My installation photos

[Starter]

Flexible aluminum? That just doesn't sound right or healthy to me.

Why?
All inserts I saw over here which take ducting have the ducting made of flexible aluminium. Nobody ever gave us a different option.
hh:

 

[Harley]

just going off-topic a little bit.... why are the buildings done entirely with concrete and stone? Is it that wood is much more expensive there? Or are we talking about much older buildings? Is that the norm, or is that just your particular house?

 

[DriftWood]

Here houses are totally built of non-combustible material. Walls are of limestone, floors are concrete/cement with ceramic tiles. We do not use any wood or combustible materials in construction here.

Sounds like a house a Neanderthal would love! Where are you located? Why no wood in construction, too many wood burners in the past not planting trees? Climate change?

 

[Starter]

Well, I live in Malta, an island in the middle of the mediterranean sea, . Practically there is not one house on the entire island which is made of wood!

The island is slightly less than twice the size of Washington DC. And guess what the major resources are? Limestone and salt. The latter not being of much use in construction, lol, we build our houses from quarried stone.

We have no large woods or forests here. Sure there are small woods and trees, but they're all protected by law. The average rainfall per year is 22 inches, and mainly rain falls only between October and March, so no wonder trees find it hard to thrive.

Basically all the houses here are built from quarried limestone, which is either painted over or left bare for a rustic finish, and the ceilings are made of steel-reinforced concrete. Some very old buildings have wooden beams, but houses are no longer built like that now.

Even parquet flooring is somewhat of a rarity here. Our floors are mainly ceramic tiles, and the staircases of granite or marble. Very rich people have the entire flooring done of granite.

But no one has ever constructed a house of wood. Guess it'd be insanely expensive here! Plus I don't know but in my view 9 inch limestone slabs seem to be a safer and sturdier option than a wood construction?

 

[Rhone]

I think the aluminum ducting is fine, it melts around 660C or 1220F which if you achieve that temperature on the outside shroud of an insert (the outside shroud would have to be glowing) you probably have bigger things to worry about. The flue is where it gets really scary using aluminum and illegal here for wood burning appliances. The place you live sounds beautiful, and very interesting.

 

[DriftWood]

Plus I don't know but in my view 9 inch limestone slabs seem to be a safer and sturdier option than a wood construction?

Are you in a earth quake zone?

 

[Harley]

The place you live sounds beautiful, and very interesting.

I agree.... once you've posted the rest of the installation pics... could you post of few of the area around your house?

 

[Starter]

Plus I don't know but in my view 9 inch limestone slabs seem to be a safer and sturdier option than a wood construction?

Are you in a earth quake zone?

For now not really, but who knows what might happen in the future? You know the story of the three little pigs? ;-P

Anyway, kidding apart, here are the rest of the photos I took.

The first one is the ducting on the first floor. It exits the daughter's bedroom into the bathroom. One duct is cut away to blow into the bathroom, while the other one continues all the way (see second picture) to emerge into our bedroom (third picture). In those pictures you can see the roof of the bathroom. In the near future we're going to make a soffit (false ceiling?) and the ducting will be hidden there. The duct which exits in the bathroom will have a neat vent in the soffit.

 

[Starter]

Third pic

 

[Starter]

In the following photos you can see the flue (still bare for now) in the second floor washroom. The window there is the reason why the first 9 feet of flue downstairs had to be flexible.

The hole through which the flue passes has been filled. There is insulation and it was also finished with high temperature cement.

The last photo is of the chimney. I noticed quite an amount of soot, is that normal?

 

[Harley]

The last photo is of the chimney. I noticed quite an amount of soot, is that normal?

I would say, no its not normal, especially if you've had several hot fires going. Could it be the amount of cooling that is happening to the flue by the venting/drawing heat off the pipe to heat the area? Based on what you said before - I doubt its that you are burning wet wood.

I was going to ask before what those 3 (assuming) clay pieces were for... now I see they make the chimney cap, which could make it hard to clean.

Can you get a closer picture as to what you think might be a lot of soot?

 

[Starter]

I doubt its that you are burning wet wood.

I was going to ask before what those 3 (assuming) clay pieces were for... now I see they make the chimney cap, which could make it hard to clean.

Can you get a closer picture as to what you think might be a lot of soot?

It could have been wet wood... I mean the wood was old and dried up, but it had been lying in a puddle of water and we left it in the sun for a couple of days - we thought it had dried enough, maybe we were mistaken?

Or could it be because yesterday husband insisted that he preferred a small 'fire' which consisted almost entirely of glowing embers rather than fire? I noticed that yesterday the glass became quite sooty too, but it was easily cleaned. Is that the black stuff which is called creosote?

Here's a close up of the chimney. The 'clay' parts are made of what the supplier called 'lava concrete' if I remember correctly.

 

[Harley]

OK... still hard to tell from the picture, but by that closeup, I don't think I would be too concerned about that much (seems to be only a little) creosote. Kepp an eye on it, keep the fires burning relatively hot (where you don't see a lot of smoke out the chimney) and use dry wood, and you should be ok.

 

[Highbeam]

Are those cisterns on the rooftops? I would expect that those lava concrete chimney cap pieces would be blackened. I would not expect them to be dribbling black liquid onto your nice chimney.

 

[Starter]

Are those cisterns on the rooftops? I would expect that those lava concrete chimney cap pieces would be blackened. I would not expect them to be dribbling black liquid onto your nice chimney.

Um, yes those are water cisterns. One of them is filled by normal water supply, and it provides water for the solar water heater. It's good to have it like that because the normal water supply here is under pressure and might damage the water heater. The other one gets water pumped into it from our well, and that goes into flushing the toilets, and stuff like washing the floors, watering the plants etc.

The stuff on the chimney appears to be soot. So I understand soot is not creosote and creosote is liquid? Sorry for my ignorance. Fireplaces are not common here - first of all the winters are rather mild, and secondly were I to BUY the wood it'd be more expensive than heating my house with airconditioners...

 

[Starter]

The place you live sounds beautiful, and very interesting.

I agree.... once you've posted the rest of the installation pics... could you post of few of the area around your house?

Sure, tomorrow when it's light outside I'll take a couple of pics of the outside of my house and surroundings.

Here's some aerial views in the meantime...

 

[philaphire]

perhaps you have said this earlier, but where do you get your wood from? Are you the only person you know with a wood burning appliance?

 

[Harley]

The stuff on the chimney appears to be soot. So I understand soot is not creosote and creosote is liquid? Sorry for my ignorance. Fireplaces are not common here - first of all the winters are rather mild, and secondly were I to BUY the wood it'd be more expensive than heating my house with airconditioners...

Well... this is probably oversimplifying a bit, but there are different stages of creosote, the one you most have to be concerned about is the "third stage" which would appear to be a hard, tar-like shiny material. It is the stuff that is most likely to cause a fire in the chimney.

 

[Starter]

perhaps you have said this earlier, but where do you get your wood from? Are you the only person you know with a wood burning appliance?

There aren't many people who burn wood here. We are in the importing industry, so we get a lot of pallets which we used to throw away...

There are houses with fire places, but it's more as a luxury feature to increase the value of the home rather than a practical heating feature. Many families who have fire places use them only occasionally... they buy 3 hours worth of wood burning for the equivalent of 9 US Dollars, and start the fireplace when they have guests or just occasionally.

We installed our insert because of the relatively free supply of wood. We also have some trees available from my father's land. So ultimately it won't be just pallets. Otherwise in my country it'd be cheaper to use the already high rates of electricity than wood for a fireplace. Gas might be cheaper, but then with the option of free pallet wood I wasn't that eager to spend money on a gas installation.

 

[Gooserider]

Flexible aluminum? That just doesn't sound right or healthy to me.

I think she is talking about the air movement ducting, not anything to do with the smoke venting - remember her setup acts as both a stove and a furnace, so there are hot air ducts as well as the flue.

AFAIK there is no reason not to use aluminum for HVAC type ducting.

Gooserider

 

[nshif]

Didnt she say in the other thread that they had already had a fire in the stove? These must be the distribution stacks not the main flue or they wouldnt have been able to stay in the house. Im guessing the dist temps must be way lower then the chimney.

Goose I tried to imply this before but I guess i didnt say it very well

 

[Gooserider]

Are those cisterns on the rooftops? I would expect that those lava concrete chimney cap pieces would be blackened. I would not expect them to be dribbling black liquid onto your nice chimney.

<snip>
The stuff on the chimney appears to be soot. So I understand soot is not creosote and creosote is liquid? Sorry for my ignorance. Fireplaces are not common here - first of all the winters are rather mild, and secondly were I to BUY the wood it'd be more expensive than heating my house with airconditioners...

Soot is mostly carbon particles and as such isn't a big problem as long as the quantity stays down, though it does contain other stuff that makes it mildly unhealthy to have alot of contact with it (mostly only a concern for chimney sweeps and so forth) As long as it doesn't get really heavy, it isn't a big problem and a certain amount is normal.

If those cisterns are not covered, I might be a bit concerned about how close they are to the chimney, especially the one you sort of suggested might be used for drinking water, but I don't know just how much of an issue it really would be.

Creosote is a mix of soot and other unburned combustion byproducts, including wood alcohols, tars, and other nasty stuff along that line, and is found in several different forms and consistencies depending on just what mix of stuff is in it, and what conditions it forms under. A modern stove with secondary combustion, when operated properly, should NOT produce much creosote, and mostly what it does produce will be at startup and refueling times. A large part of the modern stove design is to finish burning the material in the smoke which would otherwise condense into creosote. One of the forms that creosote can take is a black, tarry, asphalt-like liquid that tends to stain and smell vile, Some folks have had problems where they get buildups that drip out of their chimney caps, which I think is what Highbeam was referring to.

As long as you operate your stove properly, you shouldn't have a big problem with it, although pulling heat off the pipe the way you do in your daughter's room might cause some problems. I would plan on cleaning the chimney at least once or twice a year to make sure you don't get an excessive buildup.

You do seem to have an unusually tall chimney height, I'm guessing well over 30 feet, which can cause overdraft problems. However your relatively warm climate (compared to what most of us are used to) will tend to reduce your draft, so it's hard to say what the total effect will be. Watch for signs of overdraft, particularly a tendency towards over-firing, or a lack of the air controls on the stove to effectively change the way it burns. If you see signs of this, you might need to add an extra manual damper to the flue in order to further reduce it's draw. I wouldn't worry about it immediately, but keep it in mind. If you do want to put a manual damper in, it will probably be easier to do so before building the surround for the stove and pipes.

(BTW, keep the need to access the pipe for cleaning in mind when designing the surround)

Gooserider

 

[DriftWood]

Free wood + wood stove = free heat , Good for you! Just always remember you are playing with fire, don't get burned! Wear leather welders gloves when reloading a hot stove.

Pallet wood can burn very hot and fast do not load a lot of it at one time. Try to keep your fires small and controlled to avoid problems. There is a lot of information about creosote here and on the Web just do a search.

"wolf and the three little pigs" I thought about that story when I made my last post. It is a very common childrens story here, many books and cartoons made about that one. Is it common there or did you learn it some where else.

 

[NewtownPA]

Well, I live in Malta, an island in the middle of the mediterranean sea,

Hi Starter,

I lived 11 years in Cyprus! Hey we were neighbours (sort of, but an island is an island). Currently my parents still reside in Cyprus. They have a wood stove there too.

 

[Starter]

Gooserider, you always give such great advice! Thank you! Rest assured the cisterns are covered, well.

Yesterday we went to our supplier to settle payment. I asked him for a magnetic thermometer, and for the manual of the stove. They don't stock magnetic thermometers... I'll try to search maybe I'll buy one online (hey I think there are suppliers on this forum too? Pm me anyone who happens to be reading this).

He didn't have the manual of the stove either... duh... he asked me what I needed it for and said no one asked for manuals before... (double duh?) Now these guys are really really nice, I got a good stove, quick and good installation, good prices, and well they're very friendly and try to help. At least that's the impression I got, even after the stove was installed and they were paid (and technically could tell me to go to hell). He said he'll check about the manual, and email Bronpi to send him one if they don't have any in the stores. Now I already emailed Bronpi for one but didn't get an answer.

I need my manual to get to know a lot of things. One thing I mentioned to him was that the blower has a switch. However when the stove's hot enough the blower starts running whether it's switched on or not. He said it's got a thermostat. But it's not nice discovering things by surprise.

Other things, am I supposed to load wood north to south or east to west?

The damper of the flue is automatic too. There's a thick adjustable pin which is pressed inside when the door is closed and hence the damper closes. When you open the door the pin is released and the damper opens. I can adjust it so that the damper closes more, or less, when the door of the stove is closed.

I don't even know if my stove does that secondary burn thing I read about. How can I recognise whether it does it or not?

By the way, I read that thread on how to clean the glass with damp newspaper and ash. THANK YOU! I had been worrying and nearly gave myself tennis elbow scrubbing with a soft damp cloth and a little soap, and those brown stains wouldn't go! The newspaper/ash thing worked like magic, I wiped the stuff out within 30 seconds!

NewtownPA, hi! Are you a cypriot who emigrated? Where do you live now?