Advice for my new Jotul F 500:

[Panic]

Hi: First I would like to thank everyone on this forum it has been a great resource for us choosing a stove and with the installation process. We have broken in our stove and today was our first day really burning, I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with?

1) The stove seems to be pilling up with coals. Should I try to burn them off some so there is more room in the box.
2) we are running the stove between 350-400 degrees according to the thermometer on the stove top, is this a good burning temp for the stove
3) I am still smelling a little smoke, how long does the burn off process take? I am a little paranoid that maybe smoke is leaking in from one of the gaskets is there a way to check for any smoke leakage. Also, the flue collar is connected to an elbow that is crimped. Is it possible that smoke could leak from where the flu collar is connected to that crimped end?
4) How tight should the sets screws in the flu collar be against the elbow coming out?

Thanks again for all the help!
Panic

 

[begreen]

Stove should be run a bit hotter. That will help get the burn off done. Assuming that the break in fire period is over, you want to get the stove up to around at least 450-500. Secondary burning is only going to begin at those stove top temps.

Rake the coals to the front and center and open up the air to burn them down a bit. Then, with the next load of wood, after it gets burning well, don't close down the air as soon or as much. Try for 500 °F stove top temp. It may go a bit higher, but don't worry the stove can take it very easily. When it gets cold outside and you want heat, it will run at 650 all day long.

 

[ansehnlich1]

Hi: First I would like to thank everyone on this forum it has been a great resource for us choosing a stove and with the installation process. We have broken in our stove and today was our first day really burning, I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with?

1) The stove seems to be pilling up with coals. Should I try to burn them off some so there is more room in the box.
2) we are running the stove between 350-400 degrees according to the thermometer on the stove top, is this a good burning temp for the stove
3) I am still smelling a little smoke, how long does the burn off process take? I am a little paranoid that maybe smoke is leaking in from one of the gaskets is there a way to check for any smoke leakage. Also, the flue collar is connected to an elbow that is crimped. Is it possible that smoke could leak from where the flu collar is connected to that crimped end?
4) How tight should the sets screws in the flu collar be against the elbow coming out?

Thanks again for all the help!
Panic

NO NEED TO PANIC

coals can sometimes be a problem, try burning one split on top the coal bed with the air wide open, when that burns down, try another if needed. I've also been known to just shovel 'em out into a covered bucket and take 'em outside in order to clear room for more wood

you are burning too cool in my opinion. i burn up to 600/650 one time each day and just try to keep it around 500 otherwise.

it's unlikely you'll have smoke leak OUT of your stove, you may still be smelling some "burnoff" of the flux, cement, paint, etc. each time you reach a new "high heat" level you'll smell that smell. you can try the dollar bill test when cool, placing a bill in the ash pan door, or another door, closing it, then trying to pull the bill out, but it doesn't sound to me as though you have a problem

sometimes i get a whiff of smoke from just opening the door to load, i only use the side door, and if there are coals/splits close to the opening there sure is to be a bit of smoke escape....open the door slowly when preparing to load.

some of my screws aren't tight, in fact i think a couple of 'em are stripped, so they just go round and round and round! If you're piping is fitted tightly the screws will hold things in place ok. if you have a long vertical run of pipe with numerous connections i'd be more concerned.

nice stove by the way!

 

[firefighterjake]

Hi: First I would like to thank everyone on this forum it has been a great resource for us choosing a stove and with the installation process. We have broken in our stove and today was our first day really burning, I have a few questions maybe someone could help me with?

1) The stove seems to be pilling up with coals. Should I try to burn them off some so there is more room in the box. If and when you're reaching the point where you have so many coals in the firebox that it's a challenge to load up more than a few splits or rounds and you still want to keep the fire going you can do one of several things: a) just open up the air control and let the fire rip or b) even better is to throw on a small split or two and open up the air control . . . and in no time your coals will almost magically disappear . . . you can also shovel them out, but I wouldn't do that since coals are untapped BTUs so why shovel them out . . . wait until they turn to ash. Incidentally, if you're getting a lot of coals it could mean that you're reloading the firebox a little early . . . try waiting a bit longer before reloading.

2) we are running the stove between 350-400 degrees according to the thermometer on the stove top, is this a good burning temp for the stove Ideally, you will want to run the stove top a bit hotter. The Oslo really tends to like cruising at 450-550 degrees stove top . . . I generally take it up to the higher temp whenever possible -- the secondaries and heat you get as it burns off the products in the smoke are mind-blowing. You'll get some secondary action with the temps you're describing, but once you see what the Oslo can and will do at these slightly higher temps . . . you'll think you're looking into the Bowels of Hell . . . and getting some mighty fine heat . . . the secondaries will last longer and be very intense once you've gone to the higher temp.

3) I am still smelling a little smoke, how long does the burn off process take? I am a little paranoid that maybe smoke is leaking in from one of the gaskets is there a way to check for any smoke leakage. Also, the flue collar is connected to an elbow that is crimped. Is it possible that smoke could leak from where the flu collar is connected to that crimped end? Anything is possible . . . what you will find is as the stove reaches a slightly higher temp, each time you will get that new paint burning off smell . . . oftentimes not quite as notable. If you're smelling smoke you could have a potential problem with your draft. As mentioned you can use a dollar bill and put it in the doors with part of it sticking out . . . if you can easily pull out the dollar bill with no resistance you may have a problem. A slight resistance or being unable to pull the bill out at all indicates good gaskets. It is possible that smoke could be leaking out of the crimped chimney . . . a picture showing this possible area of concern would help us determine if this is a non-issue or potential issue. In general about the only time I smell smoke from the stove is either a) when I'm outside or b) if temps are high outside and I open the stove door without getting a good draft established.

4) How tight should the sets screws in the flu collar be against the elbow coming out? Finger tight should be fine . . . assuming you're talking about the large set screws on the stove collar.

Thanks again for all the help!
Panic

 

[cycloxer]

1) The stove seems to be pilling up with coals.
2) we are running the stove between 350-400 degrees

Run the stove hotter. Get it up to 600 degrees at least a couple of times. Optimal burn is 400-600 degrees according to Jotul.

3) I am still smelling a little smoke, how long does the burn off process take?

If you spike to 650-700 it will help burn off that gawd aweful paint smell quicker. As my friend described it: now your house smells like a hardware store. Should be gone in < 1 week.

4) How tight should the sets screws in the flu collar be against the elbow coming out?

Actually these are not intended as set screws. The proper installation is to insert the stove pipe (or elbow in your case) into the stove collar as tight as possible and to then drill into your stove pipe with a 3/16" or 7/32" bit. The screws can then tightened all of the way and stove cement should be used around the pipe-collar joint for good measure.

 

[mikepinto65]

What size splits are you burning? I have some mixed hardwood I received for free that is mostly 16-18", even a few 14". I noticed if I pack the stove with 16-18" splits my stove top thermo dosn't read "true" and will take an eternity to read 500. I have to move the thermo over towards the center a few inches, just above where the log is sitting in the stove. I feel this is a much better reading imo.

 

[Valhalla]

Burn it hotter! It is a very strong and stabile heater.
Add more fuel, after all it is winter.

 

[webby3650]

1) The stove seems to be pilling up with coals.
2) we are running the stove between 350-400 degrees

Run the stove hotter. Get it up to 600 degrees at least a couple of times. Optimal burn is 400-600 degrees according to Jotul.

3) I am still smelling a little smoke, how long does the burn off process take?

If you spike to 650-700 it will help burn off that gawd aweful paint smell quicker. As my friend described it: now your house smells like a hardware store. Should be gone in < 1 week.

4) How tight should the sets screws in the flu collar be against the elbow coming out?

Actually these are not intended as set screws. The proper installation is to insert the stove pipe (or elbow in your case) into the stove collar as tight as possible and to then drill into your stove pipe with a 3/16" or 7/32" bit. The screws can then tightened all of the way and stove cement should be used around the pipe-collar joint for good measure.

I have never heard of using stove cement around a connection like you suggest, I think using stove cement would indicate a problem with a connection, not to mention a real bear when disassembling to clean.

 

[cycloxer]

I have never heard of using stove cement around a connection like you suggest, I think using stove cement would indicate a problem with a connection

Well how do you seal the joint?

Rutland Furnace Cement - "Seals metal to metal. Ideal for bonding joints less than 1/8". Seals flues. Seals joints smoke and gas tight."

I'm just reading it off of the container. It took about 1 minute to do this and I know the pipe is perfectly sealed. Cheap insurance. You could also use a gasket rope as Jotul recommends. I had virtually no gap and no rope would fit in there.

 

[potter]

One thing to think about is heating in full 'cycles'. As others have said you seem to be a little low in your temps. Running at 5-600 will put more heat into the space, then let the coals burn further (maybe 2-250 on top?) before adding more wood. The point is that its not a gas furnace with continuous equal temps and you will increase coaling if you try to run it at one temp. This has just been my personal experience as I have gone to 24/7 heating.

 

[webby3650]

I have never heard of using stove cement around a connection like you suggest, I think using stove cement would indicate a problem with a connection

Well how do you seal the joint?

Rutland Furnace Cement - "Seals metal to metal. Ideal for bonding joints less than 1/8". Seals flues. Seals joints smoke and gas tight."

I'm just reading it off of the container. It took about 1 minute to do this and I know the pipe is perfectly sealed. Cheap insurance. You could also use a gasket rope as Jotul recommends. I had virtually no gap and no rope would fit in there.

I have no rope and no cement and no gap on my connection. If the chimney draws as it should, smoke should be pulled up the chimney, not spilling out. The only problem would be in the event of a flue fire it could pull air in to fuel the fire, just as it would at every connector pipe joint.

 

[cycloxer]

I'm just tellin ya how Jotul says to install their stove. From page 18 of the GB manual,

Note! It is important that the joints are completely sealed. Air leakage etc. may lead to malfunction.

I don't know how you completely seal a metal-metal joint w/o a gasket or sealant.

The biggest thing is that those bolt holes should be drilled out and the screws installed for safety. Otherwise you are relying on friction of a tapered joint to hold the stove pipe end in place. That doesn't work too well. As you point out, if the stove is opertating properly, this shouldn't be a problem. However, you want to have that pipe secured so that if you have a bad event occur you know it is not coming out of the stove. This is the same reason why 3 stove pipe screws are required at every joint.

 

[xman23]

I prefer to have a good bed of coals. Charcoaled wood is where all wood needs to get to before it will burn. The hot bed keeps the stove temp consistent as new load burns up and down. IMO the coals burn hotter and cleaner than the splits. My ideal stove temp is the temp needed to produce the heat required, and no more. I know that may sound different from how others explain what is the ideal burn temp. I control the stove temp by the load size and split stack in the stove. I adjust the air control to create a burn cycle that does not cause smoldering wood.

If the stove is new it will smell ever time you hit a new high temp level. One unusual source of a smoke smell in the house is from a open window. I get when the wind is blowing from a window at the other end of the house.

 

[Skier76]

Interesting about sealing the pipe to the collar. I've just got mine set in there firmly and I tightened the bolts a bit. I was careful about not overtightening them and bending the pipe.

 

[cycloxer]

I've just got mine set in there firmly and I tightened the bolts a bit

You know, I did that at first too. Then my engineering brain kicked in and I said, something does not seem right. Then I read the GB installation instructions. Jotul has a lot of good info that they put in the Euro manual which for some bizarre reason did not make it into the USA version.

I am not a pro stove installer and I am not trying to tell people what to do. It's your house and your stove, do what you want. The installer at my shop said he never seals the flue pipe to the stove. He just shoves the stove pipe in as far as it will go and lets the draft take care of things. The owner of the shop smiled when he heard this conversation, handed me a container of furnace cement, and said, use this if you want to do it the right way. What does it all mean? Umm, if you have a good draft, a perfect seal is prob not required. If you want to do it the right way, seal the pipe and drill the holes.

 

[Skier76]

That's some interesting advice. Maybe I'll give this a shot....

 

[potter]

I'd like to hear from more regulars about this flue cement thing- BG< Jake, specific to the Oslo. Mine is not cemented.

 

[begreen]

IIRC, for our install (not using a liner) the DVL pipe just bolted right on to the stove collar. I don't remember cementing it.

 

[logger]

Mine is not cemented and I don't feel this is necessarily the "right way" to do it for everybody. I have a nice tight fit, but can still disconnect my pipe and tape a bag around it when I sweep the pipe clean from the roof. How do you guys clean your pipe if its cemented to the stove?

 

[cycloxer]

How do you guys clean your pipe if its cemented to the stove?

On the F 400 you can remove the secondary air chamber assembly through the front door w/o unbolting anything. You have full access to the flue collar and stove pipe.

 

[tutu_sue]

Let her get at least 400 stove top before you start turning down the air. When I start getting too many coals I go to 475 before turning down and that seems to help.

 

[ansehnlich1]

ain't no furnace cement in mine and it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

 

[hardcore]

ain't no furnace cement in mine and it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

No furnace cement in mine either. I am using double wall pipe though and boy what a pain in the arse for me to get a nice fit on that flue collar. Don't ask me how your supposed to cement the flue pipe with the double wall hanging over the outside of the flue collar.

 

[firefighterjake]

No cement used here either . . . good tight fit for me. That said, come Spring I may at the very least drill out the hole for the bolts . . . to me that kind of makes sense . . . even though I have had no issues with it so far (of course I also have gravity working with me as there is a 3 foot length of double wall pipe coming straight up from the stove/pipe collar.

 

[JeffRey30747]

No cement on mine either. I'm not worried about drilling the pipe for the bolts because I have to slide the stove over a few inches just to be able to remove the pipe for cleaning.