 1/4 inch npt plug so I can get my little vacuum hose in there if I need to. My brother and his wife are here from SC for the weekend so we're eating well, drinking some good single malt scotch and watching the collage basketball games. No stove cleaning this weekend :)
  11. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Sounds good Chan. Make sure you can get your compressor into the 1/4" hole. I tried a shop vacuum hose in the hole I drilled but it does not do the trick. You need to put compressed air in that 1/4" hole and really blast it!

    If you use a male NPT connector, then what will you cap it with that is fire proof?

    Not sure if the exhaust fan and compressor will do the trick either. You really need to blast it right in that top chamber. My success shows that little hole is well worth it!

    Have a good weekend Chan and good luck with your cleanout. Please let us know how it works out for you. :)
  12. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    Thanks Don! I'm going to tap the hole and screw a pipe plug in there. No worries. I will be sure to let you know how it works and if there's any difference. It will be Wednesday or Thursday.
  13. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    I went to a baby magnum yesterday up in Maine that the people have been having issues with since it was new a couple years ago. The problem they keep having is that the stop bolt which keeps the auger motor from over rotating keeps snapping. When it snaps off the auger motor winds around its own wires and eventually shorts out the wiring harness. Additionally, the plate which holds the bushing at the bottom of the hopper gets screwed up and starts grinding up pellets in the bottom of the hopper. I have rebuilt this area twice now. The dust or crumble of pellets in the bottom of the hopper gets between the plate and falls out into the bottom of the stove but because the room blower is right below it...the dust get pulled up and blown into the heat exchanger which causes the dust to catch fire inside the heat exchange tubes and then blow out as embers all over the customers floor and carpet. We are talking 4 or 5 feet into the room.

    Another example of American Energy Systems making product that is unsafe and having no regard for the end user. When confronted with the issue, AES tells my customer that "THEY" are doing something wrong and have never had any reports of this type of issue. I have found this problem in 4 of my customers with this stove.
  14. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    Ask yourself this question...why should you folks as the owners of these stoves have to modify the unit to be able to clean it? Why? Why?
  15. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    They know there is a problem with the auger stop bolt.

    Have you seen the new heavier stop bolt? Like the one on this newer baby countryside stove? See red arrow in pic below.
    Click to enlarge

    Attached Files:

  16. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Your Harman Invincible is the same way. Do you know a good location to modify and drill a hole to get my compressor needle in? Otherwise it is almost impossible to clean real good!
  17. DexterDay

    DexterDay Guest

    My buddies always has had problems with the bushing and fines falling into the back of the stove and being blown into the exchange area.

    It builds up on the top really bad. Right under the trivet. The mods we did have made it burn better (much better), but I still wouldn't want one in my house. Period. Its unsafe at best.
  18. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    Like I've said, it's a crappy design and fortunately I have never had any auger issues. I don't sift the pellets and mine eats everything with no issues. If I start having issues it will give me a chance to get me an Enviro Mini....remember, I have a small room and only 900 square feet. My Baby running on low can still blow me out of the house if the temps are above 32.
  19. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    Not true. The exchangers are accessible with the right brush. Compressed air just happens to be easier. You cannot compare a Harman and anything from AES, that is a crime.
  20. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    If they know its a problem...how about fixing it for good? R and D shouldn't stop with the customer.
  21. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    I agree. With what I have seen, AES's customer service is non existent too. If you go to their website and look at their forum, it's filled with unhappy customers.
  22. ChandlerR

    ChandlerR Minister of Fire

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    Ok Don....did the hole thingy. I drilled and tapped the hole for a 1/4 inch pipe plug. I measured the vacuum with a Magnehelic before I started and it wasn't too bad. .90 After it was 1.25. Remember, I do not have the high altitude combustion blower (yet). I see a noticeable improvement and I'll let it run and get up to temp and see what my temps are from my heat exchanger tubes.

    I have the setting at three and usually see 210 degrees. Oh, I ran out of my Vermonts and am now burning my shoulder pellets, Maine's Choice that I got from Home Depot for 160 a ton. I'll write back in a few hours.

    Chan
  23. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hi Scott

    They did fix the auger stop bolt problem for good. Engineering came up with a new Auger Mounting bracket Kit part # BC-7000. All the new Baby Countrysides come with it and the higher speed 105 CFM exhaust blower.

    For the older stoves all you need is the newer auger mounting bracket part # P-8090
    There is also an auger flange P5028C

    All you have to do is ask and not assume nothing was done!

    Attached Files:

  24. smwilliamson

    smwilliamson Minister of Fire

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    All I'm saying is that they found it to be a problem after the fact. Units were sold to consumers. Registration cards were issued. They know who these people are and they aren't going to reach out to them to let them know that there is afix and they (AES) sent something out to the public without fully testing it to see if it was safe or reliable. Consumers shouldn't be guinea pigs. You think Harman would use a soft metal stop bolt to keep an auger motor seated?

    They may very well have all kinds of solutions for problems with their stoves but why should anyone have to hunt it down in the first place? Seems like that auger fix should have been stock in the first place. Jimminey Christmas
    DexterDay likes this.
  25. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    The fix for good is this auger gearbox stop bracket! This is what I use. :) See pic

    Attached Files:

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