switch to steel?

  • Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.

    We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.

    We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
Status
Not open for further replies.

dstover

Member
Hearth Supporter
Jan 21, 2010
41
south central Washington
Hubby and I burn wood at least 7 months a year, and go through up to 10 cords of mostly fir with occasional pine and cherry. Our house is 1800 square feet, and the only other heat sources are a couple of baseboards that we rarely use. It is an open-floor plan with a ceiling fan but no blower on the stove. SW Washington is fairly mild climate but we live at 2300' elevation so we get more snow and cold than most in our area.

Our house came with an old, huge Frontier(?) steel stove that had a crack in it, made visible by flames inside. That scared us. About 15 years ago we replaced that with a Waterford cast-iron stove. We opted for a non-cat because we were newbies, and for cast iron because we liked the looks.

We have never been all that happy with our Waterford, which is probably a bit too small for our space and doesn't hold a good overnight burn with the soft (but well-seasoned) woods we're burning. Also, we haven't maintained the stove well, so right now we have a cracked firebrick, poor circulation, a bent clip on the window glass, some chipped enamel, etc. etc. Haven't replaced the baffle either. Probably why we are getting poor performance! But as I said we've never been thrilled with this stove's performance, although it was admittedly better in years past.

The tax credit is making us wonder whether we should replace our stove this year instead of overhauling it. Esp. since Waterford is out of business and we may have trouble getting parts? It would be really nice to be able to leave home for the day (we both work at home so we don't do that usually) and come back to a warm house.

Should we be looking at steel stoves this time around? I've heard good things about Lopi, which is the brand we were considering way back when we decided on cast iron instead. Back then my research suggested that there weren't many performance differences between iron and steel, and that iron might have an advantage in being easier to replace individual parts and less risk of getting the stove dangerously hot. Our original steel stove was not only cracked but also warped in the back, which really gave us pause about steel, even though we weren't the ones who caused that.

We try to be safety- and energy-conscious. We installed double-wall pipe when we bought our Waterford, and a couple of years ago we installed an air intake pipe into our crawl space to try to reduce draftiness. But the intake pipe seems to have interfered with our damper so it doesn't shut 100% anymore. Possibly another reason I'm giving the Waterford bad marks.

I'd love to hear some feedback about steel vs. cast iron. We still like the look of our cast iron but we're willing to sacrifice looks for something more practical if that's the choice we have to make. Judging by our lousy maintenance track record with a non-cat stove, we probably shouldn't get a cat, right?

The brands available here include Lopi, Jotul, Pacific Energy and Quadrafire. They all seem to have their adherents, but we will probably go with Lopi if we opt for steel. Our neighbor swears by his Blaze King, but I bet there's a downside to that super-long burn time, isn't there? And I'm not thrilled with the look of the BK.
 
Oh please dont start that debate. Anyone with a cast stove will say its the way to go and the other way also.
 
Greetings, heck we don't need heat when it's 60 outside.

Travis makes good stoves under the Lopi and Avalon brand. They would be a good choice. If you want to have the castiron look with a heart of steel, I can vouch for the Pacific Energy Alderlea series. Our T6 is a pleasure to run.

Outside of the BK, another cat stove that is popular with forum members is the Woodstock Fireview. The downside is that it would have to be shipped from VT, but with rebates might still be worth looking at. And last, I wouldn't give up on cast iron if the only issue is stove size. A Jotul Oslo might do you very well.
 
dstover said:
The brands available here include Lopi, Jotul, Pacific Energy and Quadrafire. They all seem to have their adherents, but we will probably go with Lopi if we opt for steel. Our neighbor swears by his Blaze King, but I bet there's a downside to that super-long burn time, isn't there? And I'm not thrilled with the look of the BK.


Those are all fine choices.

And you already touched on the downside of the Blaze King, the looks. You Either like the looks or you don't. If you can get past the looks every Blaze King owner on this forum raves about the stove.
 
BeGreen said:
Greetings, heck we don't need heat when it's 60 outside.

Travis makes good stoves under the Lopi and Avalon brand. They would be a good choice. If you want to have the castiron look with a heart of steel, I can vouch for the Pacific Energy Alderlea series. Our T6 is a pleasure to run.

Outside of the BK, another cat stove that is popular with forum members is the Woodstock Fireview. The downside is that it would have to be shipped from VT, but with rebates might still be worth looking at. And last, I wouldn't give up on cast iron if the only issue is stove size. A Jotul Oslo might do you very well.


If you buy from Woodstock right now shipping to the state of Washington is only $175 for thru March 31th.
 
Go get ya a Lopi Liberty and don't look back. Today's steel stoves will kick a cast stove's butt on every performance factor. Failing that, get the PE stove.

Steel stoves rule.

Outside of that, I have no opinion. :cheese:
 
to interject, Lopi is a wonderfull stove.. get it and its a happy guarantee.
 
Steel plate or cast iron...it's really just a matter of preference. There many perfectly fine stoves of both types available that will get the job done for you. Soapstone too, for that matter. They're all just woodburning space heaters. All the subleties of "soft heat" vs. what, "hard heat"?, and time to start/stop radiating, and such are...IMO, just that...subtleties. Differences in appearance are significant, and purely a matter of personal preference. Some folks really want a stove that "fits" a specific decor, other folks are utilitarian minimalists...whatever floats your boat. Find the stove that pleases you the most and learn to burn it...be it plate, cast, or stone, or hybrid. Rick
 
Thanks for all the recommendations! So nobody here thinks I should try to resuscitate my Waterford Trinity MKII? At this very moment it is working perfectly (thank goodness, because my husband is the main fire tender and he is out of town), but air doesn't seem to circulate well most of the time. And I have to clean the glass almost every day now. It is usually 20s and 30s here in the winter but occasionally down in single digits so we cannot afford to have a temperamental stove as our main (practically only) heat source.

I clean my stovepipe every year but the Trinity owner's manual came with NO instructions for maintenance. So until recently I didn't even realize I was supposed to replace the fire bricks. I just noticed the cracked one. And the grate that covers the ash drop is pretty bent.

The firebox on the Trinity is really small compared with our last stove so maybe we just need something bigger. It's tough to get much wood in there for an overnight burn when the manual says the wood can't touch the baffle and it shouldn't be split for a long burn. That only leaves room for one log...
 
The Trinity has served you faithfully and well. Give it a decent burial.
 
dstover said:
...the manual says the wood can't touch the baffle and it shouldn't be split for a long burn. That only leaves room for one log...

That right there is some pretty questionable guidance. Pretty tough to get an unsplit 24" diameter round into any stove...let alone the 20-year required seasoning time. I'd say that part of the manual could have used a bit more work...statements like that can be very misleading. If you have some seasoned, unsplit rounds in the 2"-4" range, fine, if not, fill the box with what you've got in a way that uses the available volume. Staying clear of the baffle, yes...nothing but rounds, no. Rick
 
dstover said:
So nobody here thinks I should try to resuscitate my Waterford Trinity MKII? burn.

No! A new EPA stove will give you more heat while using much less wood. Outside of one of our member's obsession with steel stoves, any of the suggestions you've been given would be a good choice. I wouldn't worry about getting a cat stove. I have run both cat and non-cat and in some ways, the cat is actually easier to run.
 
Girl friend, suck it up and get a new stove. Ye shall be happy & warm. Which ever one you like, will be the one you love.

Make sure you have dry, seasoned wood.

My 2 cents.

Welcome to the fourms !!! Always nice to see another fire gal pal around here !!! ;-) We need all the help we can get !!
 
wendell said:
Outside of one of our member's obsession with steel stoves,

That would be the guy that owns two cast iron stoves and one steel stove. ;-)
 
Our wood is all split and nicely seasoned. We ignored the instruction manual telling us not to use split wood for an overnight burn. Insanity!

I knew that stove efficiency had improved greatly in the years just before we bought our Waterford. It sounds like you're saying efficiency has continued to improve during the last 15 years. Significant improvements or just minor incremental ones? If there really is a big difference, that totally tips the scales for retiring my Waterford. Especially with the tax credit being offered.
 
Significant. Now go shopping. Oh yeah, and welcome to the forums! Rick
 
BrotherBart said:
wendell said:
Outside of one of our member's obsession with steel stoves,

That would be the guy that owns two cast iron stoves and one steel stove. ;-)

I don't recall mentioning any names. :lol:
 
dstover said:
Our wood is all split and nicely seasoned. We ignored the instruction manual telling us not to use split wood for an overnight burn. Insanity!

I knew that stove efficiency had improved greatly in the years just before we bought our Waterford. It sounds like you're saying efficiency has continued to improve during the last 15 years. Significant improvements or just minor incremental ones? If there really is a big difference, that totally tips the scales for retiring my Waterford. Especially with the tax credit being offered.

It's like "When Harry Met Sally".... "I'll have what ever she's having." %-P

I am very serious. (Wood & coal stoves in my earlier years.)

Go !!! Get busy !! You will NOT regret it !!
 
Yeah steel or cast the efficiency and wood savings of the newer stoves is really worth it if you only heat with wood. The Waterfords were, and still are if you live in Ireland, nice stoves. But even their new ones can't touch the stoves we have here in The States these days for squeezing the most heat out of the least amount of wood.

But there is a sharp learning curve. I know. The first year with a new EPA stove drove me nuts. The little Jotuls not so much. The big boy, man it was a hassle. Now it is just load and go.
 
I have had both, cast iron and steel. Purchased a Harmon Oakwood, it was great for a year then the fiberglass gaskets, of which there are many, began to leak. 2 months into the second heating season the gaskets failed, not just the door gaskets. The Oakwood is a high quality stove and I have only read one post about smoke odor leaking. Cast iron is great but I would read as many reviews as possible. I exchanged my cast iron stove for a Regency steel stove because I owned one previously and the stove shop only sells Regency and Harmon.
My neighbor had a Blaze King, it was cracked too!
Good luck on your stove adventure.
 
dstover said:
Also, we haven't maintained the stove well, so right now we have a cracked firebrick, poor circulation, a bent clip on the window glass, some chipped enamel, etc. etc. Haven't replaced the baffle either. Probably why we are getting poor performance! But as I said we've never been thrilled with this stove's performance, although it was admittedly better in years past.

The tax credit is making us wonder whether we should replace our stove this year instead of overhauling it. Esp. since Waterford is out of business and we may have trouble getting parts? It would be really nice to be able to leave home for the day (we both work at home so we don't do that usually) and come back to a warm house.

Doesn't sound like the stove is running great right now. With a warped or cracked baffle, it can't perform like designed. Either fix it or move on. I would lean towards the second choice, which also seems to be your leaning.
 
I wish I was in your situation - needing a new stove that is. Mine is newer and gets the job done, so I can't justify a new stove. You have a unique opportunity - an older broken down stove - hopefully money for a new one - and tax credits to boost.

Have fun shopping! Whether cast or plate just size and install the new stove properly and you should be okay.

You also mentioned circulation. A new stove will probably not help that. It is a whole other discussion.
 
dstover said:
Our wood is all split and nicely seasoned. We ignored the instruction manual telling us not to use split wood for an overnight burn. Insanity!

I knew that stove efficiency had improved greatly in the years just before we bought our Waterford. It sounds like you're saying efficiency has continued to improve during the last 15 years. Significant improvements or just minor incremental ones? If there really is a big difference, that totally tips the scales for retiring my Waterford. Especially with the tax credit being offered.

Yikes, 10 cords in your climate with an 1,800 sf house?? I'm in the NE, so only burn hardwoods, but 10 cords sounds like an incredible amount of wood. I use slightly over 2 cords for the main floor of a 1,300 sq house, and I'm in Vermont!

Get a new stove. There's a learning curve, but you'll be thrilled with how much less wood you have to wrangle.
 
Thanks so much everyone for the encouragement and great suggestions! I was dreading the thought of having to shop for a new stove, but now I'm really excited about the prospect of burning less wood and staying warmer. Although I don't know how my hubby will stay in shape if he doesn't have to split 10 cords a year anymore :)

I'm planning to look at the Lopi Liberty, PE Summit and PE Alderlea for starters. I had not heard of PE before, but the Portland dealer says they are very popular with his customers. I might also take a look at the Jotul and Blaze King products. After hearing from all of you I am feeling bipartisan about cast vs. steel, and even cat vs. non-cat.

Does anyone have a recommendation for me about whether or not to buy a blower accessory? When I mentioned circulation problems earlier, I meant air circ within the stove—not within my house. I have a fairly open floor plan, and a ceiling fan that runs all day. It is typically a few degrees warmer upstairs than down but the only real cold spot is a first-floor bedroom.

I did not buy a blower for my Waterford Trinity MK II. Partly to save money and electricity, but also because I read that it was noisy. But maybe I should buy a blower this time around? I'm not relishing the prospect of having to install an electrical outlet by my stove either (there is none nearby now). In a "rustic" log house, that is easier said than done.
 
Welllll, you could suggest some alternate forms of exercise to the hubby. Or you could make a little cash selling the extra firewood.

As for the blower, yeah, they're noisy. I've found since I switched to heating with wood, I crave the wonderful quiet and resent it every time some kitchen appliance like the freezer switches on to disturb it. So I'd suggest doing without initially. You can always add it if you feel you really need it and are willing to trade the quiet for the noise. If you're doing fine without one now, you' probably don't need one.

I have a non-cat stove, but what I read here is that the cats are particularly good at long low-temp burns, so you maybe want to look at that first for your climate. You can always get great heat out of them if needed, but if most of your winter is as you say, the ability to maintain a lower temperature without gunking up your chimney would be a big advantage, I would think.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.