Stove selection and location
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So that brings up a question that has been burning (weak pun intended) in my mind, Hogwildz. I have gotten the impression from several forum threads that if a draft is too strong, it will result in lower burn times, since so much heat is rushing up the chimney. You're saying that you have really strong draft, but I have also read some of your posts where you have said that you have gotten as long as 14-16 hr burns.
So is my impression that an overly strong draft can be bad for burn times incorrect? Should I simply be looking to get as good of a draft as possible?
So is my impression that an overly strong draft can be bad for burn times incorrect? Should I simply be looking to get as good of a draft as possible?
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
An overly strong draft can cause a quicker, hotter burn. I have a strong draft, but nothing that I have the need to add a damper or anything. Some don't realize that while most newer stoves do not have the capacity to fully close the air down, the amount of air that is allowed to flow at fully closed air intake, is not a lot. Better to have a strong draft, than weak one. Both have possible remedies, but IMO too strong a draft is more rare, and more easily taken care of, than a weak draft, which usually involves raising the stack height to remedy.
I would go for the best chance at a good draft as possible, and if in the rare occurrence it is truly too strong, deal with the issue then. Adding additional height to fix the issue is a PITA in my opinion. It works, but how high you need to go, how many support brackets you may need, visual appearance, along with the extra steps to cleaning if you clean from the top, is the PITA part.
Outdoor temps also effect draft, the colder it is outside, typically the stronger the draft.
How high are you guessing your stack height to be?
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Gotcha. So I should err on the side of strong draft. I think my stack will be in the range of 22-24' (measured to top of stove). I haven't yet dropped a line down the chimney to get an official measurement.
So will burn times, in general, be longest in the shoulder season? Since the draft will be weaker?
So will burn times, in general, be longest in the shoulder season? Since the draft will be weaker?
Burn time is often more affected by the house's heat requirements. This is much lower in shoulder seasons so yes typically the burn time will be longer in milder weather when the stove is not pressed for heat. However, often in shoulder seasons one is also loading less fuel into the stove due to the lower demand for BTUs.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
At those lengths, I don't think you'll have a sluggish, nor too strong a draft issue. That is a good height. I doubt you'll have either problem. I would either insulate or use pre-insulated.
Yes, the longest burn times will be during the early & later shoulder seasons, with lesser draft at higher outdoor temps & also due to less heat demand inside the home as the temps outside raise. And IMO, aslo due to less cooling effect on the stove, the load, the house & air. Your pulling as much heat you need during the dead of winter, but during spring & fall, your just taking the chill off, and not running the stove as hard also.
Wood species being burned & how large the splits you burn will play a major role in burn time length also.
Most typically burn softer woods & bastages, or irregular shaped pcs in the shoulder season, saving the hard wood, good stuff for the colder parts of the burning season.
She's here! Hard to believe. Will be installing her this weekend, if all goes well.
Question for the experts - is this the right stuff for insulating above the blockoff plate and around the liner at the top: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00OBXARVY/?tag=hearthamazon-20
Question for the experts - is this the right stuff for insulating above the blockoff plate and around the liner at the top: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00OBXARVY/?tag=hearthamazon-20
Do not use smoothwall flex if it is the 2ply stuff it is not very durable at all.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Get yourself some Roxul at Lowes. At $60.00 per 4sf, you're going to spend buku bucks on that stuff you linked too. If you're insulating the new liner, you don't need to stuff the top. Install a block off plate at the bottom and lay some Roxul or left over liner insulation on top of that.
So you guys (and other threads I read) scared me into getting a rigid liner. If I have trouble installing it, I'm holding you responsible... (kidding)
Anyone have experience with this IR gun: https://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Las...ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&pageNumber=3
Seems too cheap (18.99), but reviews are good and it works up to 1022 F.
Anyone have experience with this IR gun: https://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Las...ie=UTF8&reviewerType=all_reviews&pageNumber=3
Seems too cheap (18.99), but reviews are good and it works up to 1022 F.
NoGoodAtScreenNames
Feeling the Heat
I think that’s pretty close to the one I have (774) and no complaints. I think mine goes up to 800 or so - don’t ask me how I know where the high end caps out... when it says “Hi” I initiate the overfire protocol...
Stove is installed and running! I’ll take some pics sometime this weekend and post. I wanted to say thanks to BeGreen for telling me about the Enviro stoves – I wouldn’t have one if he hadn’t, to Hogwildz for help related to PE stoves and for help with the liner, and to NotGoodAtScreenNames for help specific to the Enviro Boston. Without your help, I wouldn’t have the stove I have or the liner I ended up with. I am very happy with both of them.
Also, a general thanks to everyone else on the forum for being so willing to answer questions! I’ve learned a lot from questions other people have asked which have been thoroughly answered. As this thread closes, I’m going to start a thread for questions specific to the Enviro Boston and Kodiak stoves. Several other stoves have similar threads, and I’ve found them to be very helpful (I came close to buying a Jotul C550 Rockland, but ended up not buying it because of the Rockland thread – great stove, but wasn’t going to fit our needs). There don't seem to be as many Enviro stove owners as BlazeKing, PE, Jotul, etc owners, but I think there are probably enough that we can help each other. Hopefully we can concentrate information specific to our stoves, which will be helpful for current owners of Enviro stoves as well as for any prospective buyers.
Alright, I'm logging off to go fire up the stove!
Also, a general thanks to everyone else on the forum for being so willing to answer questions! I’ve learned a lot from questions other people have asked which have been thoroughly answered. As this thread closes, I’m going to start a thread for questions specific to the Enviro Boston and Kodiak stoves. Several other stoves have similar threads, and I’ve found them to be very helpful (I came close to buying a Jotul C550 Rockland, but ended up not buying it because of the Rockland thread – great stove, but wasn’t going to fit our needs). There don't seem to be as many Enviro stove owners as BlazeKing, PE, Jotul, etc owners, but I think there are probably enough that we can help each other. Hopefully we can concentrate information specific to our stoves, which will be helpful for current owners of Enviro stoves as well as for any prospective buyers.
Alright, I'm logging off to go fire up the stove!
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Haha so confession time... my install isn't exactly up to code yet, so I'm holding off on posting pics until it is. I'm hoping to avoid the collective wrath of hearth.com.
Right now I'm using a piece of sheet metal on top of leftover liner insulation as a hearth extender, until the extender I bought online arrives. Also, I have some wood facing on the sides and above the stove that just barely exceeds the facing requirements. The requirement is that it protrude less than 0.75". It is 0.875" thick. Right now I am shielding it with some more of the leftover liner insulation. I have been religiously monitoring the temperature of the wood facing with an IR gun. The hottest it has gotten is 130 F. It only gets a little hotter than my mantel, which meets clearance requirements. At this point, I think my makeshift shielding is doing the trick, but I am planning on making some "official" heat shields out of sheet metal and spacing them off of the facing.
Right now I'm using a piece of sheet metal on top of leftover liner insulation as a hearth extender, until the extender I bought online arrives. Also, I have some wood facing on the sides and above the stove that just barely exceeds the facing requirements. The requirement is that it protrude less than 0.75". It is 0.875" thick. Right now I am shielding it with some more of the leftover liner insulation. I have been religiously monitoring the temperature of the wood facing with an IR gun. The hottest it has gotten is 130 F. It only gets a little hotter than my mantel, which meets clearance requirements. At this point, I think my makeshift shielding is doing the trick, but I am planning on making some "official" heat shields out of sheet metal and spacing them off of the facing.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
I thought someone was back for a minute there.....
That's one of the nicest looking inserts available. Yup, hearth protection of R=1.19 or greater is needed for this installation.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
NoGoodAtScreenNames
Feeling the Heat
Looks good in there.
Quick observation. Looks like you have some dirty glass on the bottom left and you air is choked all the way down. With the air down that much you should be getting almost nothing but secondary burn assuming your wood is good and dry and the glass should stay clean.
Also how are you tucking the cord under the front? Is the “hearth” a little lower than the fireplace?
Quick observation. Looks like you have some dirty glass on the bottom left and you air is choked all the way down. With the air down that much you should be getting almost nothing but secondary burn assuming your wood is good and dry and the glass should stay clean.
Also how are you tucking the cord under the front? Is the “hearth” a little lower than the fireplace?
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NGASN - I’m not sure why we’re getting dirty glass. That’s actually a question I was going to post. We’ve been getting totally unexpected amazing burn times (twice I’ve been able to do a hot reload after 12 hrs), which I thought indicates that we have pretty good wood. But then the dirty glass indicates that we may have wet wood, right? So which is it? They only thing that I can think of is that we have let the stove go out two or three times (due to warm weather), and so when it goes out, I would assume that at some point the temperature drops below the creosote temperature, which would result in some dirty glass?
I couldn’t figure out what to do with the cord at first, since it comes out on the left hand side and I need to plug it in on the right. The manual says to tuck it under the front, but I couldn’t fit it. I ended up just raising the front with the leveling screws until it would fit.
I couldn’t figure out what to do with the cord at first, since it comes out on the left hand side and I need to plug it in on the right. The manual says to tuck it under the front, but I couldn’t fit it. I ended up just raising the front with the leveling screws until it would fit.
Early (maybe too early) review on the stove:
So far the stove/house/chimney performance (I guess it’s all related) has majorly exceeded our expectations. I thought we’d be dealing with really significant temperature swings. It seems like at least on a weekly basis someone points out on hearth.com the temperature swings that come with the territory when you buy a tube stove. However, we’ve been able to fairly reliably control the temperature in the stove room.
In addition to expecting temperature swings, I thought we’d be dealing with significant hot/cool zones in our house. The main floor of our 2 story colonial is divided in half with only a single doorway allowing air flow. I figured this would be a major choke point, and that we would have a pretty significant temp difference between the two regions of the main floor, and then between the main floor and the upstairs. Small sample size so far… but we’ve been able to limit the temperature difference to a little over 10 degrees (using the hearth.com approved method of a fan blowing cold air from the non-stove region to the stove region). The stove half of the main floor averages around 80, the other half of the main floor averages in the low 70’s, and the upstairs seems to stay around 68. Maybe this will be much harder to maintain once it gets significantly colder?
The other thing I didn’t realize was the difference between dry heat and humid heat. I was worried we’d end up with a stove room that was uncomfortably warm. However, I’ve realized that I find a dry 80 degrees to be pleasant, whereas I would find a typical 80 degree summer day to be unpleasant.
Finally, the burn times we’ve gotten have exceeded our expectations. Enviro claims 8-12 hr burns, but other Boston/Kodiak owners told me that 12 hr burns were unlikely. So far, we’ve had two burns after which I was able to reload without kindling 12 hours later (stove was about 250 or a bit less both times). Could just be a difference in how people classify burn times, but this is what we were looking for, and so we’re really happy!
Hopefully this is helpful for someone else who has little/no experience with wood stoves, and has some of the same concerns we did.
So far the stove/house/chimney performance (I guess it’s all related) has majorly exceeded our expectations. I thought we’d be dealing with really significant temperature swings. It seems like at least on a weekly basis someone points out on hearth.com the temperature swings that come with the territory when you buy a tube stove. However, we’ve been able to fairly reliably control the temperature in the stove room.
In addition to expecting temperature swings, I thought we’d be dealing with significant hot/cool zones in our house. The main floor of our 2 story colonial is divided in half with only a single doorway allowing air flow. I figured this would be a major choke point, and that we would have a pretty significant temp difference between the two regions of the main floor, and then between the main floor and the upstairs. Small sample size so far… but we’ve been able to limit the temperature difference to a little over 10 degrees (using the hearth.com approved method of a fan blowing cold air from the non-stove region to the stove region). The stove half of the main floor averages around 80, the other half of the main floor averages in the low 70’s, and the upstairs seems to stay around 68. Maybe this will be much harder to maintain once it gets significantly colder?
The other thing I didn’t realize was the difference between dry heat and humid heat. I was worried we’d end up with a stove room that was uncomfortably warm. However, I’ve realized that I find a dry 80 degrees to be pleasant, whereas I would find a typical 80 degree summer day to be unpleasant.
Finally, the burn times we’ve gotten have exceeded our expectations. Enviro claims 8-12 hr burns, but other Boston/Kodiak owners told me that 12 hr burns were unlikely. So far, we’ve had two burns after which I was able to reload without kindling 12 hours later (stove was about 250 or a bit less both times). Could just be a difference in how people classify burn times, but this is what we were looking for, and so we’re really happy!
Hopefully this is helpful for someone else who has little/no experience with wood stoves, and has some of the same concerns we did.
Glad to hear it's working out well for you so far. As for whether or not you have wet wood, pick up a moisture meter from HD or other hardware store, they're pretty cheap. Wet wood is typically the most likely scenario for dirty glass, especially for first-year burners, but not always either. You're bound to have to clean the glass every once in awhile throughout the season.
We don't get huge temperature swings either unless it's planned, such as letting the room cool down on a warmer day. The room my insert is in is typically between 75-80, and you're right, 80 in the winter time with the insert feels pretty good!
As it gets colder, how hard it is to maintain the temperatures you see today will depend on how well the house is insulated. Your burn times might get shorter if you need more heat output to maintain the temps and/or the furthest areas might be a little cooler due to heat loss along the way. For us, there isn't a whole lot of difference in burn times or temp differences, we just reload on a larger coal bed than this time of year.
We don't get huge temperature swings either unless it's planned, such as letting the room cool down on a warmer day. The room my insert is in is typically between 75-80, and you're right, 80 in the winter time with the insert feels pretty good!
As it gets colder, how hard it is to maintain the temperatures you see today will depend on how well the house is insulated. Your burn times might get shorter if you need more heat output to maintain the temps and/or the furthest areas might be a little cooler due to heat loss along the way. For us, there isn't a whole lot of difference in burn times or temp differences, we just reload on a larger coal bed than this time of year.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
The glass could be as simple as when you load north to south, the splits offgas against the glass. The closer the split ends are to the glass, the more it happens. Glass doesn't look that bad. You can also cool the stove down and door a the dollar test around the door and make sure it is not leaking air anywhere, especially where the glass is getting dirty.
Don't go too nuts loading before the coals are burnt down, or you will end up with a shitload of coals piling up, taking away from room to load the new load.
Temperature swings are more noticeable in the colder days/night. Although everyone has different temp situations. On the colder nights, I might get about 5 -8 degree temp swing, not a big deal for me. That's just me of course. I don't like it 80 degrees, too hot for me.
Start researching humidifiers, the warmer feeling dry heat is nice, until you start getting static shocks everytime you touch something or someone. Well, some may like that...
I found a console works great for me.
Don't go too nuts loading before the coals are burnt down, or you will end up with a shitload of coals piling up, taking away from room to load the new load.
Temperature swings are more noticeable in the colder days/night. Although everyone has different temp situations. On the colder nights, I might get about 5 -8 degree temp swing, not a big deal for me. That's just me of course. I don't like it 80 degrees, too hot for me.
Start researching humidifiers, the warmer feeling dry heat is nice, until you start getting static shocks everytime you touch something or someone. Well, some may like that...
I found a console works great for me.
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