I've just about had it with this boiler. I know my Adobe has issues but I read about all the others and you all have issues also. The gasser are just to complicated and require to much babysitting. Unless you buy a frohling, they all seem to be hard to light smoky an d definitely not wife friendly. Do I have this wrong?? Maybe a Garn for 10000+. I will have a whole setup for sale come spring, Boiler 1000 gallon storage misc. I have lots of wood that could be cut but I also have bins full of dry corn, sure seems like a lot less hastle to me. Maybe I'm just changing problems. A lot less dollars to change it out, than buying a new gasser.
About ready to pull the plug.
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Good luck with your sale. If the price is right I'm sure you'll make someone a very happy wood burner....
I may be on the same path as you. And have seen the benifits of corn/pellet usage. I am looking into pellet boiler setups. You could still retain your storage. May be something to think about.
curious, how much "tending" is too much babysitting? Don't think you can paint them all with that broad of a brush though. I visit mine 3 times a day...probably could get it to twice a day but I actually like the "visit"....smoke issue for me has been eliminated and I have not had to actually light a fire in weeks(just use the coals to get going again). To each his own though...I had thought about pellets but price cannot be controlled by me as wood can...never knew enough about corn to consider it.
When you compare to a Froling they are all hard to light as you say. It looks like you could light 5" splits with a match. To answer your question I think you have it wrong. The Atmos is very user friendly although you can't just light it & walk away. I think you are on the right track with your upcoming Adobe sale. You might want to consider another gasser though, Randymuleman51 said:
I don't know, I load my tarm full with wood, light through the bottom door, ten minutes or so I slam in the damper and walk away. I don't know how much easier it can get.
Have you seen the Froling video on Youtube? Thats how easy it can get. It sounds like your Tarm is like my Atmos, it does need some tending for about 10 minutes. I'm not sure the thread starter is willing to spend the 10 minutes. Tarm is one of the quality boilers he should consider though, Randychuck172 said:
It is very easy to baby sit my eko 25. I am learning how to load it up, stir the coals, shut the door and forget about it for 5- 9 hours. Load it at 7 am, 3:30 my 12 yr old puts a few in, I get home at 5 and put a few in and 9:30 pm I load it and forget about it unless something seems weird like when I can't get the heat i want and is Usually bridging.
I know I felt that way my first year of burning.
These days I fire up anytime I want to, even in the single digit wheather, unless I run my garage loop when working on a project. My refire lasts probably 5 minutes, but a new fire during the shoulder season does take longer and is smokier. It is not always so easy a cave man can do it, but it can be close if things are set up correctly.
I no nothing about the atmos boiler, but if I can assist at all I'd be glad to.
These days I fire up anytime I want to, even in the single digit wheather, unless I run my garage loop when working on a project. My refire lasts probably 5 minutes, but a new fire during the shoulder season does take longer and is smokier. It is not always so easy a cave man can do it, but it can be close if things are set up correctly.
I no nothing about the atmos boiler, but if I can assist at all I'd be glad to.
The forum has been hijacked by gasser users. Anyone who disagrees, immediately they jump on you. My terrible, conventional boiler, with storage is maybe 60 - 65% efficient. Burns clean, no problems, definatly no babysitting. Just fill it up a couple of times per day. I know, I know, everbody will be outraged that I think I am getting 60% +, but I am.
Boiler, 1400 gal storage, building and plumbing under $7000. I live in Alberta, Southern, not much colder than most of you, but longer winter. 2200 Sq.ft x 2 floors (walkout basement) and I never burn 10 cords. Also heats DHW for 7 people. Is my house insulated well, you betcha, so is my storage (2 ft blown in fiber). I also have 60 evacuated solar tube system providing DHW in summer. It was not that expensive either. I cut the majority of my own wood, pine and poplar. I can buy for $150 a cord. Even if I bought the wood I can heat water and house for $1200 to $1300 a year. Not to shabby for a crappy non-gassifier boiler.
If you really look into the efficiency rating of any boiler it is with special wood, certain size, specific moisture, etc. Real world, not nearly as good. Most folks can't burn oak. So if you are getting 75% 0r 80% and spent upwards of $12000.00 where is the saving?
Robby
Boiler, 1400 gal storage, building and plumbing under $7000. I live in Alberta, Southern, not much colder than most of you, but longer winter. 2200 Sq.ft x 2 floors (walkout basement) and I never burn 10 cords. Also heats DHW for 7 people. Is my house insulated well, you betcha, so is my storage (2 ft blown in fiber). I also have 60 evacuated solar tube system providing DHW in summer. It was not that expensive either. I cut the majority of my own wood, pine and poplar. I can buy for $150 a cord. Even if I bought the wood I can heat water and house for $1200 to $1300 a year. Not to shabby for a crappy non-gassifier boiler.
If you really look into the efficiency rating of any boiler it is with special wood, certain size, specific moisture, etc. Real world, not nearly as good. Most folks can't burn oak. So if you are getting 75% 0r 80% and spent upwards of $12000.00 where is the saving?
Robby
Funny, I was thinking of posting a "I love my Tarm" thread, just because. It's doing as advertised, on track to heat a 2500 sq ft house in Maine and all my hot water with no more than 5 cords or so. Yesterday I managed to skip the morning fire, but worst case in the coldest weather is a fire in the morning and another in the evening, perhaps with a final stoking before bed. Lighting is rarely a problem.
Holy cow Robbie.
I read this thread and no one bashed your kind of boiler. Is atmos a gasser or a OWB? Maybe I will double check again, I did not remember any kind of gasser hijak feel.
Let me ask, if you have a OWB, why do you have all the storage? Sounds like a sweet solar setup.
I read this thread and no one bashed your kind of boiler. Is atmos a gasser or a OWB? Maybe I will double check again, I did not remember any kind of gasser hijak feel.
Let me ask, if you have a OWB, why do you have all the storage? Sounds like a sweet solar setup.
Robby; We are a nice friendly bunch of gasser users. I ran a non gasser for 10 years. There is nothing wrong with your setup that works well for you. I have one of the cheaper lower end gassers & I'm happy with it. That's all that counts, RandyRobby said:
Hello Barnartist,
Nope just a regular HArman SF360 in it's own building outside the house. Keeps the mess outside. MAYBE JUST A BAD DAY, but everytime someone mentions conventional boiler a dozen people jump in and sometimes on.
No motors, no blowers, no computer controls. Doesn't matter when the power goes out. (I do have automatic backup for entire system as the solar is VERY touchy about sunny day and no pump running). I run between 140F and 190F, gives over 500,000 BTU storage. I am convinced that is the secret of any solid fuel boiler. You can adjust for your wood, your pump flow, etc. until clean as possible burn.
Nope just a regular HArman SF360 in it's own building outside the house. Keeps the mess outside. MAYBE JUST A BAD DAY, but everytime someone mentions conventional boiler a dozen people jump in and sometimes on.
No motors, no blowers, no computer controls. Doesn't matter when the power goes out. (I do have automatic backup for entire system as the solar is VERY touchy about sunny day and no pump running). I run between 140F and 190F, gives over 500,000 BTU storage. I am convinced that is the secret of any solid fuel boiler. You can adjust for your wood, your pump flow, etc. until clean as possible burn.
Robby said:
I used to run a hot air/ wood furnace that was about as stone age as you could get (and I'd chosen it on that basis-- NO electronics, and could even work, in a pinch, as a gravity arrangement in a power failure. Between that and my gravity spring water supply, I was Y2K ready before anyone even thought of that! Brand is Sam Daniels, and they last for generations; efficiency is decent as it has a convoluted flame path through so it's relatively efficient given its simplicity. Whenever I heard of gasifiers/ storage I thought "interesting, but over-expensive and over complicated." But it was hard to keep much heat going without steady tending and lots of wood. That meant oil heat kicked on during the night, or when I was away during the day.
Then I saw a GARN that a fellow put in about a mile from here. When I saw how much heat it made with only a fraction of the wood I'd need to use to heat my place, I suddenly realized that I could burn less wood, say a total goodbye to oil bills, and be more comfortable than ever before. And my Econoburn does just that. I burn less wood in a day, for my total heating needs, than I used to in just a few hours. The only attention my flue needs is to remove some pale gray fly ash from the sideways run from the boiler to the chimney-- no need for "chimney sweeping."
So, I started as a total skeptic of gasifiers and complex systems; now I am sold on them. I detest complexity for complexity's sake, and am a Luddite/ less is more person in many of my technological preferences, but in this case, more really does yield more.
Hey Pyro,
I got no problem with gassification, in fact when I need a new boiler I would most likely buy one. Garn, they look like the best, but a huge beast and need to have it's own building (and that's not out of the question). Econoburn, also made North America, seem to be good as any. I am Canadian and there are a couple made here. Looked at Portage and Main at a farm show. Looks good and made by a reputable company. 1/2 my family are U.S. therefore I like both.
Why then, when the whole system is going in the crapper do folks insist on foreign made. Just a little ripple and no parts, and I do believe a big ripple is still coming.
I got no problem with gassification, in fact when I need a new boiler I would most likely buy one. Garn, they look like the best, but a huge beast and need to have it's own building (and that's not out of the question). Econoburn, also made North America, seem to be good as any. I am Canadian and there are a couple made here. Looked at Portage and Main at a farm show. Looks good and made by a reputable company. 1/2 my family are U.S. therefore I like both.
Why then, when the whole system is going in the crapper do folks insist on foreign made. Just a little ripple and no parts, and I do believe a big ripple is still coming.
A Seton type of wood fired boilers is about a forgiving a solid fuel burner as they come. So..... it, sounds like you would be better served with an augur based machine.
Most folks find auger machine do a nice job; often they can light themselves and can be controlled by a simple thermostat. Some of them even come with a remote control, how cool is that.
Most folks find auger machine do a nice job; often they can light themselves and can be controlled by a simple thermostat. Some of them even come with a remote control, how cool is that.
Robby said:
LOL, as they say . . . who pizzed in your beer?? :coolsmile:
Personally I think 2 terms we use here are a bit 'controversial'.
1) Gasifier, gasser, etc. Honestly, that term is probably pretty close to bull shi+. Instead of using that not too well defined term, I prefer to use a descriptive term. The term I prefer for my GreenWood (similar to the OP's Adobe I believe) is Refractory Mass natural Draft.
2)Efficiency ratings. Also pretty much bull s|-|it. Who and how determined? Over the life of the season, life of the load, or a snapshot in time during the load? Overall, or some other measure?
But as far as jumpin' peeps . . . Most don't consider my GW to be a 'gassifier', and probably not an OWB (though, it is Outside my residence, it is fueled by Wood and it Boils water -when the electric goes out- so maybe it is an OWB :coolsmirk: ) I think the only people here that ever jumped me are salesmen or were salesmen in the past. And we all know salesmen lie >:-(
Can't speak for anyone else, but I like hearing about what other peeps setups are so I can get ideas. Here in Upstate NY I see ALOTTA' OWB . . . despite their reputations, I think many of them burn fairly clean. I've decided it depends more on the operator than on the unit.
Well, I think everyone is awake now! Anyway Robby, I don't believe there are too many folks on the forum who are prejudiced against non-gassers. What we do tend to jump on is someone who cuts their wood in the morning and burns it later in the same evening, maybe with a tire or jug of used motor oil mixed in to balance things out. Personally, I spend most of my time on the forum reading what others have done to improve their systems, hoping to pick something up along the way. I've seen lots of good info from non-gasser owners. I would also would be happy to pass something along to others (although that's far less likely :lol
. Your comment on buying US/Canada was well-taken. I used that as my tiebreaker in the selection process. However; foreign units such as Tarm and EKO have excellent track records. You can't fault people for trying to get the best that's available. Our two countries need to step up to the plate and produce more high quality, competitively priced boilers and furnaces. If we can't make our own clothes anymore, maybe we can send boilers to China.
Jimbo, I think you said it last. Quality is what makes a good boiler. I had an outdoor stainless boiler with a leak after three months. I also have a friend that has never had a problem. Most people with Adobes have lots of problems. By building my own Seton clone, I was able to build and change it so it works and lasts a long time. I think some companies are looking for that bottom dollar vs. quality.
Yeah the adobe's and seton's had lots of problems. My sister has a conventional wood furnace but she uses a pile of wood even though her thermostat is at 50 F.
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