Newbie shop stove install, EPA stove..

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Palongee1

Member
Oct 23, 2018
9
Idaho
Hey all! Newbie here writing from Idaho. I just purchased a wood stove from Lowes. Stove is advertised as “summers heat 2400 sq ft” (englander) I did a fair bit of reasearch before opting for this stove. The stove is in a pole barn style shop, 24 by 60’. Wood frame, metal siding with a thin layer of vinyl backed insulated/vapor barrier. The manufacture called for 15’ minimum chimney. Long story short, I do have 15’ of pipe along with two 45’s to fit the offset in the rafters/ perlins. I’ve read quite a bit how the epa stoves can be finicky. It’s still pretty warm here so I’m just trying to prep for winter. The wood I have is a mix of poplar, willow, locust. The majority of this wood was split 10+ years ago and stored in a grain silo so I’m
Assuming it’s very well dried. I figured out after lighting my first fire that I have to leave the door partially open until the fire is established before shutting the door. My biggest question is, even with the air control valve in the open most position the fire in the box still seems to be hungry for air. It will burn in the low setting but all I see happening when I set it to low is the gasses burning off. I pulled the back panel off just to see how this thing ticks, it’s pretty dang cool design. I guess I’m curious if I’m a little shy on chimney height or if this is just how this thing is gonna burn. I’ve monitored temps with a IR thermometer and the hottest I could get the stove was 520 measuring where the manufacture says to check it. Any input would be much appreciated! Thanks! Mike
 

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With it still being "pretty warm", which I'm guessing means in the 50s, draft will be limited. Once in the 30s and below with the 15' of chimney you should be fine.

Your stove placement, wood described, and way of burning seems fine.

Try loading N/S for better hotter fires. And with air on low all you should see is the secondaries burning. Everything seems normal to me.
 
I have a very similar setup in a similar shop. My ceiling is taller so more stack but if I ever shut the damper fully, the fire gets snuffed. That’s a really good thing. Control of a noncat can be hard to get since the epa wants them to burn hot and clean all the time.

Stuff the stove full of fuel to the roof, start it at full throttle, close the door as soon as you can, then lower the intake only about 1/4 of the way and let the stove eat. You need thermometers, 2, one for the flue and one for the stove. Keep the stove under 700/750 and the surface of that single wall flue pipe under 500.

Your wood for a modern noncat in this application should be split to 3-5 inches across the longest dimension of the butt.
 
Palongee1 said:
Hey all! Newbie here writing from Idaho. I just purchased a wood stove from Lowes. Stove is advertised as “summers heat 2400 sq ft” (englander) I did a fair bit of reasearch before opting for this stove. The stove is in a pole barn style shop, 24 by 60’. Wood frame, metal siding with a thin layer of vinyl backed insulated/vapor barrier. The manufacture called for 15’ minimum chimney. Long story short, I do have 15’ of pipe along with two 45’s to fit the offset in the rafters/ perlins. I’ve read quite a bit how the epa stoves can be finicky. It’s still pretty warm here so I’m just trying to prep for winter. The wood I have is a mix of poplar, willow, locust. The majority of this wood was split 10+ years ago and stored in a grain silo so I’m
Assuming it’s very well dried. I figured out after lighting my first fire that I have to leave the door partially open until the fire is established before shutting the door. My biggest question is, even with the air control valve in the open most position the fire in the box still seems to be hungry for air. It will burn in the low setting but all I see happening when I set it to low is the gasses burning off. I pulled the back panel off just to see how this thing ticks, it’s pretty dang cool design. I guess I’m curious if I’m a little shy on chimney height or if this is just how this thing is gonna burn. I’ve monitored temps with a IR thermometer and the hottest I could get the stove was 520 measuring where the manufacture says to check it. Any input would be much appreciated! Thanks! Mike
Click to expand...
Did you check with your insurance company about this install? Because it is against code to install a solid fuel burning appliance in a garage or space containing flamable vapors which yours does. I am not telling you not to do it i just want to make sure you are aware of the risks because it is a code violation.
 
Looks like a pole barn style shop and not a garage. Not even any cars parked in it! Lots and lots of forum members burning wood in shops.
 
Highbeam said:
Looks like a pole barn style shop and not a garage. Not even any cars parked in it! Lots and lots of forum members burning wood in shops.
Click to expand...
There is a utv parked there it doesn't matter what you call it is against code. I know there are lots of people who do it including me. But i know it is against code and i accept the risks that go along with it.
 
If something ever does happen the insurance companies lawers arent going to care what you call your building either.
 
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I don’t think it’s against code since this isn’t a garage.Your opinion is different, oh well.
 
Highbeam said:
I don’t think it’s against code since this isn’t a garage.Your opinion is different, oh well.
Click to expand...
Do you think there is gasoline in that utv???
 
I know there are gas vapors coming out of my butt in my living room where I have a stove. It’s way stinkier than his utv. You’ve got to be realistic. How many wood boilers on this site are in shops? So many wood furnaces too.
 
Palongee1 said:
Hey all! Newbie here writing from Idaho. I just purchased a wood stove from Lowes. Stove is advertised as “summers heat 2400 sq ft” (englander) I did a fair bit of reasearch before opting for this stove. The stove is in a pole barn style shop, 24 by 60’. Wood frame, metal siding with a thin layer of vinyl backed insulated/vapor barrier. The manufacture called for 15’ minimum chimney. Long story short, I do have 15’ of pipe along with two 45’s to fit the offset in the rafters/ perlins. I’ve read quite a bit how the epa stoves can be finicky. It’s still pretty warm here so I’m just trying to prep for winter. The wood I have is a mix of poplar, willow, locust. The majority of this wood was split 10+ years ago and stored in a grain silo so I’m
Assuming it’s very well dried. I figured out after lighting my first fire that I have to leave the door partially open until the fire is established before shutting the door. My biggest question is, even with the air control valve in the open most position the fire in the box still seems to be hungry for air. It will burn in the low setting but all I see happening when I set it to low is the gasses burning off. I pulled the back panel off just to see how this thing ticks, it’s pretty dang cool design. I guess I’m curious if I’m a little shy on chimney height or if this is just how this thing is gonna burn. I’ve monitored temps with a IR thermometer and the hottest I could get the stove was 520 measuring where the manufacture says to check it. Any input would be much appreciated! Thanks! Mike
Click to expand...
You have s really nice shop with a good install. I would recomend elevating the stove atleast 18" off the ground. But be aware that no matter what one particular person here says this is against code. That means that if something happens and you make a claim your insurance company would be justified in denying the claim. As long as you understand that and are ok with that risk carry on. You will figure out the stove tgey are not complicated there is just a leaning curve. And your wood likely isnt dry enough.
 
Highbeam said:
I know there are gas vapors coming out of my butt in my living room where I have a stove. It’s way stinkier than his utv. You’ve got to be realistic. How many wood boilers on this site are in shops? So many wood furnaces too.
Click to expand...
Just because lots of people do something it does not change what is clearly spelled out in the code books.
 
Meh, your interpretation of that code is just different than the interpretation of many others. It’s just ambiguous enough to go either way which as you know benefits the huge number of folks with stoves in their shops.

The way I read it, and my insurance company, and my county that approved the installation, is that a garage is not the same thing as a shop. Flammable gasses are possible anywhere.
 
Ok well nfpa 211 is acceped fire code in idaho. It clearly states in 12.2.3 that solid fuel burning appliances shal not be installed in any location where gasoline or any other flammable vapors or gasses are present.

Can you please explain how that can be interpreted in a way that makes this install conform?
 
Its only against "code" if the building is under insurance.

Maybe the building is NOT insured and then therefore your point is mute @bholler
 
MAD MARK said:
Its only against "code" if the building is under insurance.

Maybe the building is NOT insured and then therefore your point is mute @bholler
Click to expand...
No it is still against code. It just doesnt matter much if it is not insured. Unless someone is hurt or it causes damage to insured property.
 
To the op i am sorry for this distraction. I am simply trying to provide you with the accurate information pertaining to your install. From that you can make your own decision
 
Ooh, so it looks like the key words are “gasoline or any other flammable vapors or gasses are likely to be present”.

Having gasoline in a sealed tank doesn’t necessarily mean gasoline vapors are likely to be present.
 
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Highbeam said:
Ooh, so it looks like the key words are “gasoline or any other flammable vapors or gasses are likely to be present”.

Having gasoline in a sealed tank doesn’t necessarily mean gasoline vapors are likely to be present.
Click to expand...
No but the gas is present. It says or not and meaning if any one of those things are present in the space a woodstove shall not be installed there.
 
So an install of a wood stove or insert into a basement as supplemental heat that has a natural gas furnace as main heating, which also resides in the basement of same dwelling, albeit 30 foot away----You would state this "code"? Wonder how many people this now covers on here haha
 
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bholler said:
No but the gas is present. It says or not and meaning if any one of those things are present in the space a woodstove shall not be installed there.
Click to expand...

I don’t read it like that. It says gasoline or any other flammable vapor. As in, gasoline vapor or other vapors. It’s all about vapors which certainly makes sense.

Of course farts make all stoves prohibited anywhere.
 
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MAD MARK said:
So an install of a wood stove or insert into a basement as supplemental heat that has a natural gas furnace as main heating, which also resides in the basement of same dwelling, albeit 30 foot away----You would state this "code"? Wonder how many people this now covers on here haha
Click to expand...
No i wouldnt. But if there was a gas can there i would. The fact it that is the code and installs like this one are clearly not compliant. Wouldnt you agree?
 
Highbeam said:
I don’t read it like that. It says gasoline or any other flammable vapor. As in, gasoline vapor or other vapors. It’s all about vapors which certainly makes sense.

Of course farts make all stoves prohibited anywhere.
Click to expand...
It doesnt matter how you read it this install is clearly not compliant. And regardless the space has a garage door and clearly vehicles are pulled into it so it is a garage.
 
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