Oak Ridge insert ?
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Late 70's or very early 80's steel box....not much different than the hundreds of other similar designs from back then.
No way it is EPA approved - those standards didn't exist back then.
In other words, depending on your choice of words it is either a Smoke Dragon or a Classic.
No way it is EPA approved - those standards didn't exist back then.
In other words, depending on your choice of words it is either a Smoke Dragon or a Classic.
hmm, dang; OK thanks, I am in the market but a ways off (in terms of miles and heating needs)from most of you all, it seems.
In my opinion, you should consider a small EPA unit so you burn clean, make as little smoke as possible and get the most out of your wood.
You can insert a small stove or insert into the fireplace...a small stove is likely to cost less. Although there may not be a lot of used stoves locally, you can buy some through hardware outlets or online.
Here is a little Drolet for $330 plus freight - it may fit into your fireplace as-is or with slight mods:
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200307387_200307387
Something like that would make your place toasty.
You can insert a small stove or insert into the fireplace...a small stove is likely to cost less. Although there may not be a lot of used stoves locally, you can buy some through hardware outlets or online.
Here is a little Drolet for $330 plus freight - it may fit into your fireplace as-is or with slight mods:
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200307387_200307387
Something like that would make your place toasty.
I don't mean to hijack the thread but is there a benefit to using a stove inside a fireplace as opposed to an insert? The stoves seem to be cheaper. Especially that one from northern tool.
Webmaster said:
I am still shopping for the perfect stove / insert for my purposes, and keep running into the EPA phrases that seem to contradict. Newer stoves and this site promote EPA compliant or approved stoves for the cleaner longer burns and less wood consumption. This site and members also endorse stoves like the Englander, an EPA exempt rated stove, while basically condemning the older model smoke dragon stoves (that, by the way, I can commonly buy for $100 or so, a percent of the $$ that posters, endorse while calling foul to consider the older stoves).
So, what is an EPA exempt stove that the older stoves are not, and what is the EPA approved stoves that the EPA exempts are not ? The Drolet suggested (above, by the webmaster) is in this gray area I'm talking of; I don't get it.
The EPA exempt 12FP is not often endorsed here. The other Englanders like the 13NC, 30NC, and 13NCi are EPA certified.
No grey area with Drolet either. They make EPA certified stoves and a few exempt stoves. Exempt stoves have no primary air control, no secondary combustion technology and burn dirty and fast. If you are going to buy a EPA exempt stove you might as well just go ahead and buy an old steel stove off of craigslist. Or the one I hauled out to the back 40 three years ago to use as the firebox for a meat smoker.
I was just referring to the Drolet suggested by webmaster (above), and it is an exempt model, I was not clear on the EPA wording; it is almost a deception when EPA is even mentioned in stove ads, ya know ? What is a 35 to 1 stove ? I have searched this site for such questions as I have but can't find this info specifically.
Yeah manufacturers shouldn't even mention EPA if the stove isn't certified as it is deceptive. Stoves that won't let you cut the air fuel ratio back below 35 to 1 are exempt for the certification requirement since it is believed that they can't be choked down and burn dirty. What they do is burn hot and fast. There is only one exempt stove that I know of that even has an air control. Most can only be somewhat controlled by a damper in the stove pipe.
BroB touched on it, but I will go a little further on your question. A 35:1 stove refers to the air ratio that is pretty much "fixed" for the stove. Basically non adjustable, unlike the EPA certified stoves that ARE adjustable.
Stay away from 35:1 stoves. They are a real wood burners nightmare. But the epa stoves from some of the same MFG (such as Englander, Drolet, etc.) make some great bang for your buck stoves that have all the same Certification that the expensive stoves have (and in some cases actually beat the big dollar ones in output and particulate emissions).
Stay away from 35:1 stoves. They are a real wood burners nightmare. But the epa stoves from some of the same MFG (such as Englander, Drolet, etc.) make some great bang for your buck stoves that have all the same Certification that the expensive stoves have (and in some cases actually beat the big dollar ones in output and particulate emissions).
It appears that any stove under $700 is not an EPA approved, just from my search anyways. Some of the ads even list price of stove WITHOUT THE DOOR, which is another 300.
burr said:
Some stoves have "door options" so that could be part of that logic. That being said, if you are in the $700 dollar market, your best bet is going to be finding a good used stove. You are correct, there ain't much out there in the new market in the 700 buck range that is worth beans.
burr said:
I know this is resurrecting an old thread, but just wanted to say I own one of these. It was made in 1982 by a subsidiary of Lennox.
It is most definitely a 'smoke dragon' but I can get this old beast burning quite well with a 25-ft two-side exposed dual-flue masonary chimney with no direct connection.
Yes I am most definitely on the EPA no-no list, but after the initial loading time, leaving the door cracked and air controls wide open until logs are charred I can get a 10-hr burn time from a full box of seasoned oak.
It was full of creosote when I bought it from CL for $150, but one good hot burn of seasoned oak and she was like new.
It's built like a Sherman tank, and about as enviromentally friendly as one
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