Profile 20 and GFCI

[strapac]

My Profile 20 is approximately four years old and in the last week it has been tripping the GFCI. The stove runs fine when I initially start it and it will properly shut down after it reaches the setting on the thermostat. The problem occurs when it relights the second time. The stove will run for a minutes and then trip the GFCI. I have replaced the GFCI and checked the grounds. Could the problem be in the pressure or high limit switches. I replaced both last year. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.

 

[pkitfox]

I am not an expert on pellet stoves, but I will give you my thoughts on the problem.

The fact that it runs though a on/off cycle successfully and then fails on the next cycle is a bit confusing. Looking at the owners manual, it says that it does not feed pellets for the first minute during startup, so if I am looking at this correctly, then yes, the high limit or pressure switch could have something to do with the problem. Neither come into play until the control board outputs control voltage to the auger motor. The pressure switch and high limit switch, or switches, shown on PG 32 of the online manual show this. The one minute till malfunction is key I believe.

If I understand the problem, and have interpreted the owners manual information correctly, I am definitely thinking the problem is in the auger CTK. Why it works one time, I would tend to think may just be FM, as is often said in my trade.

If you changed the switchs yourself, then proving where the trouble is may not be that difficult. Get the stove in a condition that you are expecting a failure. disconnect components in the auger CKT one at a time and see if it makes it past where it would normally have tripped the GFCI. I would think you could even bypass the switches for troubleshooting purposes.

One other thing. Make sure all of the connections in the CKT are clean and any dust or ash is removed to eliminate any current path to the stove (or the mechanical ground).

This is an interesting problem, let me know what you find. I hope this was some help...Jim

 

[pkitfox]

I guess I should have mentioned, if wires are disconnected for troubleshooting, make sure they are taped to prevent shorting. Secure them if there is there is any possibility that they could be caught in moving parts or burned.

 

[strapac]

Thank you for the ideas. I'll try them today after our burn ban is lifted here in Western Washington. Also, I noticed that Lennox is shipping out new power cords for stoves like mine. Apparently, they were having probelms (bad grounds, neutrals, etc.) so I'm having one shipped. I'll let you know what happens.

 

[drizler]

If it was me the first thing I would do is lose the GFI. It took me a while but after I had them for a couple years I came to appreciate why people hate them. Oh yea, I had a brownout from a cheap Coleman Generator once and it caught one on fire. That's just another of a long line of reasons. If you don't want to get electrocuted don't blow dry your hair in the bath tub but I don't see much of a threat from a pellet stove. Just my $.02 worth but a lot of this safety stuff causes more harm than good.

 

[Dr_Drum]

There is a very good chance it's just the GFCI. A GFCI is just a circuit breaker. An electrical engineer I work with told me a circuit breaker that has been tripped even a few times should be replaced? Doubt I'd do that, but they definitely have a lifespan. Maybe just swap it for another in the house as a test?
Mike -

Nevermind, reread your post, you already replaced. Often one GFCI protects several downstream outlets, anything else being protected on that circuit?

 

[seige101]

If it was me the first thing I would do is lose the GFI. It took me a while but after I had them for a couple years I came to appreciate why people hate them. Oh yea, I had a brownout from a cheap Coleman Generator once and it caught one on fire. That's just another of a long line of reasons. If you don't want to get electrocuted don't blow dry your hair in the bath tub but I don't see much of a threat from a pellet stove. Just my $.02 worth but a lot of this safety stuff causes more harm than good.

Try the newer ones, they nuisance tripping is virtually eliminated. If it trips there is a small voltage leak to ground somewhere..

To the OP if they are shipping out new power cords, that probably the issue right there, sounds like the ground and neutral could be touching inside the cord and causing the gfi to trip. Also where is your stove located, that it is protected by a GFI. Depending on the location and the wiring you could move a GFI to another outlet and still have the protection needed/required.

Dr drum, breakers tripped from an overload condition are usually ok. It's breakers that trip from a fault condition (hot to ground direct) that should be replaced. Traditional breakers aren't effected as much, however the new arc fault and gfi breakers don't like fault current, and may not reset if they are subjected to it.


Your friendly Hearth.com Electrician.

 

[pkitfox]

If it was me the first thing I would do is lose the GFI. It took me a while but after I had them for a couple years I came to appreciate why people hate them. Oh yea, I had a brownout from a cheap Coleman Generator once and it caught one on fire. That's just another of a long line of reasons. If you don't want to get electrocuted don't blow dry your hair in the bath tub but I don't see much of a threat from a pellet stove. Just my $.02 worth but a lot of this safety stuff causes more harm than good.

I have to admit to doing this myself, but it was on initial installation of new equipment. The GFI BKR, powered equipment, and wiring were changed out in a shotgun attempt to clear the problem (we had spares). The GFI still kept operating when power was applied. We eventually replaced the GFCI BKR with a regular 20 amp BKR. Not that it matters, but the problem was on a sonar water level transmitter in the forebay of a hydro electric plant, but not in procimity to the water. I know that doesn't make any sense.

I don't know why you would have a GFCI on a pellet stove. Maybe someone else might.

About eliminating the GFCI. In this case, the stove has apparently operated on this CKT for some time without any problems. There must be something that has changed to cause the GFCI to operate. If The mechanical ground of the CKT is checked for integrity, and the pellet stove chassis connection to the mechanical is verified, then I might think about eliminating the GFI, but I would feel uneasy about recommending it to someone else. After all, a safety device is detecting a problem. If equipment is manufactured with inherent high resistance continuity from "hot" to ground, or neutral to ground, a GFI will not work to begin with. I don't think that is the case here.

 

[cantman]

Remove the GFI and replace with a regular outlet/circuit breaker. Does your local building code require a GFI
on this type of appliance? As motors age, they become electrically "leaky". GIF"s act wierd with motors and If not required,
I would remove the GFI protected circuit.

 

[MCPO]

A pellet stove is IMO one of the appliances where a GFCI should not be used.
Of course in a basement the code requires all outlets be GFCI but like a sump pump it should be excluded since an interruption could cause frozen pipes and / or a loss of heat.
I use only a surge protector .