Creosote leaking from new stove?

[char]

Hi,

I recently installed a stove in a small cabin. I did a lot research beforehand and was prepared to buy all the proper equipment -- stainless steel stove pipe, class A chimney, support box, storm collar, etc. etc.

I was working with a family member who didn't think we needed all that fancy stuff, and he went out and bought some galvanized pipe and insisted on just running that straight through the roof. He said it would be fine and the guy at the store also said it would be fine. I protested a lot and really didn't feel comfortable doing this, but he was quite persistent and said, "We'll do it my way, and if it doesn't work, we'll fix it later."

Well, it's two days later, and it doesn't work.

My family member insisted that we did not need to seal the pipe at all, which I strongly disagreed with. I wante to seal all the seams because this pipe did not look very airtight to me and I was worried about smoke leaking out. But we just used stove cement where the flue connects to the pipe, and left the seams without any sealant. And we used regular silicone where the pipe runs through the chimney flashing (I thought we should use hi-temp silicone but he said that was not necessary). The flashing was installed at the same time as the shingles and woven in.

I ran the stove for 6-8 hours yesterday without much trouble, except that the galvanized pipe turned white for about the first 12" above the flue -- the pipe temperature got up to 600-700 degrees at some point, and I'm sure it's not rated for that kind of heat. I read all about the dangers of zinc oxide, etc., but I also read that you need much higher temps to be concerned about that sort of thing.

Anyway, today at one point when getting the fire going, I smelled a foul smelling chemical odor which made me feel sick. I didn't see any smoke, and I heard that with new stoves you might get a smell from the paint curing, but I figured there might be smoke leaking through the seams in the stove pipe. I kept the fire running for another 4 hours, and at one point returned to the cabin to find a lot of brown/black sludge leaking from the middle of the stove pipe about 4 feet above the stove -- running all the way down the pipe and dripping onto the stove and floor.

I'm guessing this is creosote?

It smelled terrible and I put the fire out immediately.

A couple notes -- I was burning seasoned oak and maple. The stove pipe temp was between 300-500 degrees. The outside temp is cold today -- 20 degrees with strong wind gusts up to 40 mph. One of the windiest days I can remember in recent history. The smoke coming out of the chimney was running horizontally.

The chimney setup is: Stove > 4"->6" adapter > 2' galvanized pipe > 2' galvanized pipe > 5' galvanized pipe (going through roof flashing) > chimney cap

Anyway, this is my first experience with wood stoves and not a very good one. I'm really not sure what to do other than order some real chimney parts and install those -- but I could use any advice anyone has to give. Are there any other factors that could have caused this? I'm just really surprised to get so much gunk after just 1 day of burning.

I'm going to include pictures if possible. Sorry this is such a long post -- I'm a bit overwhelmed with this because it's very cold out and now I need to find a new place to sleep.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

I could be mistaken but I think your pipe is upside down....it does not go together like an exhaust on a car for air flow it goes the other way for creosote to go down with out leaking like it is...others will chime!

 

[RockyMtnHigh]

You need to ditch that galvanized pipe fast and get some real connector pipe and Class A chimney. You are asking for trouble if you don't.... such as burning your house down and/or poisoning yourself. Also male end down.... always. Otherwise creosote will leak out of the seem, down the pipe, and burn.

You need to assure your family member they are not allowed near any heating appliances from now on lol, and go back to the store that sold you that stuff and have that employee fired.

 

[Nick Mystic]

I second RockyMtnHigh's advice. That creosote leaking onto a hot stove can prove disastrous! Can't afford to cheap out on chimney parts without getting into trouble. You might want to double check all your clearances on the stove and pipe while you're at it. If that pipe you are using is single wall it looks awfully close to the ceiling joists.

 

[Firedancer]

"We'll do it my way, and if it doesn't work, we'll fix it later."


A job done wrong takes twice as long.

 

[Excavator]

pipe is upside down and wrong pipe as said above. Don't burn it any more like that

 

[char]

Thanks, you guys respond quick!

I'm wondering if some of the gunk leaking was stove cement (we put a bunch of it where the flue connects to the pipe, because it didn't seem like a very tight seal). That seems like an awful lot of creosote for just 1 day of burning.

Now I know more about wood stoves than I did 1 hour ago.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

I woldnt go too nuts fellows, I believe some galvanized pipe can be class A multi fuel pipe....I wait for experts on that though.

But char I'd hold off until you get experts advice..

 

[Hogwildz]

"We'll do it my way, and if it doesn't work, we'll fix it later."


A job done wrong takes twice as long.

Along the same lines as: "we do it nice, but we do it twice".

Your family member needs a boot up his arse.
The white stuff you see on the galvanized, is an indicator of the crap your breathing in.
Get the proper piping, period.

The creosote is a result of the uninsulated galvanized piping, and most likely wet wood.

 

[char]

Along the same lines as: "we do it nice, but we do it twice".

Your family member needs a boot up his arse.
The white stuff you see on the galvanized, is an indicator of the crap your breathing in.
Get the proper piping, period.

Yeah, I was a bit concerned when I cranked up the heat and the pipe turned white. Although there are two sides to the story: http://donkey32.proboards.com/thread/373/afraid-galvanized-pipe-anyways

We didn't really have a choice as to which way to install the pipe, because the 4->6 adapter and the chimney cap were designed to fit with the male ends of pipe going up.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

And for sure that wood is not "seasoned" else you would not have that creosote problem already. But that installation sounds like a total disaster. I would not recommend burning any more wood until that is fixed right. And use black pipe indoors. Outside you need some insulated class A pipe and 9' total for a chimney usually won't get the job done either.

 

[RockyMtnHigh]

I woldnt go too nuts fellows, I believe some galvanized pipe can be class A multi fuel pipe....I wait for experts on that though.

But char I'd hold off until you get experts advice..

Yes, galvanized outer wall, insulated and stainless inner, not galvanized single wall duct pipe.

 

[Sprinter]

Besides the pipe issue, I'm concerned that you are getting any liquid creosote at all. After you get the pipe situation resolved, take a close look at your wood, get a moisture meter and use it on a freshly split face. It needs to be 20 - 25% moisture content.

 

[jeff_t]

For sure, do it your way. That is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

Oh, yea I see now this may be just like duct pipe or something.... That's not good!

 

[char]

Besides the pipe issue, I'm concerned that you are getting liquid creosote at all. After you get the pipe situation resolved, take a close look at your wood, get a moisture meter and use it on a freshly split face. It needs to be 20 - 25% moisture content.

Yeah, I was very surprised at the amount of brown liquid leaking out. The wood has been sitting in a garage for 1 year.

 

[Hogwildz]

Yeah, I was a bit concerned when I cranked up the heat and the pipe turned white. Although there are two sides to the story: http://donkey32.proboards.com/thread/373/afraid-galvanized-pipe-anyways

We didn't really have a choice as to which way to install the pipe, because the 4->6 adapter and the chimney cap were designed to fit with the male ends of pipe going up.

I don't give a crap what that guy says or uses. If galvanized was acceptable and safe, everyone would be using it, and it would be acceptable by code.
If you get the proper stove pipe and class A up through the roof, the seams will be correct and the cap will fit just fine.
Male end always down as BG pointed out. Then all that creosote from that wet wood will stay in the pipe and run down into the stove, instead of all over the outside.
Your next issue will be a chimney fire if you don't get some good dry wood. And you don't want a chimney fire with that galvanized.
You came to the right place, and your getting very good advise. Do it right, make it safe, get some dry wood, and enjoy.

Depending on the wood, a year usually ain't long enough to dry.
I have some oak that is 2yrs cut, split and stacked, and it is not ready yet.

 

[firefighterjake]

There are times and places when you can be cheap . . . choosing McDonalds instead of the 4-star restaurant, opting to buy a 4-cylinder car vs. a 8-cylinder car, opting to vacation closer to home vs. going on that cruise.

Cheaping out when it comes to something that can burn your house down or fill your house with toxic gases is not one of those times.

 

[Sprinter]

We're beating you up pretty good here. But I'm really glad that you decided to post this thread. It's a very dangerous situation and your first instincts were right.

 

[Hogwildz]

Up top outside, when you run the right pipe, make sure you get a storm collar for it also. Just siliconing around the flashing to the pipe is asking for a leak.

And use the proper sized 6" pipe. Stepping up to 8" is only going to create draft issues.

 

[char]

Actually, the wood has only been sitting for 6 months, I just found out. So you're right -- not seasoned.

Believe me, I'm glad I posted this thread too. I was really stressed out about this project the whole time, because I wanted to do it properly and safely and it just didn't seem to be working out that way.

And thanks for the tip on the storm collar -- I did want to install one, but that didn't happen either.

 

[Hogwildz]

Sounds like you knew most of this before the install. Next time, insist on doing things properly.
It seems you knew the answers you were going to get, now your suspicions are confirmed.
Just going to guess it is an older gentleman that knows how to do everything....
Back 30 years ago this would have been done by many, today, not much.

May sound like some are harsh, but it is more passion to see that you are safe. And wanting you to enjoy the stove and the heat it brings to full potential.
You did right by seeking answers, now you know what to do.
When you get it set up right, post some pics of that set up.
Don't hesitate to ask questions. We all did exactly that at one time or another. And still do.

 

[char]

Sounds like you knew most of this before the install. Next time, insist on doing things properly.
It seems you knew the answers you were going to get, now your suspicions are confirmed.
Just going to guess it is an older gentleman that knows how to do everything....
Back 30 years ago this would have been done by many, today, not much.

May sound like some are harsh, but it is more passion to see that you are safe. And wanting you to enjoy the stove and the heat it brings to full potential.
You did right by seeking answers, now you know what to do.
When you get it set up right, post some pics of that set up.
Don't hesitate to ask questions. We all did exactly that at one time or another. And still do.

Hogwildz, you hit the nail right on the head.

And the gentleman in question is nearing 90 years old, an insanely hard working man who was up on the roof nailing down shingles and helped me build an entire cabin. So it was a delicate situation. And surely he installed plenty of these things back in the mid 1900s, and it was fine.

But I don't want to inhale poisonous fumes and burn to death in my sleep

 

[RockyMtnHigh]

You will need a new flashing as well... that one just won't be large enough for a class A chimney, no big deal though. Go to a qualified hearth retailer and they will set you up properly. Glad you made the thread before something terrible happened.

 

[jeff_t]

That appears to me to be 8" pipe, which would be the OD of 6" class A.

Are there plans for finishing the ceiling?