2016-17 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK) Part 2

[Shayne]

Oh no, I can spin my stat knob ccw way past vertical. All the way back to like 8 o'clock. Princess free stander.

Then you telling me your hour setting based on a clock position has absolutely no meaning to me as mine goes 12 to 6. You specifying a percentage open would be crystal clear.

( number of divisions set to / total number of divisions ) x 100 any smart device has a calc. As I said in theory.

Regards

 

[webby3650]

Then you telling me your hour setting based on a clock position has absolutely no meaning to me as mine goes 12 to 6. You specifying a percentage open would be crystal clear.

( number of divisions set to / total number of divisions ) x 100 any smart device has a calc. As I said in theory.

Regards

Ohh geez! Here we go again with the stupid sticker debate.
Let's all just use some common sense and try not to read into it so much. Abviously 12 o'clock, or vertical would be low, straight down is high, it's stops at high, pretty easy to figure out. It'll be mass confusion if everyone starts using percentages! Let's not make it harder than it is...

 

[Ashful]

could you please quantify incrementally. Is 2 hours 33% adjustment a small enough increment or would 20% be a better recommendation?

He just means, "don't slam it from full throttle to 30-hour burn mode in one motion," as this will cause backpuffing issues on some installs. Lower it a little, wait 5 minutes for the fire to stabilize at intermediate burn rate, then lower some more. Two or three steps from inferno to low burn, over ten or fifteen minutes will cure most backpuffing issues.

Now I understand that the dials are a real cluster as I have no 7 or 8:00 with my swoosh going from 12 to 6 oclock. Appears to me the only way to quanitfy every ones dial equally is perectage. Since mine turns from 12 to 6, 3:00 should be 50% 4:00 65% 2:00 35% and 2:30 40% working off 6 hour divisions, 2.5/6=41.6 => my tstat was 40% open. No matter what division you are running in your mind you can do some quick math to quanify it to a perecnt from 0 to 100% open so we all have a clue what each other is talking about. Just an idea that should work in theory. A 10 hour sweep would make that math pretty easy.

So at what percentage is your sweet spot?

Mine stays active no problems at 30% but this winter it was more around 50% for warmth.

Regards

Holy crap, have you ever found a way to complicate something dirt simple. If you can't imagine a clock in your mind's eye, without the aid of numbers, maybe you shouldn't be operating a wood stove. [emoji12]

My t'stat knob turns another 180-degrees below it's lowest effective setting, where the air control is completely slammed shut on a cold stove, so what is this by your system? Negative 50%? Or if we say the operational range is 0-100%, then my knob turns -300% to +100%, given the ineffective range beyond air fully-closed is three times the range of settings where the t'stat can actually function? Where is your "zero", when it doesn't correspond to a physical stop, or label on a knob?

I'll stick with "o'clock", or the old BK label numbers, thank you very much.

 

[tarzan]

Haven't any of you guys downloaded the BK thermostat setting app

 

[webby3650]

Haven't any of you guys downloaded the BK thermostat setting app

I did. It's called set it and forget it! Same one you've got?

 

[moresnow]

We must remember. Some of our membership is likely to have never used/seen a analog clock Haaaaaaaaaa. Knee slapping happening. Wife is also laughing now....12 o'clock position to them fellers means a blinking red (12:00) in high def. red! Haaaaaaaaa. Seriously. The thought just crossed my mind.

 

[rdust]

Well clearly what needs to happen is everyone needs to remove the t-stat cover when the stove is room temperature, mark when the blade is actually closed and open at 100% then figure out the percentage.

I think I'll stick with the numbers and letters that my label has printed on it.

 

[Highbeam]

Stat label discussion is certainly not wasted time. It obviously interests a great many people and new viewpoints are presented. As we all become "old hands" at this we will be seeing more and more repeats of previously discussed nuances. Keep reading, keep teaching, keep being excited about this hobby. Don't ever shame someone for asking. Blah blah blah.

The vinegar bath has totally restored cat function. It's been weeks now and I can say that cat washing is an effective tool to restore cat function.

 

[Tegbert]

Stat label discussion is certainly not wasted time. It obviously interests a great many people and new viewpoints are presented. As we all become "old hands" at this we will be seeing more and more repeats of previously discussed nuances. Keep reading, keep teaching, keep being excited about this hobby. Don't ever shame someone for asking. Blah blah blah.

The vinegar bath has totally restored cat function. It's been weeks now and I can say that cat washing is an effective tool to restore cat function.

With the washing working for you are you going to use it as a regular cleaning cycle? Like once a year at the end of the season or just wait until it happens again to try?


Lopi Rockport

 

[Highbeam]

With the washing working for you are you going to use it as a regular cleaning cycle? Like once a year at the end of the season or just wait until it happens again to try?


Lopi Rockport

I don't plan to do the wash until I experience failure again. Or two years, whichever comes first. That's the plan anyway. If I didn't have to buy/replace the gasket each time, I might be inclined to make it an annual ritual.

 

[tarzan]

I did. It's called set it and forget it! Same one you've got?

Yep!

 

[Tar12]

I don't plan to do the wash until I experience failure again. Or two years, whichever comes first. That's the plan anyway. If I didn't have to buy/replace the gasket each time, I might be inclined to make it an annual ritual.

What brand of gasket did you go with?

 

[jetsam]

He just means, "don't slam it from full throttle to 30-hour burn mode in one motion," as this will cause backpuffing issues on some installs. Lower it a little, wait 5 minutes for the fire to stabilize at intermediate burn rate, then lower some more. Two or three steps from inferno to low burn, over ten or fifteen minutes will cure most backpuffing issues.


Holy crap, have you ever found a way to complicate something dirt simple. If you can't imagine a clock in your mind's eye, without the aid of numbers, maybe you shouldn't be operating a wood stove. [emoji12]

My t'stat knob turns another 180-degrees below it's lowest effective setting, where the air control is completely slammed shut on a cold stove, so what is this by your system? Negative 50%? Or if we say the operational range is 0-100%, then my knob turns -300% to +100%, given the ineffective range beyond air fully-closed is three times the range of settings where the t'stat can actually function? Where is your "zero", when it doesn't correspond to a physical stop, or label on a knob?

I'll stick with "o'clock", or the old BK label numbers, thank you very much.

As much as I hate to even post on this topic, his system is the same way I communicate knob settings to my wife. (Did that sound dirty? ) Zero is as low as it goes and 100 is as high as it goes. 50's in the middle. ;p

You sound grumpy. We need to get some BBQ and scotch into you!

 

[jetsam]

On a whole new topic, I left town a week ago today. Came back, and my stove is still burning, cat active. BKs are amazing!

 

[webby3650]

On a whole new topic, I left town a week ago today. Came back, and my stove is still burning, cat active. BKs are amazing!

View attachment 196510

 

[jetsam]

That story is absolutely true.

My wife was home all week.

 

[Shayne]

He just means, "don't slam it from full throttle to 30-hour burn mode in one motion," as this will cause backpuffing issues on some installs. Lower it a little, wait 5 minutes for the fire to stabilize at intermediate burn rate, then lower some more. Two or three steps from inferno to low burn, over ten or fifteen minutes will cure most backpuffing issues.

Holy crap, have you ever found a way to complicate something dirt simple. If you can't imagine a clock in your mind's eye, without the aid of numbers, maybe you shouldn't be operating a wood stove. [emoji12]

My t'stat knob turns another 180-degrees below it's lowest effective setting, where the air control is completely slammed shut on a cold stove, so what is this by your system? Negative 50%? Or if we say the operational range is 0-100%, then my knob turns -300% to +100%, given the ineffective range beyond air fully-closed is three times the range of settings where the t'stat can actually function? Where is your "zero", when it doesn't correspond to a physical stop, or label on a knob?

I'll stick with "o'clock", or the old BK label numbers, thank you very much.

Once you choose the correct division of measurement as percentage to make what you type valuable to all peoples tstats then you must determine the start and stop points or definition the 0 and 100% limits. A clock face when all deal with a different extent of sweep and different start and stop points is not the answer. This is as simple as dirt but maybe just a difficult as 2+2 for some.

Everyone's knob turns from 0% to 100% open air and only the chosen few would talk about -300% while bashing others but yes OK maybe the start points (0%) requires defining.

With regard to your comment on maybe I should not be operating a wood stove, why would you need to be ignorance to people to get a point across? Is this because you can not defend it any better and therefore you make ignorance the bases of your intellectual tactic?

For everything one could expect some will not change, even if it would be for the better, this may not place more value on all their scientific hypothesizes on wood stoves.

Regards

 

[Shayne]

Stat label discussion is certainly not wasted time. It obviously interests a great many people and new viewpoints are presented. As we all become "old hands" at this we will be seeing more and more repeats of previously discussed nuances. Keep reading, keep teaching, keep being excited about this hobby. Don't ever shame someone for asking. Blah blah blah.

The vinegar bath has totally restored cat function. It's been weeks now and I can say that cat washing is an effective tool to restore cat function.

We guess the only way to start to compare an older tstat with a newer tstat is discuss them both open to the same percentage if the extent of travel varies. Knowing, even if we are from different locations and fuels, the diff between a 15 and 25' stack is to run the tstats at the same throttle position and then other factors can to be discussed. The tstat location is temp dependent for most and temp effects draft, tstat position has an impact. Like mine may back draft if set to 10%.

Regards

 

[jetsam]

We guess the only way to start to compare an older tstat with a newer tstat is discuss them both open to the same percentage if the extent of travel varies. Knowing, even if we are from different locations and fuels, the diff between a 15 and 25' stack is to run the tstats at the same throttle position and then other factors can to be discussed. The tstat location is temp dependent for most and temp effects draft, tstat position has an impact. Like mine may back draft if set to 10%.

Regards

You can't use stack height to calculate a dial offset between two stoves unless they have the same fuel and the same operator.

To use your example, your stove may backdraft at 10%.

If we changed out your fuel for wetter wood, now it's much cooler inside your stove for much of the burn, and your draft is consequently weaker; now your stove may backdraft at 20%.

If we change you out for a different stove operator, maybe the new operator does something differently. For example, they do a small hot reload every 10 hours whereas you do one large reload every 20 hours. Now your stove never goes far into the falling-off side of the heat output bell curve, and gets to run on high for a couple minutes twice as often. The new operator finds that he can burn at 5% with no issues.

 

[Highbeam]

What brand of gasket did you go with?

This was the cat gasket, that thin interam gasket that is 2" wide. I had a roll of it from BK from years ago so whatever brand they use. I suspect the material is from firecat and is only 2$ per foot (plus shipping) and you need three feet.

 

[Highbeam]

Once you choose the correct division of measurement as percentage to make what you type valuable to all peoples tstats then you must determine the start and stop points or definition the 0 and 100% limits. A clock face when all deal with a different extent of sweep and different start and stop points is not the answer. This is as simple as dirt but maybe just a difficult as 2+2 for some.

Everyone's knob turns from 0% to 100% open air and only the chosen few would talk about -300% while bashing others but yes OK maybe the start points (0%) requires defining.

With regard to your comment on maybe I should not be operating a wood stove, why would you need to be ignorance to people to get a point across? Is this because you can not defend it any better and therefore you make ignorance the bases of your intellectual tactic?

For everything one could expect some will not change, even if it would be for the better, this may not place more value on all their scientific hypothesizes on wood stoves.

Regards

I think you've found a solution and are looking for a problem. Have you considered that every stove model has a different thermostat? That even with the same model, some thermostats have a different range of motion as you and I discovered with our princesses? How thermostat setting is NOT directly related to throttle blade setting since there is an intentional bimettalic spring in there? How it doesn't really matter since no two stoves, fuels, operators, chimneys, altitude of operation, humidities, are the same?

I do find it very important to label your thermostat with something so that you can get repeatable results for your stove. For example, I know where to set my stat for the longest burn without stall. You might say that that is my 0%. Whoa!

 

[Ashful]

I think you've found a solution and are looking for a problem. Have you considered that every stove model has a different thermostat? That even with the same model, some thermostats have a different range of motion as you and I discovered with our princesses? How thermostat setting is NOT directly related to throttle blade setting since there is an intentional bimettalic spring in there? How it doesn't really matter since no two stoves, fuels, operators, chimneys, altitude of operation, humidities, are the same?

Exactly. I think he's trying to find a universal system that can be applied to all BK's, of all different models and installations. This seems to be the only argument against the established "o'clock" call-outs, but isn't even slightly useful, as settings from one model to the next hold very little value (and in fact could be counter-productive to a new burner).

 

[Highbeam]

Exactly. I think he's trying to find a universal system that can be applied to all BK's, of all different models and installations. This seems to be the only argument against the established "o'clock" call-outs, but isn't even slightly useful, as settings from one model to the next hold very little value (and in fact could be counter-productive to a new burner).

It's also one of the reasons BK got rid of the stat labels in the first place. People with all different BK's were making comparisons.

Anybody can custom label their stat and gain valuable operational improvements. The comparing part is the problem.

I understand why BK did it a little more now.

 

[Ashful]

I hear you, Highbeam.

However, I guess I didn't state the case as diplomatically as I could. We've all seen this hashed and re-hashed over the course of 200 pages of BK Performance threads, over the last two years, since they replaced numbers with the "swoosh". Poor Shayne just joined here four months ago, and is trying to offer a solution that he sees useful. Of course, it's been discussed before.

The trouble is that no two installations of the same model will burn the same, and similarities between different models are very slim, if present at all. Comparing the t'stat settings for a Princess insert to a standalone King, or pick your two favorite models, are no more useful than comparing that insert to any other brand of stove. This is most aggravated by the fact that the dial setting which completely defeats your thermostat (remember, the dial is a thermostat, NOT an air control) is going to be very different from one model to the next. That was the source of the "negative 300%" allusion, earlier.

So, sorry for the curt response, Shayne. I was only guarding the corpse of a very old, and very dead horse.

 

[jetsam]

I think you've found a solution and are looking for a problem. Have you considered that every stove model has a different thermostat? That even with the same model, some thermostats have a different range of motion as you and I discovered with our princesses? How thermostat setting is NOT directly related to throttle blade setting since there is an intentional bimettalic spring in there? How it doesn't really matter since no two stoves, fuels, operators, chimneys, altitude of operation, humidities, are the same?

I do find it very important to label your thermostat with something so that you can get repeatable results for your stove. For example, I know where to set my stat for the longest burn without stall. You might say that that is my 0%. Whoa!

You don't know exactly where your lowest setting is, though. Wood changes and weather changes, cats age and get replaced.

I know what you're saying- I, too, feel that I know what my "lowest burn" spot is- but I'm not actually correct to think that.

That said, maybe I'm being overly pedantic here, since the variations I experience have this far been small enough to let me pick a "low" spot and have it usually work.