Which sub par wood?

[jeffman3]

I have a dilemma, that will be rectified next year, but that I have to deal with in the now, well.... in the very near future. I have at my disposal a small amount of wood that has been cut, cottonwood that has been dead and down for years, splits from up to say 12 inch rounds, and some elm branches that came down in an ice storm last spring, up to say 8 inches diameter on the bigger pieces. I don't know if the smaller diameter of the elm branches would allow it to dry over a hot summer (left intact) or not. So the question is which sub par wood would you burn in the same situation. I know that I need better seasoned wood, but there just isn't any to be had, for any price, anywhere even close to local. Both sources of wood are within an acceptable distance to go cut, but cut as I go I must for now. The reason I'm asking is that I will concentrate on the better of the two sources for now. This spring I will be cutting elm for next year! (The plan is to put up 4-6 cord, depending on stacking space)
(we desperately need a supplier of bio-bricks or an equivalent product. I don't need, nor could I afford, 22 ton of the stuff.)

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Choice between cottonwood and elm, the elm wins hands down. However, depending on how dry that cottonwood is you might get away with it. Just remember that cottonwood is so darned full of sap that when fresh cut it is better to leave it 2 years before attempting to burn it. Elm isn't too far behind, but I'm guessing that if those elm brancehs fell during an ice storm they were probably dead already. If so, burn them. If neither of those two were dry I would not burn either.

Another thing some have suggested is to get some old pallets, which are very dry. You can find these in several places where they want to get rid of them. Mix in some of the green wood with them but do not try to burn only pallets as your fire will be too hot.

 

[eernest4]

Choice between cottonwood and elm, the elm wins hands down. However, depending on how dry that cottonwood is you might get away with it. Just remember that cottonwood is so darned full of sap that when fresh cut it is better to leave it 2 years before attempting to burn it. Elm isn't too far behind, but I'm guessing that if those elm brancehs fell during an ice storm they were probably dead already. If so, burn them. If neither of those two were dry I would not burn either.

Another thing some have suggested is to get some old pallets, which are very dry. You can find these in several places where they want to get rid of them. Mix in some of the green wood with them but do not try to burn only pallets as your fire will be too hot.

*****************************************************************************

Dear Backwoods Savage,
Maybe I'm retarted, but I just don't get it.
I have been burning nothing but pallets for the past 2 months, like 2 cords already & another 2 cords to go, & my fires can be hot , if I want, but not too hot & I can easly snarffell them down to a 300* stack temp or pick any degree number, between 300* & 600* & I can set my stove for that & the stove will hold that temp like a rock.

Maybe its just that I have a good stove & others might have problems???? exactly what are you warning about, because I like to take warnings seriuosly
as opposed to others who don't listen & learn the hard way.

I have a 1960 era, 1/4 inch steel 12 cubic foot firebox , like the big all nighter, that I have lined with firebrick & converted to preheated primary & secondary air , so it don't smoke much & gives me 14 hr overnite burns, fully loaded.

I can shut down primary air so that the fire actually dies for lack of air & I have a 8 inch stack
damper ,too.

With That combo, I never met a fire I couldn't sufficate down to glowing embers, in 10 minutes or less, sometimes as fast as 6 minutes.

 

[jeffman3]

The cottonwood was dead long before it fell, and down for a long time after that! There is absolutely no bark at all! and the trees are bleached white from the weather. The trick is to find th e trees that aren't half rotted. I found that if the tree fell against another downed tree and is off the ground, even a little, it still has "body" to it, and not just the "fluffy" half rotted wood. There is so much of this, that I questioned whether I should bother with the elm. I know the elm will burn MUCH better then the cottonwood, so that is why I am asking. The elm is farther away and more work to cut, but better to burn, the cottonwood is just literally blocks away, and everywhere. I can fill up the bed of the truck with 10 inch rounds in about 45 min. cutting cottonwood (with my wife stacking it for me). Just back the truck up, and zip zip zip fill'er up, and it's done. I guess my question really is, will the elm be worth the extra work and distance?

 

[eernest4]

My 2 cents, get the cottonwood first, before some one else does, since you say it is seasoned enough to burn ok. And it is close by , so,- not much gasoline or travel time. That makes it cheap wood.

Then go & get the elm, because, you can never have too much wood & if you should have too much wood , sell some of it for gas money . The elm will cost you more in terms of gasoline & time, it will be more expensive wood.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

eernst4, maybe we all are retarded a bit. If you can burn that wood with no problem then you have absolutley nothing to worry about. However, some depends also upon the pallets. I've seen guys get pallets where the wood was still too green to burn. However, I also know of more than one who have had some serious problems. A warning just does not hurt a thing, but again, if you have no problem, go for it.

jeff, the dead trees that have not fallen to the ground are probably okay for burning and are probably dry. You'll know when you cut into it just how dry or wet it is. Having no bark is only one indicator but does not indicate that the interior is dry. We have lots of dead elm also with no bark. We still have to let it season a whole year. But from what you are telling us, I'd for sure cut some. You might even start a fire right there where you cut the wood and see how easy it lights and how it burns. That for sure will answer much of your question.

 

[RedRanger]

I have about 2 wheel-barrows of cottonwood that have been in my woodshed for 2 years and it still measures 38isture content. So, maybe next year or the year after that. Or if I run out of Fir this year :lol:

 

[Shipper50]

I burned cottonwood that was cut, split and stacked by me for years. I only had 2 kinds of trees to burn so to speak and cottonwood while not hickory beats the hell out of a snow ball as my buddy says.

I also burned elm and found it very hard to split even with a splitter. I would think you will find the cottonwood for now to fill the bill as its easy to split and if its been dead standing or on the ground as you say, it will do the job for now.

Shipper

 

[Todd]

Choice between cottonwood and elm, the elm wins hands down. However, depending on how dry that cottonwood is you might get away with it. Just remember that cottonwood is so darned full of sap that when fresh cut it is better to leave it 2 years before attempting to burn it. Elm isn't too far behind, but I'm guessing that if those elm brancehs fell during an ice storm they were probably dead already. If so, burn them. If neither of those two were dry I would not burn either.

Another thing some have suggested is to get some old pallets, which are very dry. You can find these in several places where they want to get rid of them. Mix in some of the green wood with them but do not try to burn only pallets as your fire will be too hot.

*****************************************************************************

Dear Backwoods Savage,
Maybe I'm retarted, but I just don't get it.
I have been burning nothing but pallets for the past 2 months, like 2 cords already & another 2 cords to go, & my fires can be hot , if I want, but not too hot & I can easly snarffell them down to a 300* stack temp or pick any degree number, between 300* & 600* & I can set my stove for that & the stove will hold that temp like a rock.

Maybe its just that I have a good stove & others might have problems???? exactly what are you warning about, because I like to take warnings seriuosly
as opposed to others who don't listen & learn the hard way.

I have a 1960 era, 1/4 inch steel 12 cubic foot firebox , like the big all nighter, that I have lined with firebrick & converted to preheated primary & secondary air , so it don't smoke much & gives me 14 hr overnite burns, fully loaded.

I can shut down primary air so that the fire actually dies for lack of air & I have a 8 inch stack
damper ,too.

With That combo, I never met a fire I couldn't sufficate down to glowing embers, in 10 minutes or less, sometimes as fast as 6 minutes.

You have more control with your stove, because it's air tight. Most of the newer EPA stoves can't cut off the secondary air or even the primary air all the way. So if you fully load some real dry, thin pallet wood into an EPA stove, chances are it could run away on you. Most stove manuals suggest to burn only cord wood and not lumber scraps or pallet wood for this reason. But mixing in some good dry pallet wood with not so dry cord wood can help some.

 

[drhiii]

Free wood, seasoned for now or acquired for later, is the best.

If there is a choice, elm. Higher BTU content than Cottonwood, doesn't stink, coals up nicely tho quickly, leaves ash. Better between the two imo.

Cottonwood is low BTU content, stinks (at least the stuff around here), it has to be really seasoned or you will want a really hot bed of coals to keep it burning, spews out smoke and creasote causing more frequent chimney cleanings. It just plain produces minimal heat and imo, doesn't provide a sense and satisfaction of a nice wood fire.

I was bummed for several months on a new stove because I burned Cottonwood which is way too abundand around here. Then one day I threw in a pinon split into the new stove that I had just aquired and the stove ran like a nuclear reactor, meaning hot and long, comparatively. I'd do elm first, then free and that includes Cottonwood, know that there is a much more robust experience beyond that.

I have a dilemma, that will be rectified next year, but that I have to deal with in the now, well.... in the very near future. I have at my disposal a small amount of wood that has been cut, cottonwood that has been dead and down for years, splits from up to say 12 inch rounds, and some elm branches that came down in an ice storm last spring, up to say 8 inches diameter on the bigger pieces. I don't know if the smaller diameter of the elm branches would allow it to dry over a hot summer (left intact) or not. So the question is which sub par wood would you burn in the same situation. I know that I need better seasoned wood, but there just isn't any to be had, for any price, anywhere even close to local. Both sources of wood are within an acceptable distance to go cut, but cut as I go I must for now. The reason I'm asking is that I will concentrate on the better of the two sources for now. This spring I will be cutting elm for next year! (The plan is to put up 4-6 cord, depending on stacking space)
(we desperately need a supplier of bio-bricks or an equivalent product. I don't need, nor could I afford, 22 ton of the stuff.)

 

[jeffman3]

Thanks for the help!

I will try both ( I have some of both ) and see which burns better. The cottonwood is abundant I could cut there for 5 years and maybe make a dent in the dead trees that are down, and never drop a green tree. The whole river bottom is all, (well... mostly) cottonwood, and to tell the truth there is as much or more dead then living. The elm is just as abuntant, but farther to drive. I could, and plan to, cut downed trees up there for years to come, on my aunt and uncles' ground. I just will have to do some test burns to see which will burn better this year, the elm gets the nod for next year!

 

[Highbeam]

The cottonwood will season quickly if you do your part. I processed three large diameter 36" or so cottonwood trees this last spring. They were alive and well. Cut and split into large splits. Stacked on pallets in a long double row 60 feet long and 4 feet tall. East to west in full sunlight in a mowed field. Plastic on top in September. The stuff of course pegged my moisture meter when green and was as heavy as anything. I have pulled and split some sample pieces to burn after less than one year and found 18-19% moisture content with my meter. The splits are nicely bleached, lightweight, and cracked radially.

Now on the other hand I had a large cottonwood/willow tree blow over just over a year ago in a windstorm. I left it lay whole and in contact with the ground where it fell. The tree sent a million suckers up out of its side and is still alive and well. The shoots are way over my head!

Your cottonwood experience will be greatly effected by your drying methods.

As far as the OP's choice, I would bet that the cottonwood is rotten if left laying. I know it would be if in the rainforests of the NW.

 

[jeffman3]

This cottonwood isn't heavy at all, and it splits like no bodies business. I think it will be OK, but I know there is better. I will just have to try some and see how it goes. Allot of the wood down there is rotten, but anything off the ground even a couple inches still has integrity to it. I would say half of the dead and down is leaning on downed trees and/or leaning against other still upright trees. Time, and some test burns, will tell.

 

[bokehman]

I have a 1960 era [...]I can shut down primary air so that the fire actually dies for lack of air

Well you can't do that with a modern stove. Once the fire is going shut the primary (as much as it allows) and the fire continues until the whole load is consumed.

 

[mtarbert]

This may be a bit off-subject but.......I have a friend who would get his firewood fron a government bombing range, His ashes were full of schrapnel. Fist size chunks of bombs (a small fist)
Mike

 

[wg_bent]

I can't believe I'm saying this.. but go for the elm.

 

[jeffman3]

I can't believe I'm saying this.. but go for the elm.

Why is that? Is it due to the Elm being difficult to split?

 

[jeffman3]

I got another 1/2 truck load of Elm braches today. Half a truck load of braches that are probably needing to dry for next year, and the other half from a dead and down tree that is DRY, compared to the braches. I only had room for part of the tree, and there is more then I took still there, on that tree. This place is unreal! dead trees every where. My uncle wants me to get the downed branches, along with the realy good stuff, that I am really after. I guess I will take what I can get, because I want to cut for next year too, and the year after that, and the year after that. I could burn 24/7 for 10 seasons just on the dead trees, and downed braches. Without touching a green tree. :coolgrin:

Now if I can just get my stove delivered and installed, I'll be set to do some test burns!

 

[Shipper50]

When you get to about 4 years worth of wood stored, then you can take a break. I know I don't have enough wood cut and stacked, but do to a knee replacement that went bad, it makes it tough. Good thing you can get all this free wood and all it takes is your labor and time.

Cant beat that with a stick %-P

Shipper

 

[drhiii]

Free is most cool. That's where I start.

Having said that, in my experience, elm is middle of the road BTUs. It goes to coals fairly quickly. And it produces a lot of ash. You'll be cleaning your chimney a lot more as well. All manageable. It better be as I have approx 7 cords of elm in back of my house.

I was burning elm and cottonwood when I started out because it was so abundant around here. Then I chanced across some dense pitch pine, some very dense juniper, some ready to go oak, and some pinon. The difference was night and day, on different planets. I've learned and continue to learn how to manage these types of wood and use them at particular times, but will say once one experiences some gold standard wood in its prime, you'll get an appreciation for the types of wood and conditions of use. But.... free is free....

I can't believe I'm saying this.. but go for the elm.

Why is that? Is it due to the Elm being difficult to split?

 

[jeffman3]

Around here elm is about as good as it gets. Mostly cottonwood, and most everybody I know burns that because they can't get elm. There is some black walnut around, but not much and it is hard to find, and impossible to get permission to cut. You just about have to be related to somebody. Well......that's how I got access to the Air Base to cut wood on my uncles ground. He rides with me/us, out there and kicks in gas money one way. My aunt goes out to pick him up later in the afternoon. I need to get some racks built on the side of the house to start stacking on. I have better then a cord on the front porch, but I would like to stack 3 cord on the side of the house for next year, and another 3-4 cord out at the base as well.