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My Options and outdoor furnace

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by 04HemiRam2500, Sep 19, 2013.

  1. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2013
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    Loc:
    NE Ohio
    Call your local city/county offices to ask to talk to the appropriate people, call your insurance guy, call the fire chief, call your local woodstove or HVAC shop. If you start asking around, people will point you in the right direction.

    Use treated lumber on/near the floor and bathroom grade drywall (greenboard I think?) it will take high moisture and then leave the bottom of the drywall 1/2" up off the concrete too.

    Any appliance in the basement are supposed to be up on blocks, at least an inch or two (or more if you have the headroom for it) This will keep them up out of the water for most "floods" especially since you have a basement door straight out to your lower garage, the water can't get too deep! This also allows for a little air flow under the appliance to keep it dry or to drain/dry out after a "flood"

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  2. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    Nova Scotia
    I would hazard a guess that your oil furnace being in the garage is a no-no as it is. Has your insurance company ever done an inspection?

    We can only help in generalities, and don't seem to be saying what you want to hear. We can't tell you what is code & not - if you want to be sure, get a local code person and get them to tell you. Sometimes it is not black & white but also interpretation. Same with insurance.

    You need to get over the oil tank hangup - it is holding you hostage. If they're only 1/4 full now, and you won't be filling them until next year - you definitely don't need three of them, and I would definitely consider getting rid of the oil all together (I broke my addiction last year & am very glad I did) & going with a gas/LP furnace for backup (officially primary) heat source as already suggested, or something electric. I would hazard a guess that a new furnace in the basement would be OK - because there you've got good vertical separation not possible with a garage install. But you need to verify locally. Plus having it there should keep your basement warm to help with the pipe freezing & moisture things, and the heat off it will rise into your house.
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  3. leon

    leon Member

    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2013
    Messages:
    130


    The National Electrical Code
    The National Plumbing Code

    Your local plumbing and electrical inspectors will explain all of this to you.
    Your insurer is also going want to have thier inspector look at this if they
    have rules for wood burning apliances. If they have no regulations with
    regard to wood and coal burning appliances the national code applies as
    far as I know.
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2013
  4. Gasifier

    Gasifier Minister of Fire

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    Loc:
    St. Lawrence River Valley, N.Y.
    You will have some hoops you have to jump through. It is all part of the fun. But, if you follow the code and insurance rules, take your time and do it right, you will be one happy camper heating with wood and saving money. Lovin it every time you feel that heat and know it is not from oil. Keeping your house a little warmer and not worrying about the oil bill.
  5. woodsmaster

    woodsmaster Minister of Fire

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    N.W. Ohio
    I had fuel oil heat when I was a kid and I hated it. Stinky, messy, unreliable. I will NEVER have it again if I can help it.
  6. brenndatomu

    brenndatomu Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2013
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    Loc:
    NE Ohio
    Wow, that doesn't sound like much fun! The only stink I ever remember having is from the oil if you spilled a bit during a filter change or bleedin the pump, it goes away after a day or two though. Messy? I suppose, if you have a leak or something. As far as reliability, ours was always as reliable as any other kind of heat.
    Hopefully, I will never have oil for anything other than backup heat again! Too daggum expensive!
    Wood heat rocks !! >>
  7. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
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    SW PA
    Okay after alot of consideration and verifying where to install the furnace. I have come to the conclusion and others have informed me as well that the only way to make the furnace work is to remove the oil tanks. I personally do not want to remove the oil tanks! Thus, I have researched and the decision is final. I am going with the Englander 30-NCH at the Home Depot. It says it is rated for 2200 square feet. However, I compared the size of the firebox and it is massive. For example, the Englander 30-NCH has a 3.62 cu ft firebox (on the home depot website I calculated 3.62 but the website says 3.5 cu ft) meanwhile the us stove that states it can heat 3000 square feet has a 3.709 cu ft firebox (on the home depot website I calculated 3.709 but the website says 3.0 cu ft). Anyhow, I think that rating for the Englander is well below what it can heat. I think that since I like it cooler in my house 65 68 max. I can use fans to heat my house well.

    Now on to where I am locating it. It will be in my 900 square foot game room near the hallway that leads to the two story part of my house. I am now looking at a built hearth pad to put it on.

    The problem that I am having now is whether or not to put the flue through the roof or the wall. Personally, I am thinking go through the wall. Here is why. My roof is a cathedral ceiling however, there is an air space between the ceiling studs and the actual roof plywood part etc. The gap is a good two feet. So, I would need to install one of those attic shields and because my roof is slanted. I would have to frame it out to make the flue go in flush with the ceiling. This is a pain in the but!! Instead, if I go out the wall then up and I am done. Also, more good news is that it will be about 12 to 13 feet away from the other roof of the two story part of the house. This means that I only need three feet up of chimney pipe. I will measure tomorrow to give you an exact measure to be sure!!

    So, here is my question!!!!!! If I put it through the wall it will come out and go up the side of the house. Since this is a one floor game room, the tee that is outside will be about 15 feet of the ground. Is this okay. I thought that the tee needs to be close to the ground because this is where you clean out the chimney no??? Therefore, am I allowed to do this? Lastly, I think that it is better to have most of the flue inside so can I put the flue going outside of the house near the top of the roof near the gutters? Let me know if you need pics to show you what I mean.

    Thanks again so much everyone can't wait to heat the house with wood for first time this winter!!
  8. Gasifier

    Gasifier Minister of Fire

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    PICS would help. If you can give us several pictures of inside and out. So your game room is not in the basement. Is that right? And you are not removing the oil tanks. Is that right? Just curious. Whatever you decide works best for you. I like the idea of going through the wall myself. I don't think putting holes through the roof is a good idea, but that is just me. They do make angling brackets for a roof install that hold the complete weight of your chimney and put the weight of your chimney right on your roof. But going through the wall makes it easier and you do not have to worry about a leak if everything on roof does not come out to be 100% waterproof. Let us know man!
  9. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

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    Okay, I will post pics shortly to show you what I mean. You are correct my game room is not in the basement and I am not removing the oil tanks. I am thinking about going through the wall for the reasons that you mentioned.

    My concern about going through the wall though is the hearth pad. The englander has t be 16 inches from the wall and it says that the hearth pad needs eight inches behind the stove. Although, I thought that the hearth had to go underneath the horizontal part of the flue going out the wall?
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2013
  10. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

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    SW PA
    I got a paper in from my travelers insurance it says that my stove has to be 36 inches from the wall!!

    Am I able to put double wall pipe and have the stove 8 inches from the wall. Or do I need to buy the side heat shields in order to get it that close to the wall?

    Or am I even allowed to do this with my home insurance.
  11. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    As has been said before - ask your insurance company.
  12. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

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    I asked company they said to install it according to the manual. I am thinking about installing the side heat shield anybody use them?
  13. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

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    After reviewing the manual I am a little confused about the clearance from the back of the stove to the wall. To get closer to the wall for the Englander I need to buy the side heat shields?
  14. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    I think you said they said it had to be 36 inches - didn't you?

    Then you also said they said to install per manual. So which is it?

    The manual (if I'm looking at the right one) says (side/rear/corner) is 20/14/15 no shields, 19/8/14 shields, and 20/5/15 shields & double wall connector.

    It also says later on that some local codes may requires 36" and to check with local officials - so we're back to ask your insurance company, AND local code people.

    I don't think anyone here wants to stick their neck out & tell you what your clearances should be, and you shouldn't likely take what anyone here would tell you & run with it - you don't want to be hung out to dry if you ever have any problems later.

    Think I'm out of this one now.

    (I'd still get rid of the tanks - sorry, couldn't resist.)
  15. 04HemiRam2500

    04HemiRam2500 Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    SW PA
    The insurance company said to follow the manual so that is what I am doing. However, I am confused with the rear clearance because a single wall flue pipe needs 18 inches thus 14 inches of the stove wont work. That is why I am confused if I buy just the shield how can I do 8 inches for the rear clearance?

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