2021-2022 BK everything thread

[Tron]

I'm at 4-hour reloads right now. Not because it's so cold, but when we go the stove I gathered what I could from our woods, and well, there were a few questionable trees in there. Meaning they've been dead for a while, and insects have started hollowing them out. The insects are long gone, but a big split weighs maybe half a pound, if that. But it's dry, it burns and makes heat, so I'm good with it. The next stack has better wood in it ;-)

 

[stoveliker]

I had a stack of 2 yr dried maple that acted like this. What happened was depressions and valleys in the tarp collected rainwater that seeped down into the stacks in some areas. Those pieces of wood were still damp. Burning this wood was a struggle and it clogged the cap screen in a month. Or it could be that there are different species of wood in the stack or that the dry wood was the outer sapwood and not as dense as the heartwood.

I've seen the same. This is the reason I went to using a "hard" roof. In my case a shed, but one could look at stacks with recycled corrugated metal roofing panels or something similar. Used rubber roofing material also seems to be a good choice from what I've read around here.

 

[mwhitnee]

I had a stack of 2 yr dried maple that acted like this. What happened was depressions and valleys in the tarp collected rainwater that seeped down into the stacks in some areas. Those pieces of wood were still damp. Burning this wood was a struggle and it clogged the cap screen in a month. Or it could be that there are different species of wood in the stack or that the dry wood was the outer sapwood and not as dense as the heartwood.

I believe you may be right about the depressions in the tarp thing. I have an old solar pool cover that I have been using and it definitely gets depressions in it due to water.

I have always thought about getting something like Advantec sheets, painting one side then using those to top cover, but have never pulled the trigger due do the cost. This would seem to be the best top cover to me(without a wood shed), but water would still get in.

 

[Ashful]

I believe you may be right about the depressions in the tarp thing. I have an old solar pool cover that I have been using and it definitely gets depressions in it due to water.

I have always thought about getting something like Advantec sheets, painting one side then using those to top cover, but have never pulled the trigger due do the cost. This would seem to be the best top cover to me(without a wood shed), but water would still get in.

Never tried them myself, but many here have indicated flat rubber roofing scraps are the best top cover, short of a shed.

 

[Poindexter]

I used tarps for a few years and I am not going back willingly. Water pockets, tarp leaks, inconsistently dry product, snow down my shirt collar, yuck.

Tarps are cheap, and they are quick. For someone starting out, a new burner, I can see it, not a lot of money and a quick cover for the top. Tarps got nothing else going for them.

On a small suburban lot, a well ventilated shed is the way to go. Stack it in there green, when it is dry you can burn it. If I had or someday have acreage I will consider having two years of fuel in roofed sheds with the rest of my splits stacked off the ground but otherwise in the weather.

Summer 2020 prices a reasonably portable shed system I built was about $500 per cord. Portable so the tax man can't add it to the property value, but otherwise Cadillac with ground contact rated PT lumber floor framing, metal roofing with some flashing, just really nice. This was back in the day when Joe Twobyfour cost 3-4 dollars. On the one hand $500 sounds like a lot, but service life expectancy is 20-30 years. Over the life of the shed $500 divided by 25 years is 20 bucks a year. The shed I designed will need to be levelled annualy until the ground under the concrete pads stabilizes, probably 3-5 years.

https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...rk-1-is-built-and-filled.181504/#post-2542221 I just bumped so I can look at the beam tables again for the lower 48 with lower snowloads.

 

[kennyp2339]

Warm day today, stove hasnt been loaded since yesterday evening so a full ash cleanout will be done later, I will inspect my cap and send the brush down for a quick cleaning - no snow on the roof, might as well take advantage of the weather opportunity.

 

[jdonna]

I got a little happy cleaning up the window gasket channel after replacing the window gasket and the studs happened to get a hair cut. I know it’s been discussed before grinding down the studs, figured I had nothing to lose.

 

[MissMac]

Okay - i put a new steel cat in my stove after 4 winters on my first one. I have less than 2 months on this new steel cat. Noticed the performance was slipping last few weeks - more smoke out the chimney, flames dropping off a bit in the box when i flip the bypass after reloads. Pretty typical for my set-up - means it's time to vacuum the fly ash off the cat face (which i have to do about 3-4 times per year). I let the stove go cold, removed the heat shield this morning and this is what i see:



So obviously, after my head finished whipping around, I pulled the cat. This is what it looks like:

the front -the cells are totally separated from the frame of the catalyst, and a whole bank of the cells have pushed out the back.



Here's a pic from the back:


So - what in the actual *!$# happened? Like I've been running my stove for 5 years now - nothing new is going on (besides this new cat), no overfires, no forgot to shut the bypass, wood is good and less than 20%. Was this a faulty cat from the get-go? I'm pretty p.o.'d cause i just got this cat and it costs more than $400. I don't have that kind of money to be throwing at another catalyst. Anybody got any ideas? @BKVP is it possible to get a replacement for this even though I've used my original warranty replacement, given that this was the replacement i was given and it has blown apart in less than 2 months?

Thanks

 

[Ashful]

I'd just push it back flush, wrap a new gasket on that bad boy, slip it back in the hole, and fire it up! While a curious thing for some interesting discussion on how it happened, I can't imagine that would impact performance in any way, one pushed back into alignment.

On a possibly-related note, if you're seeing enough fly ash on your cat to cause a degradation in performance 3 - 4 times per year (!), I'm guessing your draft is over spec. Ever consider adding a key damper? It really improved the behavior of one of my stoves, where I had measured draft 3x the specified maximum.

 

[MissMac]

I have done my best to push it back together, but it still looks haggard and there is a gap down the side. For the cost of the catalyst, i am unwilling to accept that it is "good enough" to continue with. I've contacted the BK dealer to see if BK will replace it, given that it has less than 2 months on it.

As for the fly ash - i attribute that to the jack pine. Every time i open the stove door, the fine ash from the pine whirls around and over time, this is how it ends up. Many people have suggested to me that I don't have enough draft given my minimal stack height and ongoing smoke smell issues that have never been resolved or correctly diagnosed. I am definitely not going to install a key damper.

Really, I'd just like to know if this was just a bunk cat, or if there is something that happened in my stove that caused the damage. And I want a new cat.

I'd just push it back flush, wrap a new gasket on that bad boy, slip it back in the hole, and fire it up! While a curious thing for some interesting discussion on how it happened, I can't imagine that would impact performance in any way, one pushed back into alignment.

On a possibly-related note, if you're seeing enough fly ash on your cat to cause a degradation in performance 3 - 4 times per year (!), I'm guessing your draft is over spec. Ever consider adding a key damper? It really improved the behavior of one of my stoves, where I had measured draft 3x the specified maximum.

 

[stoveliker]

I would indeed pursue this with BK rather than pushing it back and letting it slide (I know, pun intended). Why? If the gasket is important for the emissions - i.e. if the small gap that would be there if no gasket is in place affects the emissions in a measurable way, then the gaps created by this "deconstruction" could possibly too, given that moving parts mean some gaps will be larger than designed.

Given that that performance (emissions) is one of the main purposes of the cat, this issue directly goes to the core of the role of the cat - and that deserves some response of BK.

I trust that they will work with you outside of the view here.

 

[jdonna]

Okay - i put a new steel cat in my stove after 4 winters on my first one. I have less than 2 months on this new steel cat. Noticed the performance was slipping last few weeks - more smoke out the chimney, flames dropping off a bit in the box when i flip the bypass after reloads. Pretty typical for my set-up - means it's time to vacuum the fly ash off the cat face (which i have to do about 3-4 times per year). I let the stove go cold, removed the heat shield this morning and this is what i see:

View attachment 292316

So obviously, after my head finished whipping around, I pulled the cat. This is what it looks like:

View attachment 292317 the front -the cells are totally separated from the frame of the catalyst, and a whole bank of the cells have pushed out the back.

View attachment 292318

Here's a pic from the back:
View attachment 292319

So - what in the actual *!$# happened? Like I've been running my stove for 5 years now - nothing new is going on (besides this new cat), no overfires, no forgot to shut the bypass, wood is good and less than 20%. Was this a faulty cat from the get-go? I'm pretty p.o.'d cause i just got this cat and it costs more than $400. I don't have that kind of money to be throwing at another catalyst. Anybody got any ideas? @BKVP is it possible to get a replacement for this even though I've used my original warranty replacement, given that this was the replacement i was given and it has blown apart in less than 2 months?

Thanks

Pretty wild, I've seen that happen with ceramic cats but not steel. I've ran both in the past in WS stoves and had the ceramic cumbustor push out but not on either style steel cat. It looks like yours was made with 3 separate pieces of substrate and had walked out from expansion/contraction. Keep us posted on what BK says.

 

[jdonna]

I got a little happy cleaning up the window gasket channel after replacing the window gasket and the studs happened to get a hair cut. I know it’s been discussed before grinding down the studs, figured I had nothing to lose.

View attachment 292297

Shameless bumping my own post here with an update. Seems to be no ill effect, if anything a much deeper crush on the gasket. Think I will get a far more adjustment down the road too.

I replaced it with an oem BK gasket and had a slight smoke leak out of the bottom corner, put up with it two fires. Ripped it out and got a dual density tight weaved 7/8" gasket locally.

When I first got the stove, I had the exact same issue and switched to that style gasket and the problem was solved. Also, I moved the but joint away from the hinge corner.

It's taken a couple of very hot fires to burn the silicone stink out. I used Meeco's high temp red RTV this time around couldn't get my hands on copper rtv locally that I used last time. Kind of wished I had the ultra copper, I don't remember the nasty off gassing that this stuff has let out.

Second, I replaced the window gasket, ordered from BK, its a denser wider weave than the original, no ill effect on the retainers, the overlap process in the manual was a challenge due the gasket being thicker.

Hopefully this info will help someone out down the road.

 

[Diabel]

To me it looks like a production issue. We have seen few beat up cats (funny) on this forum but never like this where the can separates from the rest.
Chris must be en route somewhere, I am sure he will chime in when available.

 

[BKVP]

Yes, landed late yesterday. Left Milwaukee and avoided that storm by 50 miles.

I'm not certain what happened there to the combustor. There is always some expansion and contraction in both ceramic and metal substrates. The interam combustor gasket usually expands to help avoid excess. However, looks like it transpired within the frame.

The dealer should contact Valley Comfort in Penticton B.C. to see what can be done for MissMac. Valley Comfort addresses warranty claims North of the border.

MissMac feel free to email me pictures, dealer name, stove serial number and your contact info. I can help get it to the proper desk for consideration.

 

[spudman99]

Simple question.

On a hot reload in the morning, sometimes I just don't have enough time for a proper char on the wood. Standard procedure with the bypass open, load, get cat active, close. With a raging fire, but only for 5 min or so I have turned down the thermostat to perhaps 3/4 and turn the fan down to med low and leave for work.

Any negatives thus from an incomplete char of dry wood (ash with bark on 50% of the pieces) and 4-6in splits? My guess is no issue but y'all are smarter than I.

 

[Tron]

Unlikely, I'd say. On a hot reload, the cat is (or should be) already in the active range. I usually reload, wait until the fire is fully established (5mins top) and then close bypass and dial down.

 

[Highbeam]

Simple question.

On a hot reload in the morning, sometimes I just don't have enough time for a proper char on the wood. Standard procedure with the bypass open, load, get cat active, close. With a raging fire, but only for 5 min or so I have turned down the thermostat to perhaps 3/4 and turn the fan down to med low and leave for work.

Any negatives thus from an incomplete char of dry wood (ash with bark on 50% of the pieces) and 4-6in splits? My guess is no issue but y'all are smarter than I.

Maybe you can tell us. I'm curious if you've noticed any drawbacks. I suspect most actual users do the same thing but BK enthusiasts on this site tend to let it bake a little longer for this "char" that is supposed to do something good.

 

[BKVP]

Simple question.

On a hot reload in the morning, sometimes I just don't have enough time for a proper char on the wood. Standard procedure with the bypass open, load, get cat active, close. With a raging fire, but only for 5 min or so I have turned down the thermostat to perhaps 3/4 and turn the fan down to med low and leave for work.

Any negatives thus from an incomplete char of dry wood (ash with bark on 50% of the pieces) and 4-6in splits? My guess is no issue but y'all are smarter than I.

Your "raging fire in 5 minutes" is the key to the success you may observe. If your wood is dry enough to get to a raging fire in 5 minutes, congratulations and THANK YOU for burning really well cared for firewood. I too can accomplish this in 5 minutes or less because my firewood that I am burning (Tamarack/Western Larch) has been C/S/S under cover for 4 years!

 

[Montanalocal]

Yea, that happens with me too. In fact, when loading, I can only get the first layer of splits in before good flames start licking up. It is hard to get a full load in. I never ever change my thermostat setting. I just leave it on its desired setting that I have found to be good. I just leave the door cracked open for about 3-5 minutes, then slam shut the bypass and the door and I am good to go.

Of course, I am burning super dry Ponderosa pine that has been dead for over 7 years.

 

[Tron]

I guess it depends as much on the moisture/structure of the firewood as it depends on how many coals are still left.
With a well-established coal bed and splits that are actually splits and not only small round ones, they catch almost instantly and having a "raging fire" in 5 minutes is the norm and not the exception.

 

[Highbeam]

Even from a cold start, once the fire is raging enough to close the bypass it is raging enough to overtemp the chimney a short time later. That is, with my dry Douglas fir. I just have to assume that dense hardwoods from back east behave differently or else the manual wouldn’t ask for such a long char period.

 

[BKVP]

Even from a cold start, once the fire is raging enough to close the bypass it is raging enough to overtemp the chimney a short time later. That is, with my dry Douglas fir. I just have to assume that dense hardwoods from back east behave differently or else the manual wouldn’t ask for such a long char period.

Piece size also is key.

 

[stoveliker]

Yea, that happens with me too. In fact, when loading, I can only get the first layer of splits in before good flames start licking up. It is hard to get a full load in. I never ever change my thermostat setting. I just leave it on its desired setting that I have found to be good. I just leave the door cracked open for about 3-5 minutes, then slam shut the bypass and the door and I am good to go.

Of course, I am burning super dry Ponderosa pine that has been dead for over 7 years.

I'm surprised by this and the approval of @BKVP. If my cat is in the active range upon reload, and fire starts immediately (as you noted), I never keep my door open. It provides cold air, hindering the best combustion and cooling the cat (yes, also if the bypass is open).

If extra air is needed, the best way is to do that through the designed air supply which preheats the air.

Regarding charring time, I do it until all is burning (at least in the front as I can't see in the back with a full load and flames in the front...). For pine at 15 pct that is a couple of minutes. For oak at 18 pct, it spreads a bit slower (often it catches in on e corner, and the fire there seems to suck enough air that it won't catch from the coals at the other side but slowly needs to spread there).

I think I have a bit too much draft (not measured yet) so I often do this initial phase at 4-5 pm on the swoosh because if I do it fully open, the flue probe will get out of range in 10 minutes.

 

[BKVP]

I'm surprised by this and the approval of @BKVP. If my cat is in the active range upon reload, and fire starts immediately (as you noted), I never keep my door open. It provides cold air, hindering the best combustion and cooling the cat (yes, also if the bypass is open).

If extra air is needed, the best way is to do that through the designed air supply which preheats the air.

Regarding charring time, I do it until all is burning (at least in the front as I can't see in the back with a full load and flames in the front...). For pine at 15 pct that is a couple of minutes. For oak at 18 pct, it spreads a bit slower (often it catches in on e corner, and the fire there seems to suck enough air that it won't catch from the coals at the other side but slowly needs to spread there).

I think I have a bit too much draft (not measured yet) so I often do this initial phase at 4-5 pm on the swoosh because if I do it fully open, the flue probe will get out of range in 10 minutes.

3-5 minutes is acceptable, although dialing up the thermostat is also an option.