Replacing old wood insert with quadrafire Pellet insert?

[Draker]

Hello! I'm new here and just stumbled across these forums while researching how to replace my wood insert. I bought a quadrafire Classic bay 1200 insert used thinking I could just slide the old one out and slide the new one in.

The old wood stove looks like it was home made almost.. It performed very very poorly and that's the reason for me replacing it. It was likey built in 1978-1979 when he house was built. I got the wood stove removed but it looks like there is a sheet metal shell installed behind it. I will work on getting a picture posted for everyone to see what I'm talking about.

The other thing is, I thing the shell was installed when the brick installed around it. So I can't just pull it out.. I'd likely have to cut it out I'm guessing?

Pics will be posted in next post.

 

[Draker]

Here are the pictures.

 

[DexterDay]

It looks masonry. But almost looks like a Pre Fab unit?

The Classic Bay is a Hell of a heater. . Your gonna love it.

Is there brick behind the metal pieces in the fireplace? ?

 

[Draker]

Let me explain what I've got here.. or at least what I think I've got. lol

The chimney on the outside of the house is 3 sided and wood on the 4th side which is the side of the house. There is a metal pipe that runs up the chimney and is connected to the sheet metal that you see in the pictures. I've already removed the fireplace insert, it was made of steel and was super heavy! lol If you guys want to see a picture of the stove I removed I can make that happen. I've also removed the large white bricks that were on the bottom of the self you see in the pictures and there was another one on the back wall.

What it looks like to me is the sheet metal in the back was installed in there and then the brick was installed on the front sealing it all in there. I know if I can removed the shelf that sits about 4 inches up I could probably put the bottom white brick piece back in and slide the new insert in then run a pipe up the existing wood pipe. I really like to do things the right way though.. that's why I'm here!

I was going to go take the pictures to a few fireplaces shops around town and see if they had any insight as well.

 

[Draker]

bump

 

[DAKSY]

Looks to me like you have a ZC fireplace that was installed at the time of the house construction.
Generally speaking what you want to do is a good idea for getting a more efficient burn & getting heat out of that burn, but you may be taking a BIG chance here. Somewhere in that fireplace that you have removed was a manufacturer & a model number, on a tag. The older units had paper tags & they usually got destroyed by the first couple of fires. Later units had stamped metal tags applied to them. Anyway, what you have left in there may not be safe to use in the manner you wish to use it. The amount of heat given off from your existing set up was negligible & the clearance to combustibles (CTC) in the firebox area may be as little as 1/2" & to the chimney as little as 2". The only way to verify the CTC values, & whether or not an efficient wood or pellet burning unit can be installed within the existing shell, is by the info in that tag, unless you have the original install manual. Check the CTC on your insert. I'm willing to bet that they are much more than the ZC Box. Also, I'm pretty sure the liner you're going to need has a CTC of 3", but you may be able to minimize that by wrapping it with an insulating blanket. Having said all this, you might better talk to the code enforcement officer in your area. He has the final say-so on an install of this type. I don't want to disillusion you, as you have done a LOT of work and have already purchased the Quad, but facts are facts & safety is of the UTMOST importance when you put fire in your home. I've said it before & I'll say it again: Fire will do one of two things. It will HEAT your home, or it will EAT your home. It doesn't care about you. It just wants fuel to burn.

 

[Draker]

Thank you for the reply. I will be talking to some people here locally just to get a better idea.

I should post up some pictures of the insert I removed. I can assure you it wasn't a ZC fireplace. I don't know if maybe the previous owner removed a ZC and installed the fireplace I removed. The fireplace I removed was an insert that hung out the front similar to how the quad will do. It stepped up though as to clear the shelf that you see in the pictures. Also, after removing the fireplace that was installed... I would be much less worried about a fire with the quad as the old wood insert was pretty scary.. There was tons of ash and creosote built up between the insert and the metal liner. It could have been ugly had it caught fire.

As for the label, there was nothing on the fireplace I removed. There was a serial number written on a piece of the liner material I removed though. I might have to call in some people to take a look and tell me what I've got going on here.

 

[Draker]

So I went over and talked to a stove shop here locally. Conveniently there is a store right across the street from my work. I showed them the pictures and asked what he would recommend. First off, the stove I removed wasn't a ZC wood stove.. but the firebox is in fact (as mentioned above) for a ZC insert. The previous owners must have removed it for one reason or another and installed this led weight of stove insert.

Second, I asked if I could use the stove and what recommended to install it. The guys at the store simply said, I could either get a riser for the stove that would mount it on the shelf OR just cut it out. Since he sells the Quad 1200 insert he just grabbed the manual and thumbed through it.. sure enough it shows step by step how to remove the shelf (sawsall) and complete the install. Yes, I know RTFM!! lol

To my defense I didn't have the printed manual... but I do now! So the rest of the install should go smoothly now that I have something to go by. I'm just glad that I am going to be able to use the quad. I've heard good things!

I'll be sure to post up some more pictures. I hope this thread will help others that might run into this same situation when installing their insert.

 

[Draker]

Got abut more work done on this. Followed the install manual and chopped out the shelf. Then I relocated the power outlet.

Going to cut the lower fire insulator brick down about 1 inch so it will fit in the bottom tray. Might have to shim it up a bit to be flush With the bricks.

Sorry for the poor pictures.. I figure bad pics are better than no pics.

 

[DemonGT]

did you ever finish your install?

 

[Draker]

Yes! I have been trying to work out some bugs with the stove. It was a pain in the butt getting the piping installed.. and I am having some chimney issues.. more with the crown leaking but I'm working that out as well. Getting a huge metal chase cap built so I can stop worrying about water damage.

I just snapped these pictures.

 

[DemonGT]

that looks nice, how is the stove heating for you?

 

[Draker]

It heats good! I need to do some work on the insulation in my attic though. It's strange, the house will be nice and warm downstairs and gets colder upstairs. You would think it would be the opposite. I know there are plenty of bare spots in the attic where there is no insulation blown in. I am going to get up there one of these days and pack it full of insulation.

Overall though, it's very nice. If I leave it on all day it will cycle on and off and keep the house comfortable.

 

[tjnamtiw]

I had problems with leakage on my crown also. I used Crown Seal. It's not cheap but it works! Follow the directions.
Stove looks great. Good job!

 

[Draker]

Rather than sealing the crown I am having a sheet metal chase cap made. This will cover the entire crown and shore up under the chimney cap. It will also have a drip edge to keep the water from running down the side of the chimney.

I figured after this I won't have to think about if the crown or seal or anything is holding up.. It will just be capped off. I tried having a company come out and remove the crown and pour anouther one.. they came out 3 times and it was a disaster.. I ended up telling them thanks for nothing and since it was not fixed they were not paid. They made a complete mess of my brand new roof too.. it was terrible. Maybe once I get the cap I'll snap a few pictures.

 

[tjnamtiw]

Rather than sealing the crown I am having a sheet metal chase cap made. This will cover the entire crown and shore up under the chimney cap. It will also have a drip edge to keep the water from running down the side of the chimney.

I figured after this I won't have to think about if the crown or seal or anything is holding up.. It will just be capped off. I tried having a company come out and remove the crown and pour anouther one.. they came out 3 times and it was a disaster.. I ended up telling them thanks for nothing and since it was not fixed they were not paid. They made a complete mess of my brand new roof too.. it was terrible. Maybe once I get the cap I'll snap a few pictures.

Pictures would be great as I don't relish going back up there to check every year or so (69 yr old here). After three times of having those idiots up on your roof, I'm surprised to didn't get them back down with a load of bird shot.

 

[Draker]

I just wanted to follow up. It's been 2 years or so and the pellet stove is still running great. The cap I installed on the chimney is working like a charm. Perfectly happy.

the upstairs is still a little on the cold side. Sometimes I turn on the fan for our central air and let it just circulate the heat. Works pretty good.

I never did get pictures of the crown cap. But it looks similar to this one. (Not my house)

Although on this one it looks like it doesn't have beads rolled in it and water is building up on the cap.. If I remember I'll grab pictures next time I'm up there.

 

[Draker]

I've been considering finding another standup pellet stove to heat my garage. That would be so nice in the winter!!