Brand New Hearth Extension...Annnnnnd it's Broken!

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Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
TLDR: I got a new hearth extension after realizing I had the wrong kind and my wife/kids broke it before I could even install it. Then got mad at me for being mad at them. Happy Valentines Day!

For those who enjoy the story:

When I first got my insert installed I was brand new to wood burning. The stove sticks out a fair amount onto the hearth due to my small and oddly angled fireplace so I needed a hearth extension to meet the 16" clearance from the door. He sold me a Ember King steel hearth pad for protection. It made sense to me and off I went. The installer never mentioned it either.

Fast forward to now where I've learned a ton about burning...mostly from here and then my own experience this season. I noticed how hot the hearth pad was getting when I put my hand on it to do something and had to pull back. Took out my IR gun and it was 140 ::F! Yikes. It sits right on my solid pine reclaimed hardwood floor...not good. I lifted it up and zapped the floor...125::F...very bad.

Doing some research I find out that the steel pad is a type 1 with an R value of 0 so no thermal protection. Looking in the stove manual it states pretty clearly what kind of protection is needed:

Screenshot_20210212-233351_Drive.jpg

Measurement E is what we're talking about...16" from the door, makes sense. But below it where it says IMPORTANT it clarifies that if the hearth height is below 4" the floor needs protection with an R value >= 1. My insert is on a standard brick hearth so it's only 2.25" above the floor. So, I clearly had the wrong type of protection. I needed a type 2 with thermal insulation.

Looking up my receipts the Ember King was $279! That's an expensive and dangerous whoopsie by both the dealer and the installer (two different companies). Im thankful nothing bad happened and the floor doesn't seem damaged. So I took it back to the dealer and explained what happened and thankfully they understood. I was ready for an argument but they were apologetic and took back the steel one. I didn't want a big thick legit hearth extention you'd sit a free standard on, I wanted low profile, so they set me up with a simple type 2 option with R = 1.56. It was inexpensive at $90 and will do the trick. Looking at it it was very brittle when not laying flat but if I could just get it into position it would be fine.

Ok good. We all know what happened next right? I put it down to get changed out of my work clothes before installing it and when I come down my 5 year old had gotten scissors and while my wife is folding laundry ***right next to him*** he opened the box while I'm upstairs. The thing is on the ground literally snapped in half. My brand new extension I researched and spent hours getting. Ugh. Of course it was my fault for leaving it out too...not the person who did it or was watching him!

Anyways. I hammered the metal casing back together the best I could. Im not in a position to throw away $90 for a new one while this will still work so I'm going to use it. That said its going to bother me every time I touch it and feel it's not attached right anymore...which is all the time.

So yeah, fun times. Here's a pic. You can clearly see where it snapped. She says it's flat and looks fine but it is sending my OCD into overdrive. I hate it. Oh well...c'est la vie!

20210213_141507.jpg
 
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moresnow

Minister of Fire
Jan 13, 2015
1,790
Iowa
If nothing else you have my wife laughing! A good thing!
 

marty319

Feeling the Heat
Nov 17, 2014
345
Belair mb
TLDR: I got a new hearth extension after realizing I had the wrong kind and my wife/kids broke it before I could even install it. Then got mad at me for being mad at them. Happy Valentines Day!

For those who enjoy the story:

When I first got my insert installed I was brand new to wood burning. The stove sticks out a fair amount onto the hearth due to my small and oddly angled fireplace so I needed a hearth extension to meet the 16" clearance from the door. He sold me a Ember King steel hearth pad for protection. It made sense to me and off I went. The installer never mentioned it either.

Fast forward to now where I've learned a ton about burning...mostly from here and then my own experience this season. I noticed how hot the hearth pad was getting when I put my hand on it to do something and had to pull back. Took out my IR gun and it was 140 ::F! Yikes. It sits right on my solid pine reclaimed hardwood floor...not good. I lifted it up and zapped the floor...125::F...very bad.

Doing some research I find out that the steel pad is a type 1 with an R value of 0 so no thermal protection. Looking in the stove manual it states pretty clearly what kind of protection is needed:

View attachment 274439

Measurement E is what we're talking about...16" from the door, makes sense. But below it where it says IMPORTANT it clarifies that if the hearth height is below 4" the floor needs protection with an R value >= 1. My insert is on a standard brick hearth so it's only 2.25" above the floor. So, I clearly had the wrong type of protection. I needed a type 2 with thermal insulation.

Looking up my receipts the Ember King was $279! That's an expensive and dangerous whoopsie by both the dealer and the installer (two different companies). Im thankful nothing bad happened and the floor doesn't seem damaged. So I took it back to the dealer and explained what happened and thankfully they understood. I was ready for an argument but they were apologetic and took back the steel one. I didn't want a big thick legit hearth extention you'd sit a free standard on, I wanted low profile, so they set me up with a simple type 2 option with R = 1.56. It was inexpensive at $90 and will do the trick. Looking at it it was very brittle when not laying flat but if I could just get it into position it would be fine.

Ok good. We all know what happened next right? I put it down to get changed out of my work clothes before installing it and when I come down my 5 year old had gotten scissors and while my wife is folding laundry ***right next to him*** he opened the box while I'm upstairs. The thing is on the ground literally snapped in half. My brand new extension I researched and spent hours getting. Ugh. Of course it was my fault for leaving it out too...not the person who did it or was watching him!

Anyways. I hammered the metal casing back together the best I could. Im not in a position to throw away $90 for a new one while this will still work so I'm going to use it. That said its going to bother me every time I touch it and feel it's not attached right anymore...which is all the time.

So yeah, fun times. Here's a pic. You can clearly see where it snapped. She says it's flat and looks fine but it is sending my OCD into overdrive. I hate it. Oh well...c'est la vie!

View attachment 274440
You sure that monster dog did not do that
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
It's funny how true it is that you can't have nice things when you have little kids...or giant dogs. I was gone for 3 minutes and within that time they managed to open, break it, then blame me ;lol.

Maybe I'll let Gordon "accidently" play with and destroy it over the summer summer we put it away. Whoops I was gone for 3 mins dunno what happened!

Ehhhh. It'll work just fine just look a little wonky if you look closely. I'm the only one who will notice. Not worth spending another $90 for some OCD. I'm just sad dad that the kids broke my new toy lol.
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
6,407
NE Ohio
I can't even tell there's anything wrong with it...but maybe some black furnace cement to repair it?
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
Its broken on the bottom. Imagine a piece of drywall with thin sheet metal wrapped over the top and tucked underneath the edges. Then snap it in half by stepping on the top while it's propped up. That's kind of what I assume happened or he fell on it. He's only 5 after all.

I was able to get the board material back together tightly but the metal on top doesn't really bend back to its original spot well. I can't over bend it back without breaking the board more so it's sort of up off the board a touch now and has a little dent.

I mean you and my wife are right you can barely tell but I'm the one who uses it all the time and I notice! It's still fully functional so I'm just going to get over it in a few days. Maybe it'll help me long term manage my wood OCD lol.

Just gotta be really careful moving and storing it in the off-season. Or an "accident" may happen. ;lol
 
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vatmark

Member
Jan 5, 2017
92
Nebo NC
Love your puppy. Dock your 5 year olds allowance;lol My 4 year old at the time dropped nails down plumbing pipes in our previous house when it was under construction. He got a few down before we realized what he was doing. 3 weeks after we moved into the house the master bath toilet and shower and guest bath toilet and shower backed up. One of those nails lodged in a curve of the main waste pipe and collected toilet paper causing a blockage. It was a lot more than $90 to get it fixed. That 4 year old is now 22.
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
@brenndatomu

Here's a different angle. You can see where it snapped and then a few dents where my son tried to fix it lol. Still works though...50 degree difference between the surface and the floor so that's good. Floor was getting up to 120 with the old one.

20210213_182054.jpg 20210213_183625.jpg 20210213_183709.jpg
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
I'd say wait a few days and you'll find something more interesting to care about.

Oh yea this is total OCD silliness. I already think it's kind of just a funny story. The kids or dog will do something tomorrow that will be of more interest!

Actually tomorrow is a big wood moving day. Gonna try and get all the splits in my driveway back to the wood stacks before/between snow showers. Too much snow for machines so I'm going to bust out the old faithful wheelbarrow.
 

gthomas785

Minister of Fire
Feb 8, 2020
501
Central MA
Wanna talk about heat shield OCD... My floor pitches back toward the wall so I had to choose between making my wall protector line up with the floor or line up with the wall. I went with the wall. Thought it would drive me nuts. But after a week I stopped seeing it.

IMG_20210213_185304.jpg
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
Oh yeah that would cause a major headache for a few days. As you said though, you eventually get over it.

I think you did the right thing by going with the wall versus the floor. You'll notice it less and it's warmer higher up too.
 

turbocruiser

Feeling the Heat
Jun 10, 2011
329
Rocky Mountains Majesty
Just in the hope it helps, this is the extension that I purchased. It is solid steel and powder-coated and it won't break no matter who falls on it.

 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
Just in the hope it helps, this is the extension that I purchased. It is solid steel and powder-coated and it won't break no matter who falls on it.


Thanks for the the thought but I'm not sure you read the post lol. That's the exact pad I had originally. It's a type 1/r=0 pad for ember protection only and I need a type2/r=1+ pad for some thermal protection for my floor.

It's a nice pad, looks sharp, and definitely will never break. Sad I had to give it up really but its just not what I need for my setup.
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
You could put the metal shield on top of the insulated one to cover the damage ;lol

I thought about that actually but they are shaped slightly differently so it looks strange and you could slam a toe on the edges. If they were identically shaped I'd have considered it for sure.
 

turbocruiser

Feeling the Heat
Jun 10, 2011
329
Rocky Mountains Majesty
Thanks for the the thought but I'm not sure you read the post lol. That's the exact pad I had originally. It's a type 1/r=0 pad for ember protection only and I need a type2/r=1+ pad for some thermal protection for my floor.

It's a nice pad, looks sharp, and definitely will never break. Sad I had to give it up really but its just not what I need for my setup.

Sorry, I really quickly read the post and apparently glanced right over the words that you completely clearly wrote "Ember King". DOH. Anyway, if you take the Ember King and use it as a template to trace over the insulating barrier you would want to use, it will work well and probably be safer than the broken one that you tried fixing. You can use either cement backer board or fire rated plywood to get the spec that you need. The problem that I see with the broken one that you tried fixing is that crease is cracked internally and that material therefore might not properly shield the floor from heat. I'm sure in a million years it would never cause a concern but, I think using the Ember King with an appropriate insulating material under it would look better and work better. Hope this helps.
 

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
That's a good idea. I wonder how thick a piece of cement board or fire rated ply I'd need to get an R = 1+. I could use stove paint to make the edged black to match the ember king.

I'll have to research this tonight when I have some time unless someone knows off hand. Thanks for the idea!
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
6,407
NE Ohio

Caw

Minister of Fire
May 26, 2020
968
Massachusetts
Yep you're right:

Screenshot_20210214-120120_Chrome.jpg


Now the question is would micore 160 + the Ember King on top be up to code for insurance purposes in case there was ever an accident? It seems like it should be but I'm not an expert.