Are Wood Stoves Going the Way of the Horse and Buggy?

[Parallax982]

I ask because, when I first moved to my current home, there were numerous wood stove stores and showrooms in the small city where I live. Now there are none.

My son buys, rehabs and sells homes in the Silicon Valley region of California. He was recently showing me a home he's working on. It's a high end home that has fireplaces on three floors, including one free standing in the master bedroom. Once thought the height of luxury, a futuristic stove on a hearth pad surrounded by plush carpet, he tells me he's going to just pull it out. The other stoves will be converted into electronic screens that simulate fireplace flames. He explained that it's not legal to burn wood in that area anymore.

From a heating standpoint, mini-split heat pump technology has displaced much of the demand for wood.

Where I live, it's still legal to burn, assuming one's stove meets applicable code or was grandfathered in under earlier codes. Modern stoves are super expensive. I know because we recently replaced ours and I paid a small fortune. I still think it's great to have a wood stove. The ambiance is amazing. But whereas we once heated our home with it, we now just use it to supplement. I have a wood supply that would have once been enough for a couple of years. Now it should last into the indefinite future.

To young people like my adult children, my stove is a sort of sentimental curiosity, like having a piano in the living room. Not something they would particularly value for themselves, though they enjoy it when they visit if we fire it up.

I'm wondering what others think and have experienced. Are we wood stove aficionados a kind of dinosaur?

 

[Whitenuckler]

I ask because, when I first moved to my current home, there were numerous wood stove stores and showrooms in the small city where I live. Now there are none.

My son buys, rehabs and sells homes in the Silicon Valley region of California. He was recently showing me a home he's working on. It's a high end home that has fireplaces on three floors, including one free standing in the master bedroom. Once thought the height of luxury, a futuristic stove on a hearth pad surrounded by plush carpet, he tells me he's going to just pull it out. The other stoves will be converted into electronic screens that simulate fireplace flames. He explained that it's not legal to burn wood in that area anymore.

From a heating standpoint, mini-split heat pump technology has displaced much of the demand for wood.

Where I live, it's still legal to burn, assuming one's stove meets applicable code or was grandfathered in under earlier codes. Modern stoves are super expensive. I know because we recently replaced ours and I paid a small fortune. I still think it's great to have a wood stove. The ambiance is amazing. But whereas we once heated our home with it, we now just use it to supplement. I have a wood supply that would have once been enough for a couple of years. Now it should last into the indefinite future.

To young people like my adult children, my stove is a sort of sentimental curiosity, like having a piano in the living room. Not something they would particularly value for themselves, though they enjoy it when they visit if we fire it up.

I'm wondering what others think and have experienced. Are we wood stove aficionados a kind of dinosaur?

I think your right. The newer generations have not grown up with campfires, wood stoves ect. If you ask them a question about Tick Tok or whatever or how to use your phone, they are very familiar. I know the younger generation is not all same, and parents ect are all not the same, but we can see the trend. If I said - OK - lets change the engine oil and spark plugs, a younger guy or next generation may ask Why? We don't have that now. Burning wood was required, as there was no choice. But that was a long time ago

 

[bholler]

I ask because, when I first moved to my current home, there were numerous wood stove stores and showrooms in the small city where I live. Now there are none.

My son buys, rehabs and sells homes in the Silicon Valley region of California. He was recently showing me a home he's working on. It's a high end home that has fireplaces on three floors, including one free standing in the master bedroom. Once thought the height of luxury, a futuristic stove on a hearth pad surrounded by plush carpet, he tells me he's going to just pull it out. The other stoves will be converted into electronic screens that simulate fireplace flames. He explained that it's not legal to burn wood in that area anymore.

From a heating standpoint, mini-split heat pump technology has displaced much of the demand for wood.

Where I live, it's still legal to burn, assuming one's stove meets applicable code or was grandfathered in under earlier codes. Modern stoves are super expensive. I know because we recently replaced ours and I paid a small fortune. I still think it's great to have a wood stove. The ambiance is amazing. But whereas we once heated our home with it, we now just use it to supplement. I have a wood supply that would have once been enough for a couple of years. Now it should last into the indefinite future.

To young people like my adult children, my stove is a sort of sentimental curiosity, like having a piano in the living room. Not something they would particularly value for themselves, though they enjoy it when they visit if we fire it up.

I'm wondering what others think and have experienced. Are we wood stove aficionados a kind of dinosaur?

The simple answer is no. Those of us in the industry are busier than ever. Now of course there will be regional differences. And the type of work we do changes quite a bit based on the economy. But I work for lots of late 20s/early 30s customers.

 

[Parallax982]

I think your right. The newer generations have not grown up with campfires, wood stoves ect. If you ask them a question about Tick Tok or whatever or how to use your phone, they are very familiar. I know the younger generation is not all same, and parents ect are all not the same, but we can see the trend. If I said - OK - lets change the engine oil and spark plugs, a younger guy or next generation may ask Why? We don't have that now. Burning wood was required, as there was no choice. But that was a long time ago

I'm 62, so not super old but getting up there. It was a very different world we knew as children. Not better in every way. There were challenges and I'm not one who remembers everything in sepia tones. But with change, there is always loss. My son is familiar with engine oil and spark plugs but his main car is a Tesla. He has an old pickup truck with a stick shift. At 34, he's one of the few in his cohort who know how to drive one. I thought it important that he learn, and he's glad he did. His sister, who is five years older, refused. I set aside the car I bought for her and got another, saving the first for him, as I had a sense he would embrace the idea (though it was harder to learn to drive with that extra challenge).

 

[Parallax982]

The simple answer is no. Those of us in the industry are busier than ever. Now of course there will be regional differences. And the type of work we do changes quite a bit based on the economy. But I work for lots of late 20s/early 30s customers.

Has the industry changed over the last 10 or 15 years? If so, how? I'm wondering what happened to all the stove showrooms I used to see. Clearly, something has shifted. How have the demands changed? Has demand for wood stoves shifted to other types, such as gas? Of course environmental regulations are ever challenging I'm sure. What percentage of stoves are you selling to young people? Are most of your customers Boomers?

The cost of the stoves seems to have doubled since I bought my first one in 2013. Some of that is no doubt due to the cost of materials and labor. Is some of it due to a slackening in demand?

 

[bholler]

Has the industry changed over the last 10 or 15 years? If so, how? I'm wondering what happened to all the stove showrooms I used to see. Clearly, something has shifted. How have the demands changed? Has demand for wood stoves shifted to other types, such as gas? Of course environmental regulations are ever challenging I'm sure. What percentage of stoves are you selling to young people? Are most of your customers Boomers?

The cost of the stoves seems to have doubled since I bought my first one in 2013. Some of that is no doubt due to the cost of materials and labor. Is some of it due to a slackening in demand?

No the industry as a whole really hasn't changed that much in the past 10 to 15 years. Of course the 2020 emission standards change was a change and a few companies dropped out of the market. But overall it really didn't change that much. Of course prices have increased. Quite a bit with the first tariffs on Chinese steel (everyone raised their prices Chinese steel or not) then again with covid. And this year all the stoves i sell (Regency and SBI) went up 25% again because they are Canadian. And now we are supposedly loosing the tax credit. So time will tell.
I am now installing gas for allot of Boomers who are getting old to be processing wood. But installing or repairing allot of wood and coal for younger people.

 

[Parallax982]

No the industry as a whole really hasn't changed that much in the past 10 to 15 years. Of course the 2020 emission standards change was a change and a few companies dropped out of the market. But overall it really didn't change that much. Of course prices have increased. Quite a bit with the first tariffs on Chinese steel (everyone raised their prices Chinese steel or not) then again with covid. And this year all the stoves i sell (Regency and SBI) went up 25% again because they are Canadian. And now we are supposedly loosing the tax credit. So time will tell.

Thanks for your response. I hope you manage to pull through. Hopefully the tariffs will end and the tax credits will return in time.

Have you noticed any change in the demographics of those who purchase stoves?

 

[bholler]

Thanks for your response. I hope you manage to pull through. Hopefully the tariffs will end and the tax credits will return in time.

Have you noticed any change in the demographics of those who purchase stoves?

I edited and added that part. We will be fine stove sales is a small part of my buisness we mostly do maintenance and repairs

 

[Parallax982]

I edited and added that part. We will be fine stove sales is a small part of my buisness we mostly do maintenance and repairs

In my community, there were once a number of chimney sweeps who also did repairs but now we have just one. So he's very busy. Perhaps that's similar where you are.

 

[bholler]

In my community, there were once a number of chimney sweeps who also did repairs but now we have just one. So he's very busy. Perhaps that's similar where you are.

Yeah for a while it was just us. But another just opened up with a stove shop as well which makes me happy. There really is just to much work for us to get done.

 

[Parallax982]

Yeah for a while it was just us. But another just opened up with a stove shop as well which makes me happy. There really is just to much work for us to get done.

That's good to know. I'm glad the industry still exists. Things are changing, as they always do, and, as you said, time will tell.

 

[Whitenuckler]

The simple answer is no. Those of us in the industry are busier than ever. Now of course there will be regional differences. And the type of work we do changes quite a bit based on the economy. But I work for lots of late 20s/early 30s customers.

Nuclear power was once affordable until the US government started writing a new spec/requirement/law every week after 3 Mile Island in 79. If they wanted to, they could make a big roll of red tape for woodstoves too.

 

[Dieselhead]

If anything younger couples have different work ethic than older generations also, couples are working more and not able to take the time to secure and process firewood.

 

[Parallax982]

Yes, a lot of young people can't even dream of owning a home. I feel bad for them. Everything has gotten so expensive.

Nuclear power sort of veers into politics so I try to steer clear of it. That said, some of the modular units used in other countries seem promising, as a way of ensuring safety and keeping costs down. The waste remains an issue. Solar has really come a long way, though it still has its limitations, as does wind power and geothermal. If battery technology comes along, they alone could be adequate to produce the kind of large-scale power needed to run a modern nation. But it takes a lot of land for solar and wind. Perhaps a day will come when most every roof will hold inexpensive and efficient solar panels hooked to batteries that allow the power captured to be stored.

 

[Highbeam]

Yes, a lot of young people can't even dream of owning a home. I feel bad for them. Everything has gotten so expensive.

Nuclear power sort of veers into politics so I try to steer clear of it. That said, some of the modular units used in other countries seem promising, as a way of ensuring safety and keeping costs down. The waste remains an issue. Solar has really come a long way, though it still has its limitations, as does wind power and geothermal. If battery technology comes along, they alone could be adequate to produce the kind of large-scale power needed to run a modern nation. But it takes a lot of land for solar and wind. Perhaps a day will come when most every roof will hold inexpensive and efficient solar panels hooked to batteries that allow the power captured to be stored.

You’ve got to remember that you live in Bellingham. A liberal enclave and urban college town. Get out into the rural areas and you may find things are still quite busy with wood burners.

 

[bholler]

Nuclear power was once affordable until the US government started writing a new spec/requirement/law every week after 3 Mile Island in 79. If they wanted to, they could make a big roll of red tape for woodstoves too.

Yes they could. But its not going to happen.

 

[Parallax982]

You’ve got to remember that you live in Bellingham. A liberal enclave and urban college town. Get out into the rural areas and you may find things are still quite busy with wood burners.

The surrounding areas out in the county are a mirror image of Bellingham. Still, it seems all the wood stove showrooms and suppliers have closed. There's one place that keeps a small sampling. Down in Mount Vernon, there may still be a store or two. Not close to what once was. Wood heating was ubiquitous here, not that long ago. It's mostly been displaced now by heat pump systems, particularly mini-splits. It seems that all the new homes built have them.

 

[MRD1985]

As long as I’m physically able, I’ll be burning wood. The energy prices here are among the highest in the country. Not to mention I love the feel and aesthetics of wood heat. Only 40, so we’ll see how many years my body can endure swinging an axe.

 

[Ctwoodtick]

I think demand for wood stoves is mainly about location. The colder the area you live in, the more stove stores and demand. I’m in southern CT so it’s moderately cold in winter. I see a fair amount of woodpiles and Class A chimneys around here. When I’m up in Maine, I see a lot more.
I think the colder your climate, the more people that think it makes sense to use wood.

 

[Parallax982]

I think demand for wood stoves is mainly about location. The colder the area you live in, the more stove stores and demand. I’m in southern CT so it’s moderately cold in winter. I see a fair amount of woodpiles and Class A chimneys around here. When I’m up in Maine, I see a lot more.
I think the colder your climate, the more people that think it makes sense to use wood.

I think what you're saying has been true because, until recently, heat pumps didn't work in really cold environment and wood stoves were one of the most efficient ways (often the most efficient way) to heat a home. But now heat pumps have improved to the point that they can pull heat out of really cold air. Last I saw, down to something crazy (a negative Fahrenheit temperature). So I think we'll see more and more heat pumps in cold climates. I have two mini-split systems. The older one, from about seven years ago, becomes inefficient in the thirties. The new one, installed this past spring, goes down way lower than we'll ever need. I seem to recall the specs claiming negative 17 degrees but don't hold me to it.

 

[kborndale]

New heat pumps have gotten better and may produce heat down to -17 but it's not doing it as efficiently as it does operating in the 30s.

 

[Parallax982]

New heat pumps have gotten better and may produce heat down to -17 but it's not doing it as efficiently as it does operating in the 30s.

That's true. My old system goes down lower than the 30s. Supposedly it goes into the 20s. But I fire up the stove well before that because it feels like the heat pump compressor is struggling to keep up. When I fire up the stove, the heat pump then seems to hum along happily.

 

[Murray01]

I wonder if access to cheap/free wood has any bearing on who burns wood. I’m surrounded by crown land and firewood permits are free, my sister in southern Alberta is surrounded by privately owned ranch/farm land and has to find landowners who will allow her to cut firewood.

 

[djlew]

As a younger guy who purchased a wood stove, my decision to go with burning wood was pretty simple. Things have changed in my area now, but I got my stove because:

• My only available utility was electric which was and is still getting ridiculously pricey
• With that comes a single point of failure, so it's nice to be able to heat and cook when power is out
• Good exercise and "homestead" vibe when processing wood
• Lots of access to wood, fuel is a non issue
• Nothing beats a cold night fire with soup cooking on the wood stove

It was tough to find a stove dealer (had to go about 45 minutes away), but I have a few local chimney sweeps and repair folks. A lot of people burn wood in my area. It's changing because we just got access to natural gas but a lot of the older people around me aren't bothering to switch or add gas service. I got a gas furnace because I had a heat pump, and not a cold climate one, so essentially all of January and February I was running heat strips when not tending to the fire. Not sustainable.

I'm excited to still burn wood. I don't know a lot of people my age who enjoy it as much as I do but I also don't know a lot of people my age who own a home, especially in an area that it would make sense to burn wood. I have some friends and family who rent and the place has wood burning equipment but the lease states not to use it. I agree that it really depends on where you are geographically for it to make sense, and if younger people owned more homes in those types of areas I think the demand for wood would be the same. Just my thoughts.

 

[EbS-P]

They already did. People still have horses some working horses. Try and get insurance if wood is your only heat source. Most of the population moved on to central heat a century ago. What’s left is a small but solid market. I would liken in to carburetors in a way. Yes you can still buy them have them serviced but it’s old technology in a regulated era where emissions are strict.

They are not going to disappear bio mass heat makes cents for certain scenarios. If you tasked me with building a house any where the design temp was higher than say 5 degrees (look for self here ) I would not consider a wood stove in an urban/suburban setting. If more isolated and whether related power outages are a concern I might want a back up. Seriously look at that design temp PDF.

Well sealed, well insulated, with solar and battery backup would add say 10% or less to a new 2500 sq ft home cost. The biomass heat industry has benefited from tax credits and with those gone for the next few years it will become a less attractive option.